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Topic:  RE: We're Number 454

Topic:  RE: We're Number 454
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Uncle Wes
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Alexandria, VA
Post Count: 3,668

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  Message Not Read  RE: We're Number 454
   Posted: 9/28/2018 9:11:28 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
OhioStunter wrote:
Ohio69 wrote:
One of these bizarre rankings gives weight to salaries reported by alums to a web site , payscale.com if I recall correctly. Good grief. We are supposed to take that seriously?

Meh - stick with US News for now and ignore these newbies. They are bizarre.


Exactly. Methodology on each of these is different. Any employer that puts too much stake on some of these rankings vs. the abilities of each individual candidate is an employer that is missing out on some great talent.


Just want to make sure you're not misunderstanding the point I was making about how these rankings impact employer hiring decisions.

It's not that employers think these rankings hold more weight than their own interview processes, or that they place more emphasis on these rankings than on the abilities of individuals.

It's that employers use these rankings to help inform their campus recruiting strategies.

Low rankings hurt OU students because it gives them fewer opportunities to prove their individual abilities with top companies. Companies can't recruit on every campus, and academic rankings play a big factor in where they choose to recruit.


This is true but what is our place in the food chain? We aren't exactly a mega brand like Stanford or Penn running a feeder system for investment banks. Unless the goal is wall street I don't see how rankings are that much of a factor. OU plays very well from a couple of angles. One angle is the Ohio University liberal arts college angle in which the school has a college town atmosphere that rivals the private liberal arts colleges in region. All of the advantages of those colleges but larger with more resources and programming. Another angle is in the sciences where OHIO is a major public school in the Midwest a region that has an excellent for the sciences. For example Big Ten schools have University of California type credibility. Then in California they have the Cal Poly system which has a lot of credibility in the sciences because its California. Likewise in the Midwest Illinois St, Michigan Tech or Ohio get a bump from their region. I don't know of another public school that because of characteristics gets a bump in both liberal arts and sciences like Ohio is able to do. Miami without the state name has less credibility in the sciences, particularly taking a national view. They've only had a comprehensive engineering school (if you can call it comprehensive) in place for 5 years and no medical school.


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OUPride
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Member Since: 9/21/2010
Post Count: 330

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: We're Number 454
   Posted: 9/28/2018 11:02:18 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:


This is true but what is our place in the food chain? We aren't exactly a mega brand like Stanford or Penn running a feeder system for investment banks. Unless the goal is wall street I don't see how rankings are that much of a factor. OU plays very well from a couple of angles. One angle is the Ohio University liberal arts college angle in which the school has a college town atmosphere that rivals the private liberal arts colleges in region. All of the advantages of those colleges but larger with more resources and programming. Another angle is in the sciences where OHIO is a major public school in the Midwest a region that has an excellent for the sciences. For example Big Ten schools have University of California type credibility. Then in California they have the Cal Poly system which has a lot of credibility in the sciences because its California. Likewise in the Midwest Illinois St, Michigan Tech or Ohio get a bump from their region. I don't know of another public school that because of characteristics gets a bump in both liberal arts and sciences like Ohio is able to do. Miami without the state name has less credibility in the sciences, particularly taking a national view. They've only had a comprehensive engineering school (if you can call it comprehensive) in place for 5 years and no medical school.


Do we really have that kind of reputation in the sciences? I looked at the National Research Council's ranking of doctoral programs, and I'm not seeing it. These are very thorough rankings that take multiple factors into account and are only done about once every decade.

Here's what I found for the physical sciences and engineering:

Chemistry
Ohio State 26
UC 106
Akron 113 (specific polymer science program)
Kent State 136
Akron (general chemistry) 146
Miami 153
Toledo 154
Cleveland State 168
Bowling Green 170
Ohio 177

Physics
OSU 25
Ohio 81 (Physics & Astrophysics)
UC 96
Toledo 125
Additional program at KSU wasn’t even evaluated and ranked

Astronomy & Astrophysics
OSU 9

Mathematics
OSU 27
KSU 64
UC 89
Bowling Green 90
UT 109
Ohio 122

Computer Science
OSU 36
UC 75
KSU 76
Wright State 92

Chemical Eng
OSU 26
UC 68
Akron 92
Toledo 96
Ohio 102

Electrical Eng
OSU 26
UC 55
Ohio 110
UT 118
Cleveland State 131
Akron 134

Materials Eng
OSU 14
Akron 37 (specific program in polymers)
UC 65

Mechanical Eng
OSU 40
UC 77
UT 79
Akron 116

I'll say it again. The state of Ohio has too many programs. It tries to spread the peanut butter to every corner of the state, which allows nobody other than OSU to excel, and it arguably holds them back too. In a field where they have no in-state competition like Astronomy, they're 9th in the country and tied with Chicago. And this mess can't be blamed on OSU. This was Vern Alden's doing when he teamed up with the Miami Presidents to try and cut OSU off at the knees rather than work towards something resembling a structured and rationale system like California was developing around the same time. OSU would have been open to discussing that kind of system. Instead, Alden and the rest of the Presidents felt if they could force OSU into open admissions while allowing academic empire building across the state that somehow it would benefit their campuses. It didn't. Millett ensured that only Miami would be selective for undergraduate admissions giving them their brief and long forgotten moment of "public ivy" glory. Everyone else was left fighting among themselves and adding on redundant and unnecessary doctoral programs that never had a chance at being anything more than mediocre.

Last Edited: 9/29/2018 8:54:27 AM by OUPride

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OUPride
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Member Since: 9/21/2010
Post Count: 330

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: We're Number 454
   Posted: 9/29/2018 8:38:47 AM 
As for the liberal arts, here are the humanities and social sciences.

Classics
OSU 19

English
OSU 27
UC 81
Ohio 93
Miami 94
KSU 108

History
OSU 21
Miami 96
UT 116
Ohio 117
Bowling Green 129

Philosophy
OSU 17
BGSU 60
UC 73

Economics
OSU 26
KSU—Unranked

Geography
OSU 6
KSU 44
UC & Toledo—unranked

Political Science
OSU 15
UC 88
Miami & KSU—unranked (somebody want to tell me why the state of Ohio funds doctoral programs here that are so lowly regarded that the NRC didn’t even bother to evaluate them but did rank programs at the University of Dallas, University or Nevada-Reno and North Texas?)

Psychology
OSU 47
KSU 75
BGSU 110
Ohio 125
Miami 134
UT 170
Akron 224
UC & UT—unranked

Sociology
OSU 23
Akron 72
KSU 86
BGSU 98
UC--unranked

As for being a liberal arts college, I compared the percentage of our undergraduates who major in arts & sciences to OSU and Miami.

OSU 36%
Ohio 21%
Miami--well, I wanted to find that information, but it's nowhere to be found on their website. I think they bury it since they try so hard to market themselves as a "liberal arts college" despite what I've heard is something like 70% of their undergraduates majoring in business or education.

https://www.ohio.edu/instres/student/collegeenrollment.html
http://enrollmentservices.osu.edu/report.pdf

Last Edited: 9/29/2018 8:53:38 AM by OUPride

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