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Topic:  The day when OSU turned its back on SEO

Topic:  The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
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Uncle Wes
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  Message Not Read  The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/22/2019 1:32:03 PM 
I found an interesting article about how at one time OSU served as an access school for SEO but is enrolling far fewer than a decade ago. The master plan at OSU is to become another Miami with 35% of the freshman class from outside of Ohio.

Quote:
Ohio State enrolls fewer students from Ohio’s Appalachian counties than it did a decade ago. It also enrolls fewer students from the 10 most populous counties combined.

The university’s in-state enrollment has remained stagnant over the past 10 years as Ohio State takes in a growing amount of out-of-state and international students.

A Lantern analysis of Ohio State’s past 10 years of enrollment data shows Ohio high school graduates represent nearly 12 percent fewer incoming first-year students in 2017 than they did a decade before. In 2008, almost 82 percent of freshmen came from the Buckeye State, but in 2017 that number dropped to 70 percent.

Over the same period, this dip is paired with first-years from outside the U.S. doubling from 4 percent to more than 8 percent. Out-of-state freshmen jumped from 14.5 percent to almost 22 percent.

https://www.thelantern.com/2018/04/where-buckeyes-come-fr... /


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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/22/2019 9:12:41 PM 
Just like selling a car at list price. Out of state students pay more than in state. OU has tried to do the same thing.
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Uncle Wes
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Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/23/2019 12:02:02 AM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Just like selling a car at list price. Out of state students pay more than in state. OU has tried to do the same thing.


No. OU has let the number of out-of-state students declined as the demand shifted in state. OSU is intentionally pegging their freshman class to 35% out-of-state regardless of the market. If the non-Ohio students are 35% and they have a general entrance requirement of 3.8 as demand drops they'll have to shrink their freshman class and then add from the wait list which will drag their overall GPA down to a 3.7. That means a drop in-state spots at OSU to perhaps as low as 4,000 and Miami 1500. Ohio this year is running about 3300 in-state spots but can go as high as 4,000 if demand is shown. That happened back in 2016 and to stem the demand they pegged the target GPA to 3.55. As I mentioned in the past OSU and Miami might be in front now with admissions but in due time they'll be in rough equilibrium with OU.


Bobcat Sustainability
2018 Quentin Poling, 7th Round (Miami Dolphins)
2017 Tarell Basham, 3rd Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2017 Blair Brown, 5th Round (Jacksonville Jaguars)
2014 Travis Carrie, 7th Round (Oakland Raiders)
2013 Eric Herman, 7th Round (New York Giants)
2012 LaVon Brazil, 6th Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2010 Taylor Price, 3rd Round (NE Patriots)
2009 Mike Mitchell, 2nd Round (Oakland Raiders)
2008 Landon Cohen, 7th Round (Detroit Lions)

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OUPride
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/23/2019 8:03:33 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Just like selling a car at list price. Out of state students pay more than in state. OU has tried to do the same thing.


No. OU has let the number of out-of-state students declined as the demand shifted in state. OSU is intentionally pegging their freshman class to 35% out-of-state regardless of the market. If the non-Ohio students are 35% and they have a general entrance requirement of 3.8 as demand drops they'll have to shrink their freshman class and then add from the wait list which will drag their overall GPA down to a 3.7. That means a drop in-state spots at OSU to perhaps as low as 4,000 and Miami 1500. Ohio this year is running about 3300 in-state spots but can go as high as 4,000 if demand is shown. That happened back in 2016 and to stem the demand they pegged the target GPA to 3.55. As I mentioned in the past OSU and Miami might be in front now with admissions but in due time they'll be in rough equilibrium with OU.


Or they can simply shrink their freshman classes from 7K to 6K. They have a 5.4 billion dollar endowment and maintain another billion in unrestricted cash reserves. They can afford to do it. No way that OSU ever gives up their advantage in selectivity and the rankings and reputation that come with it.

Miami is the one in a precarious position. The vast majority of their OOS students come from Chicagoland (OSU is far better at recruiting nationally), and if that ever dries up and they have to rely primarily on in-state students (where OSU dominates them as 90% of the applicants accepted to both end up in Columbus) again, then I could definitely see them settling into a level of admissions selectivity equal to Ohio and UC. OSU, on the other hand, is gone and isn't coming back.
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Alan Swank
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/23/2019 10:08:25 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Just like selling a car at list price. Out of state students pay more than in state. OU has tried to do the same thing.


No. OU has let the number of out-of-state students declined as the demand shifted in state. OSU is intentionally pegging their freshman class to 35% out-of-state regardless of the market. If the non-Ohio students are 35% and they have a general entrance requirement of 3.8 as demand drops they'll have to shrink their freshman class and then add from the wait list which will drag their overall GPA down to a 3.7. That means a drop in-state spots at OSU to perhaps as low as 4,000 and Miami 1500. Ohio this year is running about 3300 in-state spots but can go as high as 4,000 if demand is shown. That happened back in 2016 and to stem the demand they pegged the target GPA to 3.55. As I mentioned in the past OSU and Miami might be in front now with admissions but in due time they'll be in rough equilibrium with OU.


Wes - do you work for OU? I guess I could spend the time to look it up, but OU has made statements in the last five years that it's goal was to increase the more profitable out of state cohort.

And while not directly related, the numbers in this article are quite telling.

https://woub.org/2019/07/02/ohio-university-looking-at-ne... /

Last Edited: 9/23/2019 10:42:15 AM by Alan Swank

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Uncle Wes
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Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/26/2019 7:58:15 AM 
Alan no but I am a long time concerned alum. The trend I've noticed is its becoming a P5 type thing with academics in that if the public school isn't doing a certain level of research which comes with a higher price tag for research faculty that it becomes pushed into the second tier. Buffalo for example has roughly the same number of applications and GPA as Ohio but is rated #79 in the USNWR.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/ub-9554


Bobcat Sustainability
2018 Quentin Poling, 7th Round (Miami Dolphins)
2017 Tarell Basham, 3rd Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2017 Blair Brown, 5th Round (Jacksonville Jaguars)
2014 Travis Carrie, 7th Round (Oakland Raiders)
2013 Eric Herman, 7th Round (New York Giants)
2012 LaVon Brazil, 6th Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2010 Taylor Price, 3rd Round (NE Patriots)
2009 Mike Mitchell, 2nd Round (Oakland Raiders)
2008 Landon Cohen, 7th Round (Detroit Lions)

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Uncle Wes
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/26/2019 8:21:23 AM 
Alan Swank wrote:
Uncle Wes wrote:
Alan Swank wrote:
Just like selling a car at list price. Out of state students pay more than in state. OU has tried to do the same thing.


No. OU has let the number of out-of-state students declined as the demand shifted in state. OSU is intentionally pegging their freshman class to 35% out-of-state regardless of the market. If the non-Ohio students are 35% and they have a general entrance requirement of 3.8 as demand drops they'll have to shrink their freshman class and then add from the wait list which will drag their overall GPA down to a 3.7. That means a drop in-state spots at OSU to perhaps as low as 4,000 and Miami 1500. Ohio this year is running about 3300 in-state spots but can go as high as 4,000 if demand is shown. That happened back in 2016 and to stem the demand they pegged the target GPA to 3.55. As I mentioned in the past OSU and Miami might be in front now with admissions but in due time they'll be in rough equilibrium with OU.


Wes - do you work for OU? I guess I could spend the time to look it up, but OU has made statements in the last five years that it's goal was to increase the more profitable out of state cohort.


Specifically to the idea of increasing the number of out-of-state students I know that OU has a lower merit aid threshold for them than what they do instate so on a level they do want to attract them. However the difference between instate and out of state tuition is only $9,464 and with merit aid starting at 22 ACT the average admit is receiving a few thousand dollars off that. Even if the university could pull in 300 more kids out of state, additional 8 to 10 percent of the class that's only 2.1 million more in tuition revenue. At Ohio State 35% of a freshman class of 7500 is 2,625 at a tuition difference of 20,016. That is a revenue difference of 52.5 million for OSU. The potential of the strategy is far greater at OSU.


Bobcat Sustainability
2018 Quentin Poling, 7th Round (Miami Dolphins)
2017 Tarell Basham, 3rd Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2017 Blair Brown, 5th Round (Jacksonville Jaguars)
2014 Travis Carrie, 7th Round (Oakland Raiders)
2013 Eric Herman, 7th Round (New York Giants)
2012 LaVon Brazil, 6th Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2010 Taylor Price, 3rd Round (NE Patriots)
2009 Mike Mitchell, 2nd Round (Oakland Raiders)
2008 Landon Cohen, 7th Round (Detroit Lions)

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Uncle Wes
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 3,944

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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 9/26/2019 8:40:16 AM 
More evidence the research profile is the biggest negative can be found by comparing the number of applications and USNWR rankings of universities in the region. If you take the number of applications as a measure Ohio should be higher than UC in the USNWR.

Cincinnati 21,161 (#139)
West Virginia 20,594 (#228)
Kentucky 19,324 (#132)
Louisville 13,570 (#192)


Bobcat Sustainability
2018 Quentin Poling, 7th Round (Miami Dolphins)
2017 Tarell Basham, 3rd Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2017 Blair Brown, 5th Round (Jacksonville Jaguars)
2014 Travis Carrie, 7th Round (Oakland Raiders)
2013 Eric Herman, 7th Round (New York Giants)
2012 LaVon Brazil, 6th Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2010 Taylor Price, 3rd Round (NE Patriots)
2009 Mike Mitchell, 2nd Round (Oakland Raiders)
2008 Landon Cohen, 7th Round (Detroit Lions)

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OUPride
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 10/1/2019 9:16:16 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
More evidence the research profile is the biggest negative can be found by comparing the number of applications and USNWR rankings of universities in the region. If you take the number of applications as a measure Ohio should be higher than UC in the USNWR.

Cincinnati 21,161 (#139)
West Virginia 20,594 (#228)
Kentucky 19,324 (#132)
Louisville 13,570 (#192)


Ohio is a statewide institution; we're drawing applicants from a much larger pool than UC. UC is still pretty much a regional school, drawing 80% of their students from the Cincy metro area, and almost all of their out of state students are from bordering counties in KY and IN that get in-state tution.

I'm not sure how much the sheer number of applications weighs in the USNWR rankings if at all. I think it's more the acceptance rate, the yield (% of accepted students who choose to attend) and, of course, the test scores and class rank of those students who end up in the freshman class.
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Uncle Wes
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: The day when OSU turned its back on SEO
   Posted: 10/3/2019 8:01:39 AM 
OUPride wrote:
Uncle Wes wrote:
More evidence the research profile is the biggest negative can be found by comparing the number of applications and USNWR rankings of universities in the region. If you take the number of applications as a measure Ohio should be higher than UC in the USNWR.

Cincinnati 21,161 (#139)
West Virginia 20,594 (#228)
Kentucky 19,324 (#132)
Louisville 13,570 (#192)


Ohio is a statewide institution; we're drawing applicants from a much larger pool than UC. UC is still pretty much a regional school, drawing 80% of their students from the Cincy metro area, and almost all of their out of state students are from bordering counties in KY and IN that get in-state tution.

I'm not sure how much the sheer number of applications weighs in the USNWR rankings if at all. I think it's more the acceptance rate, the yield (% of accepted students who choose to attend) and, of course, the test scores and class rank of those students who end up in the freshman class.


Right but my point is OU has solid demand with its application numbers. Of course if the university moved to a smaller freshman class as it sounds like it might be doing that will raise the class stats and USNWR ranking.


Bobcat Sustainability
2018 Quentin Poling, 7th Round (Miami Dolphins)
2017 Tarell Basham, 3rd Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2017 Blair Brown, 5th Round (Jacksonville Jaguars)
2014 Travis Carrie, 7th Round (Oakland Raiders)
2013 Eric Herman, 7th Round (New York Giants)
2012 LaVon Brazil, 6th Round (Indianapolis Colts)
2010 Taylor Price, 3rd Round (NE Patriots)
2009 Mike Mitchell, 2nd Round (Oakland Raiders)
2008 Landon Cohen, 7th Round (Detroit Lions)

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