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Topic:  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats

Topic:  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
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cc-cat
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Location: matthews, NC
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/3/2021 11:29:38 AM 
OU_Country wrote:
shabamon wrote:
If the MAC is going to stay with 18-20 conference games, I would like to see them designate one week in November or December when schools are in session for maybe two conference games. One weekday and one Saturday. That way you minimize the number of games that could fall on winter or spring breaks. I'd be much more interested in coming to a game the first weekend of December if we were playing Kent or Toledo as opposed to Austin Peay or Radford. Tuck those types of games into the winter breaks.


100% Agree! The perfect timing would be the first week that no football takes place on a Saturday because of midweek football on ESPN the Ocho.


You could also set this up in Cleveland as an all day event - 2 games in the day session and 2 in the evening. Should assure a good crowd, and better chance to get good opponents if on a neutral court.
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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 12:42:16 PM 
FearLeon wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Discussed many years ago, but I am in favor of drastically emphasizing the regular season while still keeping the madness of the tourney with the following format:

1-2 - Triple Bye
3-4 - Double Bye
5-6 - Single Bye
7-8 - Home Game
9-10 - Away Game
11-12 - Season Over


Some good thoughts here. Triple bye is good and bad in my opinion. It does put emphasis on regular season, but you also risk facing a hot team that's won a few games before you would even play a game. Tough one...but I see the logic here.





How many top seeds won the MAC Tournament when we did a double bye? If memory is correct, it was not a good thing for top teams.
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Bobcat1996
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 2:55:30 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
FearLeon wrote:
Andrew Ruck wrote:
Discussed many years ago, but I am in favor of drastically emphasizing the regular season while still keeping the madness of the tourney with the following format:

1-2 - Triple Bye
3-4 - Double Bye
5-6 - Single Bye
7-8 - Home Game
9-10 - Away Game
11-12 - Season Over


Some good thoughts here. Triple bye is good and bad in my opinion. It does put emphasis on regular season, but you also risk facing a hot team that's won a few games before you would even play a game. Tough one...but I see the logic here.





How many top seeds won the MAC Tournament when we did a double bye? If memory is correct, it was not a good thing for top teams.


In 2014 Western Michigan was the top seed and won it and in 2013 Akron won it as the top seed and I think both were given a bye to the semis. In 2015 Buffalo was the two seed and won it and they were given a bye to the semis. Not certain about other seasons, but I would say that those three years the top seeds benefitted from the byes to the semis.
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SVAC83
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 7:47:56 PM 
i think now that we are using the NET not the RPI the more league games is a good way to go. If you look at this year and examine it. Toledo is like the 12th team out of tourney at worst. If it was not for league loses to a bad team they would of been really close. a lot of good MAC teams are in the 120 and above NET a loss to one of those teams does not kill you.

Wins against SWAC, MEAC and NAIA teams are wasted games basically you cant gain anything from them.

I think scheduling is tough. No one wants to go on the road. The road is tough to win everywhere in a normal non COVID year. I think you should shoot to get some middle of the road teams to come visit year. Very little chance to get a power 5 at home
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Victory
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 8:28:08 PM 
SVAC83 wrote:
i think now that we are using the NET not the RPI the more league games is a good way to go. If you look at this year and examine it. Toledo is like the 12th team out of tourney at worst. If it was not for league loses to a bad team they would of been really close. a lot of good MAC teams are in the 120 and above NET a loss to one of those teams does not kill you.

Wins against SWAC, MEAC and NAIA teams are wasted games basically you cant gain anything from them.

I think scheduling is tough. No one wants to go on the road. The road is tough to win everywhere in a normal non COVID year. I think you should shoot to get some middle of the road teams to come visit year. Very little chance to get a power 5 at home


The thing that the .NET recognizes, as it was made by Google analytics people, is that when a bubble level team plays a road game in the low 100s that it has close to a 50/50 chance of losing. So if the committee went by the fair risk/reward analysis at that level of the .NET ratings then you might be right. The thing is that is absolutely doesn't. It seems that they care mostly about top 50 wins (not winning percentage against top 50 teams but actual number of wins which is ungodly stupid). If it isn't a top 100 team they really only care how may you lose. So since we know, as the .NET ratings do, the high probability of losing to teams 100-160 and you get no credit if you win with the committee then these are the absolute worst teams to have on your schedule if you are looking for a at large bid. The thing is that they MAC is chalk full of them. Often more than any conference. A lot of years there are about 9 of them. Literally, all but the top 1 or 2 and bottom 1 or 2 might be in that range. If you are looking for an at large bid then MAC games, other pretty good mid-majors and bottom level high majors are the last teams that you want on your schedule to try to get an at large.

Last Edited: 4/4/2021 8:29:33 PM by Victory

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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 9:04:01 PM 
Victory wrote:

The thing that the .NET recognizes, as it was made by Google analytics people, is that when a bubble level team plays a road game in the low 100s that it has close to a 50/50 chance of losing. So if the committee went by the fair risk/reward analysis at that level of the .NET ratings then you might be right. The thing is that is absolutely doesn't. It seems that they care mostly about top 50 wins (not winning percentage against top 50 teams but actual number of wins which is ungodly stupid). If it isn't a top 100 team they really only care how may you lose. So since we know, as the .NET ratings do, the high probability of losing to teams 100-160 and you get no credit if you win with the committee then these are the absolute worst teams to have on your schedule if you are looking for a at large bid. The thing is that they MAC is chalk full of them. Often more than any conference. A lot of years there are about 9 of them. Literally, all but the top 1 or 2 and bottom 1 or 2 might be in that range. If you are looking for an at large bid then MAC games, other pretty good mid-majors and bottom level high majors are the last teams that you want on your schedule to try to get an at large.


Yep. All of this. Slugfest road MAC games against teams ranked in the 100s can only hurt you.

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Jeff McKinney
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/4/2021 10:09:57 PM 
Good post, Victory.
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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/5/2021 9:53:51 AM 
One possibility for the tournament is to include only teams that were .500 or better in MAC play. That would put more emphasis on the regular season without having an arbitrary cut-off point. It would also put added importance on late-season games for borderline teams. The first round would be used to trim the field to a multiple of four. For example, this past season seven teams were .500 or better in MAC play. The first round would cut the field to four -- 7 vs 2; 6 vs 3; 5 vs 4. The #1 seed would get a bye and would play the lowest remaining seed in the second round.


We will get by.
We will get by.
We will get by.
We will survive.

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OUcat
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Member Since: 10/13/2011
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  Message Not Read  RE: MAC scheduling and tournament formats
   Posted: 4/5/2021 4:35:24 PM 
Frankly ...

Most seasons the MAC is pretty competitive, top to bottom, so I have no issues w/all 12 teams going to Cleveland. Though I must say the 8-team format this year worked really well.

However ...

That said, the MAC is notorious for having multiple tiebreakers. And the worst thing to me is a team losing a chance at tournament play due to a tie-breaker, which is often due to an injury at some point in the season or some other wacky break.

I would venture to say all of Ohio's NCAA bids since 2000 have come with the Bobcats being 4th seeded or worse in the MAC Tournament, certainly never as a No. 1.

More importantly, the MAC almost always seems to favor the hot team down the stretch. You never really know which team that is unless they all play.
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