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Topic: Schedule Question?

Topic: Schedule Question?

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Bobcat1996
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Schedule Question?

Posted: 6/30/2018 1:57:11 PM

Would Bobcat fans prefer a schedule like Bowling Green, Eastern or Central Michigan playing at least 10 Saturday games or the 2018 schedule that has Ohio playing only seven Saturday games? I am guessing many fans want more Saturday games. I prefer more Saturday games. However, BG, Eastern and Central are forecast to finish in the lower half of the MAC standings and evidently ESPN thinks that way also as they aren't featured on many week night games. Most preseason experts forecast NI, Toledo, Ohio, Buffalo and Miami to be near the top of the MAC and ESPN has them playing at least four games not on Saturday.

UpSan Bobcat
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 6/30/2018 2:24:08 PM

Bobcat1996 wrote:

You're right that Ohio's success over the last decade has led to more of these midweek games. The good teams get put on TV. It's good for that but bad for fans who want to go to games.

Campus Flow
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 6/30/2018 2:32:32 PM

Since there is no exit fee in the MAC would it make sense to stick basketball in the MVC, go independent in football and cut our own streaming contract with Amazon Prime? Go back to 5 home games on Saturday but play a loaded schedule with a couple of P5's in Peden every year.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

Alan Swank
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/1/2018 5:14:52 PM

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

You're right that Ohio's success over the last decade has led to more of these midweek games. The good teams get put on TV. It's good for that but bad for fans who want to go to games.

Hate to say it but if you think the average person watching these midweek games tunes in because the team or teams might have a good record, you are fooling yourself. Other than diehard fans of the school, the only folks watching are those who would watch anything on tv that moves.

Pataskala
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 12:48:11 PM

Uncle Wes wrote:

I hope you're joking because going independent in football is suicide, unless you happen to be a well-established former national powerhouse that has always been independent and has had its own TV deal with a major national network for almost 30 years. Since indies don't have any conference TV or bowl money to rely on, they wind up needing paycheck games vs "P"s on the road. Look at the schedules the non-Notre Dame indies have this season:

BYU: Home -- Cal, McNeese St, Utah St, Hawaii, NIU, NMSU; Road: Arizona, Wisc, Wash, Boise, UMass, Utah. Five "P"s on the schedule, but only one at home.

Army: Home -- Liberty, Hawaii, Fiami, Air Force, Lafayette, Colgate; Road: Duke, Okla, Buffalo, San Jose, EMU; Neutral: Navy. Two "P"s, both on the road.

UMass: Home -- Duquesne, Charlotte, USF, Coastal Carolina, Liberty, BYU; Road: BC, Georgia Southern, FIU, Ohio, UConn, Georgia. Two "P"s, both on the road.

I don't think any of these home schedules would cause enough additional fans to flock to Peden on six Saturdays to make up for the TV and bowl money we get from the MAC. And even if we had a winning season, we would have to scrounge for a bowl bid, unless we were to have a stand-alone bowl deal like BYU and Army (UMass doesn't). Although more bowl games are planned for 2020, some current bowls might no longer exist.

Besides, we'd have to be invited to the MVC for basketball. Has one come in the mail?

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GoCats105
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 12:50:31 PM

Pataskala has it correct. BYU is even regretting their independent decision so much they've thought about going back to the Mountain West. And I think I read somewhere that Army could join Navy in the AAC.

Last Edited: 7/2/2018 12:51:29 PM by GoCats105

ou79
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 12:55:03 PM

I agree with Pataskala on the MVC invite. For Ohio it would not be an automatic thing. As a matter of fact, I am not sure one would even be extended to Ohio. We are not in the MVC footprint or anywhere near it. Also, we do not sit in a major metropolitan area.

Bobcat1996
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 2:58:38 PM

The majority of the fans would prefer Saturday games. However the coaching staff is able to point out to prospective recruits that Ohio is on ESPN much of the last month of the season and that seems to help recruiting. Maybe LC can research to see if the Bobcats have improved recruiting wise since the MAC started these mid week night TV games?

OhioCatFan
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 2:59:49 PM

And, as an independent, we would, I think, not get any playoff money. As it stands now the MAC gets $12,000,000 a year from the playoff pool, which theoretically, gets sent to each school on an equal basis, after, I suppose, the MAC rakes off some kind of a "service fee" or something. This is a lot of money for a G5 school. Of course, the P5 conferences all get a heck of a lot more loot from the playoff system, but for our program that's a big chunk of change. I think we'd be totally out of the loop as an independent unless our name was changed to the University of Notre Dame! ;-)

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L.C.
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 4:53:53 PM

Bobcat1996 wrote:

It's impossible to answer that because recruiting rankings are essentially meaningless at the 2-star and lower 3-star level. Very little effort goes into evaluating and rating those players because the ratings service gets no revenue from it. Their revenue comes largely from subscribers who are fans of the top 30 teams, and so that's where they, justifiably, put their effort. Note that the Ohio players who have been drafted have generally been unheralded, and un-ranked. Here are some ratings of players:
2003 - McRae - unrated
2004 - Cohen - unrated
2005 - Mitchell - Scout 1 star, Rivals 5.1 (an average rating back then)
2006 - Price - Scout 2 stars, Rivals 5.3 (both good ratings at the time)
2007 - Brazill - Scout 1 star, Rivals 5.0 (both= unrated)
2008 - Herman - Scout 1 star, Rivals 5.1 (both low/unrated)
2008 - Carrie - Scout 1 star, Rivals 5.1 (both low/unrated)
2012 - B. Brown - Scout 2 stars, Rivals 5.2 (both minimums for that time)
2013 - Poling - Scout 2 stars, Rivals 5.2 (both minimums)
2013 - Basham - Scout 2 stars, Rivals 5.4 (better, but still 2 stars)

Not a single 3 star recruit among the players drafted.

The only real way to measure it is to look at the MAC as a whole, and see if they are more competitive now than previously. I see a couple ways to measure that. First, is the MAC more competitive in bowls than in the past? Here's the bowl record:
2017 1-4 (0-1 versus P5)
2016 0-6 (0-2 versus P5)
2015 3-4 (0-1 versus P5)
2014 2-3
2013 0-5 (0-1 versus P5)
2012 2-5
2011 4-1 (0-1 versus P5)
2010 2-2 (0-1 versus P5)
2009 1-4 (0-1 versus P5)

If there is a trend, it's in the wrong direction.

Next, let's look as average MAC Sagarin ratings. Is the MAC becoming more competitive in the landscape of football? If we exclude Temple and UMass, and look at the core 12 MAC teams, the league averages have been:

2017 59.16
2016 59.86
2015 60.66
2014 57.26
2013 58.13
2012 61.39
2011 61.61
2010 57.36
2009 60.00
2008 61.26
2007 58.42
2006 61.84
2005 63.09
2004 57.71
2003 64.51

Once again, I see nothing here to indicate that the MAC has improved since the mid-week games began.

Last Edited: 7/2/2018 5:11:49 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Bobcat1996
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 8:14:39 PM

Next, let's look as average MAC Sagarin ratings. Is the MAC becoming more competitive in the landscape of football? If we exclude Temple and UMass, and look at the core 12 MAC teams, the league averages have been:

2017 59.16
2016 59.86
2015 60.66
2014 57.26
2013 58.13
2012 61.39
2011 61.61
2010 57.36
2009 60.00
2008 61.26
2007 58.42
2006 61.84
2005 63.09
2004 57.71
2003 64.51

Once again, I see nothing here to indicate that the MAC has improved since the mid-week games began.

Last Edited: 7/2/2018 5:11:49 PM by L.C.

Thanks LC as that info is helpful. Now if the MAC office could relay that info to ESPN/MAC AD's and the powers that be that decide the TV games, maybe the league could get back to more Saturday games?

L.C.
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 8:34:04 PM

There are lots more questions you could ask. For example, if the point of being on TV is to connect alums to the school, have MAC schools seen a boost in giving to their general fund from being on TV more? If the point is to increase exposure to more potential students, and attract better students, have average test scores gone up or down across the MAC? If the point is to get TV revenue, have athletic deficits increased or decreased since the start of mid-week MACtion?

BTW, it's entirely possible that mid-week games do increase the quality of recruits, but that they are also disruptive enough to their schedule that they hurt the performance by an offsetting amount. The point is, there are many possible objectives, and it's hard to know which have been accomplished, if any.

I personally would prefer if the mid-week games went away, and were replaced by Saturday games, with many/most of them on ESPN+, and only rarely being on broadcast TV. I don't know what that would do to the budget, though. It might mean they had to have one more "money game" a year, meaning a road game against a P5 team for money, and thus there might only 5 home games a year, one of them being an FCS team.

Last Edited: 7/2/2018 9:02:37 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Campus Flow
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 11:39:41 PM

Alan Swank wrote:

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

You're right that Ohio's success over the last decade has led to more of these midweek games. The good teams get put on TV. It's good for that but bad for fans who want to go to games.

The sport bar industry. There are 325 million people in this country. If you figure 1 sports bar per every 2500 people that means you automatically have 130,000 viewers for the game. Numbers for midweek games run anywhere from 260,000 to 600,000 so they are baking in a lot of always on TV sets.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

Campus Flow
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/2/2018 11:58:06 PM

OhioCatFan wrote:

Then add the MAC TV money on top of this plus bonus money. If its 25-30 million dollars split 12 ways that is 2 to 2.5 million in TV money that has to be accounted for in any new scheduling model. Payday games these days however pay upwards of 2 million. Ohio goes independent and could schedule an extra pay day game or two to make up for the loss of TV money. Scheduling I'd expect UMass, Liberty and New Mexico State on the schedule every year in November. The more schools that go independent the easier it is to schedule independent.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

Campus Flow
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/3/2018 12:03:27 AM

Bobcat1996 wrote:

Thanks LC as that info is helpful. Now if the MAC office could relay that info to ESPN/MAC AD's and the powers that be that decide the TV games, maybe the league could get back to more Saturday games?

No because the AD's believe the marketing value to the university for each midweek appearance is worth 2.5-3.0 million. The MAC isn't going to change course and play on Saturdays.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

UpSan Bobcat
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/3/2018 11:09:40 AM

Alan Swank wrote:

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

You're right that Ohio's success over the last decade has led to more of these midweek games. The good teams get put on TV. It's good for that but bad for fans who want to go to games.

I'm not saying people watch those games because the teams have good records. I'm just saying Ohio gets picked to be in a lot of these games because it always has a good record.

colobobcat66
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RE: Schedule Question?

Posted: 7/3/2018 3:26:37 PM

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Alan Swank wrote:

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

You're right that Ohio's success over the last decade has led to more of these midweek games. The good teams get put on TV. It's good for that but bad for fans who want to go to games.

I'm not saying people watch those games because the teams have good records. I'm just saying Ohio gets picked to be in a lot of these games because it always has a good record.

I�ll go out on a limb and say that more people will more likely watch 2 teams with better records rather than 2 teams with bad records. It�s not too hard a concept to understand. Football fans are no different that other folks in that regard. How can you argue that?

Last Edited: 7/3/2018 3:31:06 PM by colobobcat66

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