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Topic: Horrible Coaching

Topic: Horrible Coaching

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PhiTau74
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Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/14/2013 9:46:56 PM

How can you not run the clock down with 2:50 and only use .30 seconds let them drive to the 40 and then only rush 3 guys against that quarterback. That is bad coaching on the offensive and defensive coordinators.

PhiTau74
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/14/2013 11:00:06 PM

Rushing 3 guys worked so good at the end of the first why not try again and give up a touchdown this time. Nice call coach.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/16/2013 7:33:46 PM

Okay. I get it we won. A fine victory. By three.

But I think that this is the worst possible call: stupd cow has the ball with about 1:50 left in the first half at their own four with third down and about 8. Clearly they are going to pass. And Cato drops back to pass. But we make no attempt at pass pressure. Which I'd do by a delayed blitz by a guy spying on Cato and, probably, one guy blitzing from right at the snap.

Why would I do this? If we stop them and they have to punt, then we have a very good chance of getting a field goal which ups the lead a fair amount, or a td which really is nice--'cause we get the 2nd half kickoff.

What bad things can happen if the blitz fails? Cato scrambles for a first and/or a chunk of yardage. To me there's no way that he breaks off a really long run. Or, he completes a long ball, they get a first and score a td or field goal (which is what happened). Or they complete one for a td--a very, very, small possibility to me.

So, I think that not bringing pressure on the play is really a bad decision.

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Bcat2
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/17/2013 7:49:55 AM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Okay. I get it we won. A fine victory. By three.

But I think that this is the worst possible call: stupd cow has the ball with about 1:50 left in the first half at their own four with third down and about 8. Clearly they are going to pass. And Cato drops back to pass. But we make no attempt at pass pressure. Which I'd do by a delayed blitz by a guy spying on Cato and, probably, one guy blitzing from right at the snap.

Why would I do this? If we stop them and they have to punt, then we have a very good chance of getting a field goal which ups the lead a fair amount, or a td which really is nice--'cause we get the 2nd half kickoff.

What bad things can happen if the blitz fails? Cato scrambles for a first and/or a chunk of yardage. To me there's no way that he breaks off a really long run. Or, he completes a long ball, they get a first and score a td or field goal (which is what happened). Or they complete one for a td--a very, very, small possibility to me.

So, I think that not bringing pressure on the play is really a bad decision.

As it played out their #81 did get behind Bass for about a thirty yard completion, one, that had Cato lofted it a little would have been a TD. He lost balance making a very good catch. He was not tackled. There was no safety help. 81 was behind the deepest coverage. Watch it again, this was very close to 96 yards for a TD. The back was kept in for protection. Credit to Marshall, very good throw, very good catch, nearly something that would really have had all cat fans upset just before half.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/17/2013 10:57:32 PM

Bcat2 wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Okay. I get it we won. A fine victory. By three.

But I think that this is the worst possible call: stupd cow has the ball with about 1:50 left in the first half at their own four with third down and about 8. Clearly they are going to pass. And Cato drops back to pass. But we make no attempt at pass pressure. Which I'd do by a delayed blitz by a guy spying on Cato and, probably, one guy blitzing from right at the snap.

Why would I do this? If we stop them and they have to punt, then we have a very good chance of getting a field goal which ups the lead a fair amount, or a td which really is nice--'cause we get the 2nd half kickoff.

What bad things can happen if the blitz fails? Cato scrambles for a first and/or a chunk of yardage. To me there's no way that he breaks off a really long run. Or, he completes a long ball, they get a first and score a td or field goal (which is what happened). Or they complete one for a td--a very, very, small possibility to me.

So, I think that not bringing pressure on the play is really a bad decision.

Bcat2--C'mon--at some point you have to accept some criticism of the coaches. You seem to think that they are infallible.

First, that was not almost a td. That was much closer to an incompletion than a td--the guy made a terrific grab and fell down doing it. That was no where near close to a td. That throw was on the mark about as well as Cato can do it....The back was kept in for protection--but if we bring one or two more guys, then they just don't have enough to keep us from rushing, or getting to, Cato...But, more than that, if we bring pressure, I contend that Cato doesn't have time to make such a good throw...so we end up with them punting out of their end zone, with OHIO ending up in fine position to get 3 or 7.

If we were ever going to bring pressure, that play was the time.

Last Edited: 9/17/2013 10:58:11 PM by Monroe Slavin

Bcat2
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 7:09:07 AM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Bcat2 wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

Okay. I get it we won. A fine victory. By three.

But I think that this is the worst possible call: stupd cow has the ball with about 1:50 left in the first half at their own four with third down and about 8. Clearly they are going to pass. And Cato drops back to pass. But we make no attempt at pass pressure. Which I'd do by a delayed blitz by a guy spying on Cato and, probably, one guy blitzing from right at the snap.

Why would I do this? If we stop them and they have to punt, then we have a very good chance of getting a field goal which ups the lead a fair amount, or a td which really is nice--'cause we get the 2nd half kickoff.

What bad things can happen if the blitz fails? Cato scrambles for a first and/or a chunk of yardage. To me there's no way that he breaks off a really long run. Or, he completes a long ball, they get a first and score a td or field goal (which is what happened). Or they complete one for a td--a very, very, small possibility to me.

So, I think that not bringing pressure on the play is really a bad decision.

Sorry Monroe, 81 was one step from catching that in stride and a 96 yard TD. Also not having the benefit of film study over Marshall's last several games I don't know how good his line is or Cato's ability make the blitz read and then know who will be open. The film study would be key and essential and not having the benefit I will assume the line graded very high in film study and Cato has evolved a great deal from 2011. Given Marshall has scored 41, 59, 52 and 55 in their last four games and was favored against the Bobcats I am toasting the coaches not second guessing them. The topic title does irk me.

Last Edited: 9/18/2013 1:49:36 PM by Bcat2

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

PhiTau74
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 12:48:34 PM

My point on the original post was he had close to 10 seconds for a receiver to get open, even Weeden with the Browns might complete one with that much time. It reminds me so much of the last few years where we get zero pressure on the QB and lose to N. Il, Fiami and virtually every big game we lose. You can't rush 3 guys unless you have lock down corners and safeties if the other team has a good passing QB. You at least can't do it when there is little time and the other team you know is going to throw to set up a field goal or get down field to tie or win the game. I only saw us rush 3 people twice, maybe it was more but on those two plays they almost got a TD ( down to the 6) and got a field goal and the other play they did get a TD.

Bobcatbob
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 3:52:14 PM

We should have been in complete prevent/contain mode and if Cato wants to burn ten seconds off the clock running around in the backfield looking for an open man, let him. The breakdown was that there is no way under any circumstance that we let a receiver get behind us. That pass should have been completed and it should have been a TD and that would be on the DBs, not the DL.

MonroeClassmate
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 4:27:18 PM

Ohio won so I'll be critical.

If memory serves me: Ohio's final first half drive started with a TT keeper for 6yrds and the next play Beau with a first down run (don't know if he just got it or had yards to spare)

The clock was below 3 minutes and this is where the time managment failed Ohio and indirectly led to MU getting three before half. It occured because of three straight passes that fell incomplete resulting in no sigificant time burned and a punt after 5 plays. Clock for Ohio was not an issue as 2 plus minutes and at least one timeout is plenty of time to march down the field. One of the three plays needed to be a run or a bubble pass or other short catch and pass that if not getting the first down yardage would result in burning time off the clock. In close games, in any sport, everything counts...what you did do and what you didn't do.

One clock burning play and the resulting coffin punt and the offense and special team would have been the best defense to keep em off the scoreboard before half.

On the other hand, I think Marshall coach blew it at the end of the game. He should have followed the NI strategy of saving clock by going for the 3 when in range and then going for the onside recovery and needed TD. The Huskey's tried doing it to OHIO on their last visit but didn't win but sure made it interesting by saving clock to better have a chance.

Bcat2
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 6:03:07 PM

Bobcatbob wrote:

+1 When the cats get there the pressure and contain will come from four. Next year?

Last Edited: 9/18/2013 6:10:39 PM by Bcat2

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Jughead
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 7:03:14 PM

I saw us set up like we were bringing the house on a blitz only for our LB's to drop in coverage for the first time that I can recall. We need to disguise/fake blitzes like that more often.

Last Edited: 9/18/2013 7:03:44 PM by Jughead

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L.C.
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 7:39:38 PM

I am personally hoping that as the young DEs gain experience, they will be able to implement more zone blitzes into the defense. Zone blitzes are where the DE drops back into pass coverage, while the LB blitzes. The idea is that the confused offensive lineman tries to block someone that isn't coming, and misses the one that actually comes, resulting in good pressure, yet you don't reduce the number of players back in pass coverage.

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Monroe Slavin
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 9:32:49 PM

Isn't it about absolutely impossible to keep receivers from getting open for 10 seconds.

I believe in qb pressure. I'm not certain of this but I have a hypotheses: a qb who's on his rear end or falling down or totally running for his life and about to eat turf cannot complete a pass of any meaning. Espec Cato who has a weak arm.

Interesting that someone brought up the Northern Illi title game that we were up 20-0 (right?) and lost 23-20. I'll believe to my final day--and beyond--that we lost that game because we went to a 'contain' type of strategy and took the pressure off.

C Money
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 9:46:13 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

I'm not certain of this but I have a hypotheses: a qb who's on his rear end or falling down or totally running for his life and about to eat turf cannot complete a pass of any meaning.

T^2's clutch 3rd down 10 yard shovel pass to Waters is evidence contra. If there was a sideline shot of that play I would watch it on loop for hours at a time.

OhioCatFan
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 10:00:07 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

. . . Interesting that someone brought up the Northern Illi title game that we were up 20-0 (right?) and lost 23-20. I'll believe to my final day--and beyond--that we lost that game because we went to a 'contain' type of strategy and took the pressure off.

Let's all repeat . . . one, two, three "What does the prevent defense prevent?" VICTORY, VICTORY, VICTORY.

Another case in point: Ask Marshall fans about their loss to WVU two years ago in Huntington after a two TD lead in the 4th Qt.. However, that would have been an unacceptable loss in Morganhole, since WVU has clearly superior talent, better facilities, and more resources. So, just crank up the prevent defense and prevent such a travesty from ever happening.

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Bcat2
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/18/2013 10:02:44 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

There was another thing. Six points from the offense in the second half and it is a W. When this team, 2013, has so much to follow, why, are we typing about the old days.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/19/2013 1:58:12 AM

C Money wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

I'm not certain of this but I have a hypotheses: a qb who's on his rear end or falling down or totally running for his life and about to eat turf cannot complete a pass of any meaning.

T^2's clutch 3rd down 10 yard shovel pass to Waters is evidence contra. If there was a sideline shot of that play I would watch it on loop for hours at a time.

I

C Money--I'm pretty sure that you're honoring TT's very fine play there and not arguing against my point here...'cause I'm sure you understand that TT's play proves my point: so much pressure that it was all he could do to shove out a 10 yard pass, so clearly couldn't have hit one far downfield--so no big risk to us since stupd cow was at their own 4 yardline at the start of the play that I'm railing against.

C Money
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RE: Horrible Coaching

Posted: 9/19/2013 8:52:24 AM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

C Money wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

I'm not certain of this but I have a hypotheses: a qb who's on his rear end or falling down or totally running for his life and about to eat turf cannot complete a pass of any meaning.

T^2's clutch 3rd down 10 yard shovel pass to Waters is evidence contra. If there was a sideline shot of that play I would watch it on loop for hours at a time.

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