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Topic: RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Topic: RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

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Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/22/2014 11:46:24 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

That's extremely true except it's not in at least four ways, any number of which are very meaningful.

1) Babers will doubtless realize that it would be good to shore up his defense and will likely do so.

2) Who says you can't win in MAC very significantly on offense alone?

3) Especially in light of recent events, he has a recruiting advantage that very few head coaches can match--that advantage could be very meaningful for a significant cohort of recruits.

4) He has another recruiting advantage in that he seems to be a really good, winning coach. That is attractive.

At this point, BG's the clear favorite. For reasons.

OCF--do you want to bump this or should I do it?

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Bcat2
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/22/2014 11:58:22 PM

Moving on. NIU or Marshall?

I like NIU.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Mark Lembright '85
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 10:39:02 AM

I think NIU has a very good shot in this game. They just strike me as being very mentally tough and very disciplined. I think NIU wins this game.

L.C.
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 12:49:10 PM

I think Marshall had their down game, and will be ready for this one.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

OhioCatFan
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 8:56:39 PM

Monroe, I'll let you bounce the thread, but I'll await your analysis of the Herd taking NIU to the woodshed.

[OCF guess of Monroe's central theme: MAC sucks, NIU bad, OHIO gets no credit for close game against them. All coaches in the East Division are better than Solich. West is much better than East. We can't win the East, therefore, we are crummy and going down hill. The sky is falling and Peden is the epicenter of this meteorological disaster. Fire Solich and hire a young, aggressive coach who can recruit Florida, California and the planet of Mars.]

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Mark Lembright '85
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 9:33:26 PM

Mark Lembright '85 wrote:

I think NIU has a very good shot in this game. They just strike me as being very mentally tough and very disciplined. I think NIU wins this game.

Uh yeah, never mind.......

Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 10:51:47 PM

One must be realistic and reasonably objective about their team. On the basketball threads, I think that those who post pretty much are realistic, even as the realism is flavored by hope or despair.

In contrast, the main core on these football threads vastly overestimates the foot-ball program.

Ten years and no MACC and year eleven looking like more of the same. Being a mediocre team in a horrid division of a bad conference--does not necessarily lead to the conclusion that we are a good team and on the right track.

I agree with me.

And so do you.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/23/2014 10:53:08 PM

Yeah, but if we'd've prevailed at crunch time vs. NIU, then we'd've beaten NIU.

(I had a free moment so thought I'd do the favor of posting obo the apolgists, the dreamers.)

OhioCatFan
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 12:01:07 AM

OhioCatFan wrote:

. . . MAC sucks, NIU bad, OHIO gets no credit for close game against them. All coaches in the East Division are better than Solich. West is much better than East. We can't win the East, therefore, we are crummy and going down hill. The sky is falling and Peden is the epicenter of this meteorological disaster. Fire Solich and hire a young, aggressive coach who can recruit Florida, California and the planet of Mars.]

I, hereby, congratulate myself on doing Monroe better than Monroe. I hate to say it, amigo, but you are slipping. Not the talent there that I used to see. No fire in the belly anymore. By next season, I expect you to recruit a better posting persona. I'd recommend an assistant from the fertile recruiting field of http://mybacksass.blogspot.com. Now, those neo-Confederates know how to post a good rant. ;-)

Last Edited: 12/24/2014 1:00:34 AM by OhioCatFan

Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 12:35:55 AM

You are a much better me than I am! There's no denying that!

OhioStunter
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 1:03:10 AM

OhioBobcat wrote:

BG with an incredible finish tonight for the win! Falcons lead almost the entire way before falling behind for the first time with about a minute to go then score on a bomb! Nice win for the MAC as WMU lost tonight. I don't think the MAC even won a bowl last year. Congrats Falcons.

Even worse, since 2012, the MAC is 4-12 in bowl games.

L.C.
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 6:54:56 AM

OhioStunter wrote:

OhioBobcat wrote:

Even worse, since 2012, the MAC is 4-12 in bowl games.

Looks like 3-12 to me since the NIU win in 2012 was in January, and thus part of the 2011 season.
http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/mac/bowls...

Prior to 2006 the MAC has a record of 23-20 in bowls. Once the number of bowl games started going crazy, the MAC has only had one year with a winning record in bowls, 2011, and from 2006-2015 the MAC is 11-30

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Bobcatbob
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 8:31:22 AM

L.C. wrote:

Prior to 2006 the MAC has a record of 23-20 in bowls. Once the number of bowl games started going crazy, the MAC has only had one year with a winning record in bowls, 2011, and from 2006-2015 the MAC is 11-30

So, one has to ask; who is the victim here? The facts support what I think we all know. More bowls means more mediocre teams in bowls. When half of those mediocre teams are recruited from mediocre conferences (yes, that's us) the results are going to be - well - mediocre, for all concerned.

End the nonsense. Boycott the Famous Boca Raton Puerto Rico Yankee Can't Even Get a Sponsor Poulan ESPN Eater Bowl and Craft Fair.

L.C.
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 9:48:12 AM

Bobcatbob wrote:

So, one has to ask; who is the victim here?..

Does their have to be a victim?

ESPN gets more content
Fans get a steady flow of games so that there is always some game on
Universities get the advertising and exposure that comes from bowl games
Coaches get more practices
Players get swag, and get to see some new places and sights
Cities get tourism
Travel agents get more business
Fans get vacations

...and, that's why these games keep proliferating.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

OU_Country
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 12:33:47 PM

Bobcatbob wrote:

L.C. wrote:

I boycott most of the bowl games by simply choosing instead to watch holiday hoops, soccer of any kind, or the NBA. I don't understand what on earth possesses people to spend four hours watching a completely pointless bowl game, with schools they don't care about?

If ESPN and those organizing bowls want me to take them more seriously and actually tune in, the first thing they'll have to do is make 7 or 8 wins be the measure for being "Bowl Eligible".

Tyler
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 1:45:21 PM

Western Kentucky is blowing out CMU 42-14 at the half. Looks like the MAC will fall to 1-3 in bowls with Toledo a slight favorite over Arkansas State in Mobile.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 2:22:20 PM

Clearly OHIO is one of the great programs in college football today, only losing to the best of teams.

Don't change.

Paul Graham
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 2:26:51 PM

I love this nonsense idea that universities get ANYTHING out of appearing in meaningless bowl games (or weekday ESPN games for that matter). The only people that care outside of current/former Bobcats are football junkies. Has anyone ever watched one of our games and thought...boy that Jovon Johnson is a great linebacker...I wonder what their Electrical Engineering program is like if they can produce a linebacker of this quality!!!!

I noticed this year that Miami's applications are up 12% from last year and they are boasting their most academically accomplished incoming class yet. They don't seem to be negatively impacted by years of awful sports teams.

Last Edited: 12/24/2014 2:27:44 PM by Paul Graham

bornacatfan
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 3:47:26 PM

what a finish Central Michigan had to close out the game. One point. Wisdom says to take PAT and go to OT but you got to admire a coach that goes for 2. Incredible comeback down 42 14. Great stuff

never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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L.C.
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 5:31:08 PM

Paul Graham wrote:

I love this nonsense idea that universities get ANYTHING out of appearing in meaningless bowl games ...

As a person in business, I can tell you that one of the hardest things is to determine the value of advertising. Every name mention has value. A chance to air a full commercial, and tell a little of the "Ohio story" has even more value. The question, though, is how many people are watching? How many people are off getting a beer, or only paying a little attention? How do you know? Obviously the the value is > 0, but how much greater?

A quote that a former poster used to include as a signature comes from advertising pioneer John Wanamaker: "Half the money I spend on advertising is wasted; the trouble is I don't know which half." That quote accurately reflects the difficulty of quantifying the value.

To me the wisest thing I have ever heard about advertising is that advertising is nothing more than accelerated word of mouth. If they advertise, a business with a good product will achieve success sooner and greater than if they don't, and a business with a poor product will fail faster.

I've seen many examples to prove this wisdom. I've seen businesses advertise heavily, get a lot of customers, but generate no repeat business, and fail fast. I've also seen businesses start up, advertise heavily, and go gangbusters. At the other end, I've seen businesses with a good product do no advertising, and succeed, but do so slowly and quietly, and businesses with a bad product do no advertising, and muddle along quietly for a long time before closing.

Applying that to Ohio, the name mentions, and a good ad, run along with the games will definitely generate increased national awareness of Ohio. After that, it's up to the admissions department to close the sale, and up to the faculty and administration to do the rest.

Sports is simply one way to advertise, and to increase name awareness. There are many others. Schools like M.I.T., Harvard, Yale, and U. Chicago find ways to be in the news all the time, and that accomplishes the goal as well. The place where you don't want to end up, though, is like some sleepy schools that aren't in the news much, and don't participate in sports. Those are the schools that you see slipping towards irrelevance and failure.

Advertising that is just a feel-good general message is the type least likely to be effective. Instead it should attempt to create or enhance a specific brand image. If you want to advertise the University in connection to sports, and you want to know if it is doing any good, suppose you used "Ohio University, a leader is Sports Management education". Next make a commercial that focuses solely on the sports management program, and its successes. Then, if the ads are working, you should see a significant bump in interest in that one program. Alternately you could promote Ohio/Scripps, and see if there is an impact there.

Last Edited: 12/24/2014 5:39:40 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

OhioCatFan
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 8:40:51 PM

L.C. wrote:

. . . .Advertising that is just a feel-good general message is the type least likely to be effective. Instead it should attempt to create or enhance a specific brand image. If you want to advertise the University in connection to sports, and you want to know if it is doing any good, suppose you used "Ohio University, a leader is Sports Management education". Next make a commercial that focuses solely on the sports management program, and its successes. Then, if the ads are working, you should see a significant bump in interest in that one program. Alternately you could promote Ohio/Scripps, and see if there is an impact there.

Overall, an excellent post with solid ideas; but, I think this paragraph is particularly on spot. Many, if not most, of the college PSAs you see during timeouts of sports events that are being televised are "feel-good messages with very little specificity of the type L.C. talks about. I think the two examples that he mentions would be very good ideas for OHIO to try. Spotlighting Sports Management during a sporting event just makes so much sense. I don't recall us ever doing that though. Why not?

Pataskala
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/24/2014 10:34:27 PM

It's too bad that more fans didn't show up to see a great finish. They claimed 13,667 but that would mean there were 13,655 were sitting on the press box side of the field. Looked like WKU brought maybe a dozen people.

We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

OhioStunter
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/25/2014 1:04:45 AM

OhioCatFan wrote:

L.C. wrote:

Just imagine the vitriol from some of the academic community about why an "athletic" major was featured in a TV ad. I don't disagree with the suggestion or assessment, but I think we all know why this really wouldn't happen.

L.C.
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/25/2014 10:19:02 AM

OhioStunter wrote:

But, since they think the ads are worthless anyway, why should they care? ;)

Really, those were just examples. The process is:
1. Identify a competitive advantage that you wish to feature
2. Find a way to express it that is concise, catchy, and favorable
3. Figure out a way to convey that in a commercial that efficiently gets that message to viewers/listeners

The Sports Management program seems like a logical fit since most likely viewers have an interest in sports. The Scripps journalism program is another logical thing to advertise. Another idea would be to feature the 110, and talk about the Music program. There are no doubt many more ideas. The one thing to avoid is a general spot that makes Ohio sound like "just another nice university". The whole point is that, after viewing the spot, a segment of the viewers should react "now that's a program I should look into!" or "now that's a school that is doing things".

As you watch the bowls this season, watch the commercials for the various schools. Some will be general spots, that leave you with the impression "what a pretty campus", or "oh, that's nice". Others will feature some specific program, say "animal husbandry" for an Ag school. Still others will feature the school as, say, a top R&D powerhouse, leaving you the impression of a highly competent faculty.

The schools that do ads of the first type will indeed find that their ads are of limited value, while those with ads of the second type will find they get value from them. To a certain extent they can even be self-fulfilling. For example, a school that promotes their R&D may attract faculty interested in R&D, and may even attract R&D contracts.

Merry Christmas to all.

Last Edited: 12/25/2014 10:19:21 AM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Monroe Slavin
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RE: MAC Teams in the Bowls

Posted: 12/26/2014 9:34:43 PM

Bcat2 wrote:

Moving on. NIU or Marshall?

I like NIU.

Since OCF didn't do his job of being me here (ha!), I have to call this out. Maybe your assessments aren't always so good Bcat2--no MAC title in 10 years, despite half the league always being horrid and the rest not so good.

I presume that you now acknowledge the need for something to change. (Yeah, like that would ever happen.)

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