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Topic: RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Topic: RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

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The Optimist
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 12:10:54 PM

I firmly believe it isn't any ONE thing but rather a number of factors contributing to what we're seeing with the O Zone.

I agree with Shabamon and D.A. regarding the style of play... I think it is a factor. Look at the platinum seats, look at the rest of the arena and look at threads on this board. Fans, not just students, are skeptical of the style of play.
Not only is it different from the style Ohio basketball has played for years (decades) but it is also different from the "NBA" style that most fans (particularly younger people like students) are used to when they think of basketball.
Here's the KEY... While people are "meh" about the style now that becomes a complete non-issue if we start winning. In fact, if we do make the tournament under Saul I think this style of play actually starts working in our favor. Yeah, we still wouldn't have mind-numbing athleticism and powerful dunks, but Saul's teams score. If we really start to gel and start knocking down 3's this style of play means we could average 80 a night. Fans like scoring. Fans also like guys diving all over the floor "working hard" for loose balls and rebounds. Scoring+Effort+Winning is a decent recipe for getting fans excited.
I also agree that marketing Saul more would be a huge catalyst. That guy is hilarious. Just have him walk down Court Street sometime and strike up a conversation with some students. Easy money.

...

More specific to the O Zone and the challenges they are facing, I'd again state it's a number of factors contributing rather than any one thing in particular.

I sympathize with the struggles R.P. mentioned in talking about trying to create student interest. I was in the O Zone in the years immediately prior and the exact issues he dealt with were something I constantly felt like I was fighting a one-man battle against.

A major problem that has been slowly eroding the O Zone is the shirt towards it being more organized and structured by Ohio Athletics. Too much "hands on" management and "structured fun" for the students rather than an organic fan club with a passion for the team. Too much of a "corporate feel" as opposed to a "fun" environment that students want to be a part of.
Cell phones are definitely a major distraction. Students can look down at their phone at any moment and miss the game and cheers. (I catch myself doing this and I'm not a student anymore) If I were a leader in the O Zone today, my biggest priority would be to try to figure out some sort of way to engage students on their cellphones during the game. Something like this absolutely cannot come from the Athletic Department. Students aren't going to use something because you tell them to. It has to be something they want to do.
There are other issues that have really detracted from the overall feel of the O Zone. Beyond the Bobcat Black seats layering the students and killing the atmosphere, it also moved the cheerleaders to the baseline which really makes coordinating cheers between different sections a challenge. The short-term revenue boost the Bobcat Black seats provide are not worth the long-term erosion in stadium atmosphere. Our basketball games primary focus should creating an elite atmosphere which makes people want to come to games. Drive top-line growth of the fanbase will lead to a better bottom-line in the long-run.
One reason the 2008, 2009 and 2010 regular seasons were so fun in the O Zone despite the team not being great was because we had some solid MAC rivals. Kent and Akron were easy to hate. Bunch of thugs.
Rivalries are key and MAC games are key. People complain about the O Zone EVERY YEAR before break then the students return in the winter and it gets better. I guarantee the O Zone shows some signs of life in January and February.

The best thing anyone can do would be to start building hype against Groce. Has anyone from Kent or Buffalo been arrested recently?
The athletic department may not be thrilled with this type of rhetoric, but the feelings of the administration shouldn't be of any concern to O Zone members.

Last Edited: 12/12/2017 12:11:37 PM by The Optimist

I've seen crazier things happen.

The Optimist
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 12:23:05 PM

Chants I want to hear more of:
"Defense, castration, take that ball away"

Chants I want to hear less of:
"Bounce, bounce, pass"

I've seen crazier things happen.

Alan Swank
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Location: Athens, OH
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 12:24:26 PM

The Optimist wrote:

A major problem that has been slowly eroding the O Zone is the shirt towards it being more organized and structured by Ohio Athletics. Too much "hands on" management and "structured fun" for the students rather than an organic fan club with a passion for the team. Too much of a "corporate feel" as opposed to a "fun" environment that students want to be a part of.

My comment on this certainly won't help me land the recently posted bobcat club position but I agree 100%. Even though the intent may not be to impose something on the students, it's going to come across that way. It's gotten to the point much like a high school game, where the principal or an assigned teacher watches over the students at the game to make sure no one says or does anything "inappropriate." It's not quite as bad as the former principal at Joe's suburban Columbus school who stood on a ladder during a school dance to make sure there was no inappropriate dancing (true story and I have pictures). Kids will be kids and in my 38 years of going to games in the Convo, I can only remember one student ejection and that one was certainly no big deal.

Last Edited: 12/12/2017 12:26:16 PM by Alan Swank

shabamon
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 12:55:16 PM

Alan Swank wrote:

Kids will be kids and in my 38 years of going to games in the Convo, I can only remember one student ejection and that one was certainly no big deal.

And it was unwarranted, too!

GoCats105
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 1:02:37 PM

The Optimist wrote:

The Golden State Warriors are arguably the most popular team in the NBA right now. I wouldn't really consider their style of play "flashy." They pass well, move the ball and hit a TON of threes from deep. Maybe we need a Steph Curry type guy to pull up from 35 and can them every once in a while?

The Optimist
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 1:10:56 PM

GoCats105 wrote:

The Optimist wrote:

This was the remainder of that same paragraph you had quoted...

Quote:

Here's the KEY... While people are "meh" about the style now that becomes a complete non-issue if we start winning. In fact, if we do make the tournament under Saul I think this style of play actually starts working in our favor. Yeah, we still wouldn't have mind-numbing athleticism and powerful dunks, but Saul's teams score. If we really start to gel and start knocking down 3's this style of play means we could average 80 a night. Fans like scoring. Fans also like guys diving all over the floor "working hard" for loose balls and rebounds. Scoring+Effort+Winning is a decent recipe for getting fans excited.

I was definitely thinking of Golden State as I was typing... If we start hitting 3's (which is EXACTLY what Saul is trying to do with all these shooters) I think this issue solves itself.

One reason I remain incredibly excited about Saul Ball is because I think I can see what he is trying to do. We have a TON of shooters on this roster. If we start shooting really well from 3, which I think we can, this could get really fun really quick.

I've seen crazier things happen.

GoCats105
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 1:46:23 PM

The Optimist wrote:

GoCats105 wrote:

The Optimist wrote:

This was the remainder of that same paragraph you had quoted...

Quote:

Got it. My fault.

D.A.
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 2:17:01 PM

The Optimist wrote:

Cell phones are definitely a major distraction. Students can look down at their phone at any moment and miss the game and cheers. (I catch myself doing this and I'm not a student anymore) If I were a leader in the O Zone today, my biggest priority would be to try to figure out some sort of way to engage students on their cellphones during the game. Something like this absolutely cannot come from the Athletic Department.

For me, this really hits at one of the competitive disadvantages that amateur athletics has that professional athletics has been able to exploit. The proliferation of fantasy sports leagues (and by extension, betting in fantasy leagues) has enabled professional sports to keep its fans hooked, and those who participate in this are seemingly addicted to tracking their fantasy performance as much as they track their social media feeds.

I don't participate in fantasy leagues, but if they were smart, the MAC should research and vet out the viability of establishing a non-betting, fantasy platform that incorporated all member institution's athletes. It would spur more inter-institution familiarity, and be a way to expand the fan's engagement in rival institutions and their players.

The Few, The Proud, The Bobcats!

And for the record, I hate tOSU, and Ricordati and Torgerson are DB's.

"This isn't just another walkover from the MAC." Kirk Herbstreit, another DB, on College Football Gameday

OhioCatFan
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 3:17:47 PM

The Optimist wrote:

. . .One reason I remain incredibly excited about Saul Ball is because I think I can see what he is trying to do. We have a TON of shooters on this roster. If we start shooting really well from 3, which I think we can, this could get really fun really quick.

It's uncanny how you get inside my head sometimes. This is exactly what I've been thinking since Saul got here. I could see where he was going, but it's been frustrating that it's taken so long to get there. I think he inherited a mess that it's taking him longer to clean up than we might recognize from the outside. I think now he's close to having the kind of team he wants, but still may be a player or two away. That BigManz he has recruited for next year, I think will be a real key.

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

The Optimist
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 3:54:45 PM

D.A. wrote:

The Optimist wrote:

That's interesting.

I've always played season-long fantasy leagues but have never really been addicted the point where I am compulsively checking my lineups during games. With Daily Fantasy Sports (Fanduel and Draftkings) I am very much addicted to checking my lineups during games.

Note-College football and college basketball did have DFS a year or two ago. Fanduel and Draftkings came to an agreement with the NCAA to phase these out due to concerns over player lawsuits... (NCAA worried about Unions and Fanduel/Draftkings worried about regulators classifying them as gambling)
As I understand it, there wasn't ever laws passed specifically saying you couldn't have DFS on amateur events... DFS for college football was actually one of my favorites, because not many people knew as much about random midweek MACtion games as I did. I don't know how you could capitalize on that, but there is definitely an opportunity there.

From a collaboration standpoint, I think the O Zone would benefit from something like Slack or Microsoft Teams.

OhioCatFan wrote:

The Optimist wrote:

Great minds think alike! (or we both enjoy green kool-aid)

I've seen crazier things happen.

bshot44
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 4:12:11 PM

OhioCatFan wrote:

The Optimist wrote:

I wouldn't classify it as a mess ... just wasn't his kind of players that fit his system. There were messy components ... but it wasn't like he inherited what is going on over at Fiami

cbus cat fan
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 7:37:04 PM

With all due respect, there is no magic marketing bullet that will solve this. In my previous post of yesterday, I talked about high school programs who had infectious student sections. I may add to that the University of Dayton which has always had a raucous crowd. Yet outside of those two points of investigation, there really isn't anything you can do.

Let me explain, when I was a avid kid TV watcher in the 70s and 80s, you could ask any other person your age about Happy Days, the Brady Bunch, Good Times etc and whether the other kids liked those shows, they knew what you were talking about and could possibly fill you in on a missing episode. Try doing that with a TV show now. Why, because there are literally hundreds of different options instead of three broadcast stations.

Kids today have many options. For the casual student sports fan watching college basketball without some sort of big game or celebrity hype just won't get the crowds that would once came to mid-major games. Honestly, I wonder how many of the Cameron Crazies who recently graduated from Duke, even keep up with the ins and outs of the ACC now that they are away from campus. It certainly isn't unique to us, it is where our society is at this moment in time.

Last Edited: 12/12/2017 7:39:04 PM by cbus cat fan

Alan Swank
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 7:59:28 PM

cbus cat fan wrote:

Go back a decade or two and those of us from Northeast Ohio had 3, 5 and 8 and maybe 43 - WUAB and of course Drew and I had channel 25 in Akron. That was it. There was a commonality to the teen experience. Way back in 1987 Springsteen said at Harry Chapin's Congressional Gold Medal concert, "today, I've got my music, the guy down the street has his . . ." That's the way it is today - individualization and a fractured (no value judgement) society. We're not going back to the days of 211 Pine Street.

BobcatSports
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 10:13:50 PM

I�m old school and I�m saddened by the outright apathy with the student bodies of today�s Universities. I�m also a realist and with the multi-million dollar boondoggle example of Akron�s Infocision stadium, I seriously doubt a streaming new hanging scoreboard will have the student body streaming into the Convo. I think this new reality of students not interested in attending athletic events may eventually force University powers to be to question why it makes sense to pour major bucks into programs that generates such student apathy.

I don�t think Saul�s style of play matters one iota as to the lack of students not attending. He�s not exactly playing Stoll-ball. He�s had the Curry-type launching up 35ft 3�s (Bean) admittingly with far different results. He�s had 2 impact type guys (Ndour and Tony) and he�s had a crowd pleasing �character� type in Treg. None of this has led to having to utilize Stub-hub to secure a ticket to the Convo.

I don�t think Saul-stale pretzels-Convo exterior lighting-scoreboards, etc., have the slightest impact on student attendance. IF they don�t give a whit about supporting THEIR team all the freebies and bribing in the world won�t change that. Just the new reality and we are not alone in this reality.

Bobcat Jerry
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/12/2017 10:46:25 PM

Entertaining basketball has a chance with team continuity "sorely lacking" by devastating injury and player transfers. This can change with better player selection out of high school and careful junior college players making a good team better. The seats will once again fill the convo.

Lets not forget many game are now on ESPN 3. Smart phones compete for our undivided attention
in all venues of entertainment. From coffee houses to the NFL game..... humans seem easily distracted at the opportunity to multi task and lack discipline to do just one thing for 40 minutes.

Just saying ........

Last Edited: 12/12/2017 10:50:00 PM by Bobcat Jerry

Only one OHIO
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/14/2017 11:20:17 AM

I remember a post about this last year and someone said just call it a "-fest" and the students will attend. That's probably not far off. I don't think its the style of play, its just that its not the "thing to do" for the casual fan. Winning would certainly help but all the suggestions from lighting the convo to making a better game day feel are spot on IMO. They need to publicize the game and make the convo the cool place to be.

When the Indians sold out 455 straight games it was the perfect storm of the of a winning team, Jacobs Field being new then the Browns leaving. In short, it was the place to be for die hard and causal fans. Now, despite a great team and great players, it still takes a long winning streak or a summer weekend to sell out a smaller stadium.

Certainly, less people watch sports now. I maybe missed one home basketball game in my four years at Ohio while my daughter, a senior, has yet to attend one. However, if they can take some of the bobcatattack suggestions or borrow working ideas from other schools, I think student attendance can turn around.

OhioStunter
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 2:54:58 PM

Did anyone see the highlights of the Baylor basketball game last night? Sparse crowd. Even with Baylor in the Top 25. I don't think this is just an Ohio or a Saul-ball issue.

shabamon
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 3:06:51 PM

OhioStunter wrote:

Did anyone see the highlights of the Baylor basketball game last night? Sparse crowd. Even with Baylor in the Top 25. I don't think this is just an Ohio or a Saul-ball issue.

Yep: https://twitter.com/KristinTangel/status/941100306489925632

Pataskala
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 4:38:07 PM

I noticed a stark change in the student section at my son's high school football games this year, and I don't think it was just the difference between having a winning season and having a losing one. I think it was the athletics department's decision to relocate the band. Last year, the student section was much more into the game. The band sat next to them and they would often play off each other to create enthusiasm. This year the band sat at one end zone and half the time you didn't know either the band or the students were there. For most games, after halftime the band would interact with the other school's band -- battle of the drumline, etc. -- and ignore the student section and even what was going on with the game. The student section was pretty silent for most games. I guess most students need a catalyst to get involved in a game. It's often not a reflection on the team, but on the decisions of the athletics department. You do have to make the event the cool place to be and give students a way to be involved.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

Jeff McKinney
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 8:33:35 PM

OhioStunter wrote:

Did anyone see the highlights of the Baylor basketball game last night? Sparse crowd. Even with Baylor in the Top 25. I don't think this is just an Ohio or a Saul-ball issue.

Exactly! I was going to post the same thing about the Baylor game. Also, I caught parts of the Northwestern Valpo game. I realize it was played at Rosemont rather than in Evanston, but the attendance was sparse there too.

Jeff McKinney
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 8:35:53 PM

Is the downturn in student attendance permanent, or is interest cyclical ?

cbus cat fan
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/15/2017 9:27:33 PM

Jeff, I don't think it is permanent but it will cause great consternation for a while. I think once the initial technology boom winds down, there will be a natural swing back to group activities.

I recently read an interesting article which stated that the Godfather's unimaginable success in the early 1970s (Godfather I 1972, Godfather II 1974) was not only due to the great acting and story lines, but it also had to do with unity (even though it done through violence.) Besides power and control what was the Godfather others other themes? The other themes consisted of; family, unity and tradition, which went against the grain of the early 1970s.

Perhaps someday (hopefully not too long) people will long for unity and group activities, perhaps then live sporting events will make a comeback. However, it make take a while and involve a lot of upheaval before that happens.

Last Edited: 12/15/2017 9:29:01 PM by cbus cat fan

BillyTheCat
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/16/2017 6:12:22 AM

I bet that if we built a new downtown arena that is closer to the central hub of activity that we would see a revival in interest.

Diamond Cat
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/16/2017 6:20:51 AM

Use technology to engage with mobile devices during the game. It's a cheap add on to the Wi-Fi Network that already exists. You can push messages to students during the game and create interaction via an App that could be developed by the students. It's happening now in large public venues and entertainment districts.

Alan Swank
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RE: Rest in Peace Ozone, 2001 - 2017

Posted: 12/16/2017 12:03:42 PM

Diamond Cat wrote:

Sorry for the double post.

Last Edited: 12/16/2017 12:18:37 PM by Alan Swank

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