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General Ohio University Discussion/Alumni Events
Topic:  Flavortown,Ohio ?

Topic:  Flavortown,Ohio ?
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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/24/2020 6:37:11 AM 
There's a news blurb in today's The Record that says the City of Columbus has decided to remove his statue from outside city hall.

Now there's a chnage.org petition,where over 25000 people have signed on to say the city's name should be changed to Flavortown to honor Guy Fieri.




Last Edited: 6/24/2020 6:43:55 AM by rpbobcat

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/24/2020 1:25:50 PM 
It's now up to 77,000 signatures but I don't think you have to be from Columbus to sign it, so the weight this might have with Columbus officials is questionable. You can't see where the people who have signed the petition unless you sign it, and maybe not even then. The person who started the petition admits that they haven't read the city charter to find out what the process would be. It's just a publicity stunt. I think most people in Columbus really aren't for this, especially when they find out the cost to taxpayers for changing road signs, etc. and the general confusion it would cause.


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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/24/2020 4:41:57 PM 
My mother, being an ethnic Icelander, was always upset at the name of that city. She said the name should be changed to Eriksson, Ohio, and not named for that late comer who couldn't even read a map and was an infamously poor navigator. I think now would be the ideal time to put her plan in place. Anyone want to sign a petition?


"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/24/2020 6:58:10 PM 
If we’re renaming cities for the long-past sins of their namesakes now, how long has Athens got left?
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Mike Johnson
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/24/2020 10:43:37 PM 
Recommended read: Columbus - The Four Voyages. By Lawrence Bergreen. Exquisitely researched and very well written.

Before reading that book, I didn't realize how little I knew about Columbus. To say he was a complex man is no exaggeration.


http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 6/28/2020 5:03:04 PM 
Just thinking that if they do rename Columbus, they should just call it Capital City. (Although Cowtown is still my preference.) If they associate the new name with someone or some thing they run the risk of it having an offensive connotation in 20, 30 or 40 years.


We will get by.
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We will get by.
We will survive.

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OU_Country
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/1/2020 1:24:35 PM 
mf279801 wrote:
If we’re renaming cities for the long-past sins of their namesakes now, how long has Athens got left?


How long do several towns and states names have left? I'm all in favor of supporting equal rights, eliminating the Confederate Flag wherever possible, and taking down statues honoring terrible people. But where does it stop? Renaming cities and states, in my opinion, is off the reservation.

At the very least, at least I don't give tax money to ColumbusFlavortown any longer to have this decision really affect me all that much.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/1/2020 1:46:00 PM 
OU_Country wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
If we’re renaming cities for the long-past sins of their namesakes now, how long has Athens got left?


How long do several towns and states names have left? I'm all in favor of supporting equal rights, eliminating the Confederate Flag wherever possible, and taking down statues honoring terrible people. But where does it stop? Renaming cities and states, in my opinion, is off the reservation.

At the very least, at least I don't give tax money to ColumbusFlavortown any longer to have this decision really affect me all that much.


I'm not sure I see the point being made about Athens. Whose long-past sins are we referring to? Athena?

I also don't think there's a real push to rename Columbus, right? There's an online petition to name the city after Guy Fieri, of course, but before we talk about being "off the reservation" and tax money, I'd wait for a real ballot initiative, at the very least.

Also, ironic to use the phrase 'off the reservation' in this particular conversation, given that its origin is related to how being 'off the reservation' was dangerous for Native Americans. And you know, so was meeting Christopher Columbus.

But ultimately, I'm with you. That towns are named after Columbus is something I'm indifferent to. It's not like the geographic area has any actual connection to Columbus, nor do residents of Columbus feel any particular pride about the source of the name. At this point, it's just a name.
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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/1/2020 10:01:29 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
If we’re renaming cities for the long-past sins of their namesakes now, how long has Athens got left?


How long do several towns and states names have left? I'm all in favor of supporting equal rights, eliminating the Confederate Flag wherever possible, and taking down statues honoring terrible people. But where does it stop? Renaming cities and states, in my opinion, is off the reservation.

At the very least, at least I don't give tax money to ColumbusFlavortown any longer to have this decision really affect me all that much.


I'm not sure I see the point being made about Athens. Whose long-past sins are we referring to? Athena?

I also don't think there's a real push to rename Columbus, right? There's an online petition to name the city after Guy Fieri, of course, but before we talk about being "off the reservation" and tax money, I'd wait for a real ballot initiative, at the very least.

Also, ironic to use the phrase 'off the reservation' in this particular conversation, given that its origin is related to how being 'off the reservation' was dangerous for Native Americans. And you know, so was meeting Christopher Columbus.

But ultimately, I'm with you. That towns are named after Columbus is something I'm indifferent to. It's not like the geographic area has any actual connection to Columbus, nor do residents of Columbus feel any particular pride about the source of the name. At this point, it's just a name.


Slave empire: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_ancient_Greece...
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/1/2020 10:43:28 PM 
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.
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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/1/2020 11:53:13 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 7:16:26 AM 
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens
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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 9:02:59 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 9:29:03 AM 
mf279801 wrote:


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”


To be clear, I never said Athens took its name from Athena. I said "So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened." Though I wasn't super direct, I think the implication in sharing a name with Athens, Greece is that Athens, Ohio was named after the city, not Athena.

As for whether or not Athena is named after Athens or vice-versa, I'm still not sure I see why that's relevant to the discussion.

Columbus, Ohio is named to honor Christopher Columbus.

There's debate as to the origin of the name of Athens, Greece. It's either named to honor Athena, or it's name predates Athena and doesn't honor anybody in particular. In either case, my question still stands: if we were to rename Athens, OH, whose sins would we be disassociating ourselves from? The answer can either be a) Athena or b) the city of Athens, Greece.

If it's a) what are the sins?

If it's b) the precedent being set is that no place can be named after another place where bad things have happened. In this case, the bad thing is slavery. Slavery took place in cities all over the United States. If Athens, OH has to be re-named because of slavery in Athens, Greece what do we do with the American South? Rename the whole thing?

And for the record, I know you're not arguing in favor of a renaming here. I'm just pointing out that bad things happen pretty much everywhere. And there are plenty of people to name cities after who haven't raped and murdered thousands of people.



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Mike Johnson
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 11:23:24 AM 
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”


Just curious, as you live in Atlanta, are you aware that Atlanta is the third name for that city?

I live in North Canton. It was founded as New Berlin. The name was changed during WWI for reasons one can easily imagine and that are well-documented.


http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 11:40:54 AM 
Mike Johnson wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”


Just curious, as you live in Atlanta, are you aware that Atlanta is the third name for that city?

I live in North Canton. It was founded as New Berlin. The name was changed during WWI for reasons one can easily imagine and that are well-documented.


I was not aware of that, no. But then I’m not from Atlanta, nor do i much care for it (Ohio born and raised). What were it’s previous 2 names?
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Mike Johnson
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 12:39:31 PM 
mf279801 wrote:
Mike Johnson wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”


Just curious, as you live in Atlanta, are you aware that Atlanta is the third name for that city?

I live in North Canton. It was founded as New Berlin. The name was changed during WWI for reasons one can easily imagine and that are well-documented.


I was not aware of that, no. But then I’m not from Atlanta, nor do i much care for it (Ohio born and raised). What were it’s previous 2 names?


Marthasville and Terminus. My late wife Lynne was a southerner and I still have many family members in Douglasville, a city about 25 miles west of Atlanta.


http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author

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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 2:15:05 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


David McCulouhg's recent book "The Pioneers" ,a great read by the way,goes into a lot of detail about the the importance the Ohio Company placed on all levels of education.

They chose the name Athens for where O.U. would be located to honor the legacy of learning that came from Athens,Greece.
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RSBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 8:52:47 PM 
No chance in Hades that "Flavortown" ever happens.

Maybe something like "Adena" could resonate and work if it gets to choosing new city name?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adena_culture


RS Bobcat

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 9:51:23 PM 
rpbobcat wrote:


David McCulouhg's recent book "The Pioneers" ,a great read by the way,goes into a lot of detail about the the importance the Ohio Company placed on all levels of education.

They chose the name Athens for where O.U. would be located to honor the legacy of learning that came from Athens,Greece.


CSPAN occasionally runs interviews with and lectures by David McCullough. One was at the JFK Library in 2017. He was asked who was the most interesting person he ever researched and he responded that it was Manasseh Cutler. A big reason is that Cutler almost single-handedly successfully lobbied for the Northwest Ordinance, which assured that the Ordinance would promote public primary and secondary education, protect civil liberties, and prohibit slavery throughout the Territory. Ironically, in that same interview he discussed the pandemic of 2018 and how a similar pandemic today would kill more than a million Americans. In another show he discussed "Pioneers". The show was recorded at the Ohio Statehouse early last year, I think. He had great things to say about Ohio University and how he makes it a point to stop there if he can when he's in the neighborhood.

Last Edited: 7/2/2020 9:52:21 PM by Pataskala


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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RSBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/2/2020 10:05:48 PM 
Yes - Prior topic discussion thread...

http://www.bobcatattack.com/messageboard/topic.asp?FromPa...


RS Bobcat

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JSF
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/5/2020 1:55:24 AM 
"Terminus indeed."- W.T. Sherman


"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

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mf279801
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/5/2020 12:42:10 PM 
Mike Johnson wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Mike Johnson wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
mf279801 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
Right, but the city of Athens is still named after Athena. Who had nothing to do with the slavery (being fake and all). So in this case, we'd be renaming a town because it shares a name with a city where bad things happened. As opposed to a city whose name is honoring somebody who did bad things.


(A) Citation needed regarding the namesake for Athens Ohio: the city of Athens in Greece or Athena
(B) citation needed that the Greek city of Athena was named after Athena, rather than the reverse


Citation for (A): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens,_Ohio#:~:text=Previo... .

Citation for (B): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Athens


Great. Quoting from (A): “... Athens County was formed in 1805, named for the ancient center of learning, Athens, Greece.”

So...NOT named after the ancient goddess, but after the city.


And as to which is named after which (“is Athens Greece named for Athena or is Athēnâ named for Athens”), https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athens states that “In antiquity, it was debated whether Athens took its name from its patron goddess Athena ... or Athena took her name from the city.[20] Modern scholars now generally agree that the goddess takes her name from the city,[20] because the ending -ene is common in names of locations, but rare for personal names.[20]


Let me be clear, i do NOT think Athens should change its name, just like i don’t think that Columbus should change its name. This discussion is in direct response to the original premise for this thread (That Columbus should change its name to Flavortown)...and the simple pleasures of an etymology “fight”. Not to be confused with the simple pleasures of an entomology “fight”


Just curious, as you live in Atlanta, are you aware that Atlanta is the third name for that city?

I live in North Canton. It was founded as New Berlin. The name was changed during WWI for reasons one can easily imagine and that are well-documented.


I was not aware of that, no. But then I’m not from Atlanta, nor do i much care for it (Ohio born and raised). What were it’s previous 2 names?


Marthasville and Terminus. My late wife Lynne was a southerner and I still have many family members in Douglasville, a city about 25 miles west of Atlanta.



Neat, thanks for the history lesson!

Yep, Douglasville is just a few miles outside of Atlanta going West on I-20. There’s a Six Flags right by the highway there
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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/5/2020 5:15:37 PM 
mf279801 wrote:


Neat, thanks for the history lesson!

Yep, Douglasville is just a few miles outside of Atlanta going West on I-20. There’s a Six Flags right by the highway there


Been wondering whether Six Flags will have to change its name to Five Flags. The original park was Six Flags over Texas, referring to the national flags that have flown over Texas through the years -- Spain, France, Mexico, the Republic of Texas, United States, and the Confederacy. Since all things Confederate are being removed from public view, should Six Flags follow suit?


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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JSF
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Member Since: 1/29/2005
Location: Houston, TX
Post Count: 5,538

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  Message Not Read  RE: Flavortown,Ohio ?
   Posted: 7/5/2020 9:32:34 PM 
Yes.


"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

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