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Author Message Bcat2 General User Member Since: 7/6/2010 Post Count: 4,295 Status: Offline     What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/19/2015 5:28:28 PM  2014 Zip roster shows 25 seniors who would have used their eligibility. http://www.gozips.com/sports/fball/2014-15/roster?sort=year Rivals shows only 13 recruits. Only one from Ohio. https://rivals.yahoo.com/footballrecruiting/football/recr... What am I missing here? "Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK Back to Top UpSan Bobcat General User Member Since: 8/30/2005 Location: Upper Sandusky, OH Post Count: 3,812 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/19/2015 6:33:28 PM  Rivals is missing some players. Their official signing class on signing day was 16 players. Maybe they have a few transfers coming in also? Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,482 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/19/2015 6:57:04 PM  I think they also have a lot of grayshirts from last year. If you really want to know, zipsnation.org would be the place to find the information. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top Bcat2 General User Member Since: 7/6/2010 Post Count: 4,295 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 7:31:55 AM  L.C. wrote: I think they also have a lot of grayshirts from last year. If you really want to know, zipsnation.org would be the place to find the information. Thank you "Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK Back to Top SBH General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Post Count: 4,211 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 8:56:37 AM  Ton of gray shirts, several transfers. Nevertheless, the folks in Akron are very disappointed in the latest recruiting class and wondering if Bowden's approach to rebuilding the program is working. He has gone with gray shirts, fifth-year senior transfers, jucos, etc. and they feel like they've stalled at 5 wins. Would have have done better to go the traditional route with four-year recruits? Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,482 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 10:08:54 AM  SBH wrote: ... Would have have done better to go the traditional route with four-year recruits? When you are trying to rebuild, it's always a choice - go for a fast fix, with JUCOs, or try the longer term approach with Freshmen. The advantage of the JUCO/Xfer route is that you can get an instant fix. Since you are bringing in upperclassmen, they contribute right away, so in only a couple years there is a dramatic improvement. The downside is that, after only 2-3 years, they are gone again, and you stop seeing progress, and even regress when you start losing them faster than you are bringing in new ones. Akron is a good example of that - in just two years under Bowden they had remarkable improvement, and went from being one of the worst teams in America, to being middle of the MAC, but then in his third year, the record didn't get any better. Worse, Akron now has massive graduation losses, and so most likely year 4 will be worse than years 2 and 3. The alternate approach is to try to bring in talented Freshmen, redshirt most of them, and then patiently wait for them to develop into players. Since teams built around Freshmen and Sophomores are rarely very good, the biggest improvement usually comes in years 4-5 when you take this approach. The risk is that you might get fired before you ever get to year 4-5. As a perfect example of a coach that did it the slow way, look at Dave Clawson. At Fordham he went 0-11, 3-8, 7-4, 10-3, 9-3. Then, at Richmond he again improved the slow way, going 3-8, 9-4, 6-5, and 11-3. At BG it was the same: 7-6, 2-10, 5-7, 8-5, 10-4. In all three situations, year 4 and 5 were always good. Solich did bring in a few JUCOs in the early years, but not many. Mostly he went the slow road. He had a good year early, anyway, in 2006, but it was an exception. The real, sustainable improvement came 5 years out, in 2009 and beyond, and Ohio has been bowl eligible ever since. To improve from the current down year, he's again taking the slow fix method, focusing mostly on bringing in talented Freshmen. As a contrast to Bowden, a MAC coach currently taking the other approach is Chuck Martin at Miami. Like Bowden, he started with one of the worst teams in the MAC. Unlike Bowden, he is building it primarily via recruiting Freshmen. He was only 2-10 his first year, and may not be any better this year. Yet, by 2017-18 (if he is still there), Miami will probably be much improved from where they are now. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top davepi2 General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: columbus, OH Post Count: 583 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 10:31:56 AM  ESPN all over this last night as a further excuse for paying players. Back to Top Bcat2 General User Member Since: 7/6/2010 Post Count: 4,295 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 11:05:41 AM  Another look at their roster. If everyone listed returns they will have; 2 RSr. and 28 Sr.. Seven of the seniors are JUCOs or transfers. Those numbers would usually drive high expectations. "Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,482 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 11:23:49 AM  Bcat2 wrote: Another look at their roster. If everyone listed returns they will have; 2 RSr. and 28 Sr.. Seven of the seniors are JUCOs or transfers. Those numbers would usually drive high expectations. So, they will lose 30 more next year? And, here is their depth chart from last year: http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-c... They lost 5 starters from offense, plus 5 second stringers. On defense they lost another 5 starters, and 5 backups. When you lose 20 of your top 44 players, that usually drives low expectations. This is the problem with relying on JUCOs and transfers. Last year they lost 24 Seniors, and next year they will lose another 30. You'd have expected a lot better than 5-7 when virtually the entire top two strings consisted of upperclassmen. They lose half this year, and another half next year, and then who will be left? Will they replace them with more JUCOs? Or will they take their lumps and play young guys? “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top davepi2 General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: columbus, OH Post Count: 583 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 5:02:00 PM  L.C. wrote: Bcat2 wrote: Another look at their roster. If everyone listed returns they will have; 2 RSr. and 28 Sr.. Seven of the seniors are JUCOs or transfers. Those numbers would usually drive high expectations. So, they will lose 30 more next year? And, here is their depth chart from last year: http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-c... They lost 5 starters from offense, plus 5 second stringers. On defense they lost another 5 starters, and 5 backups. When you lose 20 of your top 44 players, that usually drives low expectations. This is the problem with relying on JUCOs and transfers. Last year they lost 24 Seniors, and next year they will lose another 30. You'd have expected a lot better than 5-7 when virtually the entire top two strings consisted of upperclassmen. They lose half this year, and another half next year, and then who will be left? Will they replace them with more JUCOs? Or will they take their lumps and play young guys? I guess that depends on how much longer Bowden stays in Akron. Back to Top MonroeClassmate General User Member Since: 8/31/2010 Post Count: 2,157 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 8:49:08 PM  Not surprising that Akron took a back step or side step the past season; it has happened elsewhere. After all, 2006 was a big year for OHIO but 2007, not so much. It is better for a program to win than to worry about 2 and done guys vs 4 year guys. The attitude and expectations are critical when trying to reverse a curse. Winning is big tonic. Look what winning did for OHIO--top attendance and most of us expecting better each year Back to Top Alan Swank General User Member Since: 12/11/2004 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 7,197 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 9:24:27 PM  L.C. wrote: Bcat2 wrote: Another look at their roster. If everyone listed returns they will have; 2 RSr. and 28 Sr.. Seven of the seniors are JUCOs or transfers. Those numbers would usually drive high expectations. So, they will lose 30 more next year? And, here is their depth chart from last year: http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-c... They lost 5 starters from offense, plus 5 second stringers. On defense they lost another 5 starters, and 5 backups. When you lose 20 of your top 44 players, that usually drives low expectations. This is the problem with relying on JUCOs and transfers. Last year they lost 24 Seniors, and next year they will lose another 30. You'd have expected a lot better than 5-7 when virtually the entire top two strings consisted of upperclassmen. They lose half this year, and another half next year, and then who will be left? Will they replace them with more JUCOs? Or will they take their lumps and play young guys? Yes but they have won a MAC championship. Back to Top OhioCatFan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Athens, OH Post Count: 14,661 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/20/2015 10:29:54 PM  Alan Swank wrote: Yes but they have won a MAC championship. This message courtesy of the West Coast Bobcat Club. ;-) The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA "It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right." Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,482 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/21/2015 4:16:04 AM  Akron did win the MAC Championship game in 2005 with their 7-6 team, the only bowl eligible team they have had in the last ten years. Winning the MAC Championship was not a panacea, however; their coach, J.D. Broookhart was fired a few years later. They have also done major facilities upgrades, with a very nice IPF and a brand new stadium, but attendance remains low, and recruiting remains questionable. Last Edited: 2/21/2015 4:20:30 AM by L.C. “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top ZIPsCAT General User Member Since: 9/3/2014 Post Count: 36 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/22/2015 3:21:37 PM  Hey guys, sorry I missed this thread...but I thought I'd give some insight on this. It's hotly debated among the Zips faithful, but the recruiting websites are a bit misleading on our 2015 class. There are 18 players coming in this year: 3 are Greyshirts from last year's class, 2 are Juco and 1 is a Transfer elligible to play this year. In addition to those 18 players, there are also six transfers currently on the roster that will be available this year, each with 2-3 years left of eligibility. There's also 2-3 preferred Walk on's that came around recruiting day that are not featured on the recruiting websites. An updated roster before spring (that isn't online) has freshman-senior classes with these numbers: 27-22-21-29. That's with redshirts and preferred walk-ons. Read into it what you will. The prevailing thought is the Senior QB Kyle Pohl will not be our starter next year, and that he will likely be beaten out by one of the other QB's on the roster (Woodson, Kincade or Chapman). Chapman is the favorite. Hope this gives everyone some insight! Last Edited: 2/22/2015 3:35:46 PM by ZIPsCAT Back to Top Mike Johnson General User Member Since: 11/11/2004 Location: North Canton, OH Post Count: 1,735 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/22/2015 3:44:30 PM  ZIPS_Balszy wrote: Hey guys, sorry I missed this thread...but I thought I'd give some insight on this. It's hotly debated among the Zips faithful, but the recruiting websites are a bit misleading on our 2015 class. There are 18 players coming in this year: 3 are Greyshirts from last year's class, 2 are Juco and 1 is a Transfer elligible to play this year. In addition to those 18 players, there are also six transfers currently on the roster that will be available this year, each with 2-3 years left of eligibility. There's also 2-3 preferred Walk on's that came around recruiting day that are not featured on the recruiting websites. An updated roster before spring (that isn't online) has freshman-senior classes with these numbers: 27-22-21-29. That's with redshirts and preferred walk-ons. Read into it what you will. The prevailing thought is the Senior QB Kyle Pohl will not be our starter next year, and that he will likely be beaten out by one of the other QB's on the roster (Woodson, Kincade or Chapman). Chapman is the favorite. Hope this gives everyone some insight! What are the Zips Faithful saying about Coach Bowden after 3 seasons? How are they viewing progress - as to recruiting, as to wins> Also, how do Zips fans view the IPF as a recruiting tool? And how do they view prospects for appreciably increasing home attendance? http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author Back to Top ZIPsCAT General User Member Since: 9/3/2014 Post Count: 36 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/22/2015 4:06:02 PM  Mike Johnson wrote: What are the Zips Faithful saying about Coach Bowden after 3 seasons? How are they viewing progress - as to recruiting, as to wins> Also, how do Zips fans view the IPF as a recruiting tool? And how do they view prospects for appreciably increasing home attendance? Zips faithful are divided, but most believe year 4 is crucial for Bowden to get over the .500 mark, both as a program and for recruiting. The division is most over how fast this team should be turned around: The Zips were sitting at 4-2 before the wheels came off last season...but should we realistically expect a 3-33 team to be at 7-5 after just 1 season? QB is a major sticking point for the division as well. Most zips fans believe the quality of recruits has improved since Bowden has come in, but are worried over the volume...leading to a "quality vs quantity" debate. The volume and quality of transfers has also drastically improved. Zips fans, for the most part, view the IPF as a huge plus for Akron when compared to the rest of the MAC...but we're not sure how much of it impacts a recruit's decision when the home attendance is pretty terrible. We're all at a loss, however, over the lack of attendance at home games. The Ianello years alienated a lot of fans, and the Athletic Department has almost zero identity in the local community. Everyone still associates Akron with losing and until that narrative is changed on the field, attendance isn't likely to change in any measurable way until then. Back to Top Mike Johnson General User Member Since: 11/11/2004 Location: North Canton, OH Post Count: 1,735 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 1:18:02 PM  ZIPS_Balszy wrote: Mike Johnson wrote: What are the Zips Faithful saying about Coach Bowden after 3 seasons? How are they viewing progress - as to recruiting, as to wins> Also, how do Zips fans view the IPF as a recruiting tool? And how do they view prospects for appreciably increasing home attendance? Zips faithful are divided, but most believe year 4 is crucial for Bowden to get over the .500 mark, both as a program and for recruiting. The division is most over how fast this team should be turned around: The Zips were sitting at 4-2 before the wheels came off last season...but should we realistically expect a 3-33 team to be at 7-5 after just 1 season? QB is a major sticking point for the division as well. Most zips fans believe the quality of recruits has improved since Bowden has come in, but are worried over the volume...leading to a "quality vs quantity" debate. The volume and quality of transfers has also drastically improved. Zips fans, for the most part, view the IPF as a huge plus for Akron when compared to the rest of the MAC...but we're not sure how much of it impacts a recruit's decision when the home attendance is pretty terrible. We're all at a loss, however, over the lack of attendance at home games. The Ianello years alienated a lot of fans, and the Athletic Department has almost zero identity in the local community. Everyone still associates Akron with losing and until that narrative is changed on the field, attendance isn't likely to change in any measurable way until then. As you might recall, last year ABJ columnist Marla Ridenour wrote a piece on why Akron football attendance has been so disappointing. She cited as core reasons an absence of effective marketing and lack of wins. I emailed her, citing campus culture as perhaps the biggest culprit. To wit, as a largely commuter school, I posited that students don't form the same strong bonds with alma mater as do students at more residential schools. Absent those bonds, fewer alumni become ardent supporters. Marla's reply: she agreed. I see the same phenomenon at Kent. The campus largely empties on weekends. We are talking football attendance, but I believe the prevailing campus culture also undercuts attendance for basketball at both Akron and Kent. Their consistent success notwithstanding, seldom do they sell out their smallish, 6,500-seat arenas. Absent a significant change in campus culture, it's difficult to foresee appreciable attendance increases at Akron and Kent. http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author Back to Top ZIPsCAT General User Member Since: 9/3/2014 Post Count: 36 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 1:41:50 PM  Quote: Absent a significant change in campus culture, it's difficult to foresee appreciable attendance increases at Akron and Kent. Bingo. I completely agree with this. This has been one glaring observation that can be made about UA. I'd only go further by saying that the culture itself needs to be self-promoting and to find an identity. I'm a bit ignorant of OU culture so please excuse this question for you guys, I've only been to the campus a handful of times; but what is the campus culture like at OU in regards to faculty/staff/professors...and the relationship to the students? Back to Top L.C. General User Member Since: 8/31/2005 Location: United States Post Count: 10,482 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 1:43:59 PM  Mike Johnson wrote: ...I see the same phenomenon at Kent. The campus largely empties on weekends. ... I know that EMU has this problem as well. How many other MAC schools would this also apply to? “We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus Back to Top Mike Johnson General User Member Since: 11/11/2004 Location: North Canton, OH Post Count: 1,735 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 2:06:06 PM  ZIPS_Balszy wrote: Quote: Absent a significant change in campus culture, it's difficult to foresee appreciable attendance increases at Akron and Kent. Bingo. I completely agree with this. This has been one glaring observation that can be made about UA. I'd only go further by saying that the culture itself needs to be self-promoting and to find an identity. I'm a bit ignorant of OU culture so please excuse this question for you guys, I've only been to the campus a handful of times; but what is the campus culture like at OU in regards to faculty/staff/professors...and the relationship to the students? Although I've remained an involved OU alum, I don't live near Athens and can't comment knowledgeably on the culture "in regards to faculty/staff/professors." I can, though, comment reasonably knowledgeably on the culture as it relates to students and affinity for OU football and basketball. At no university, including OU, do all students become sports fans. Heck the girl I dated who later became my wife managed to get through her OU years without attending a single OU football or basketball game. That said, I believe that OU's somewhat isolated location contributes to many students becoming ardent fans - and then ardent alumni fans. OU's homecoming weekend tends to support that contention. Thousands of alums flock to Athens for homecoming. So do hundreds of band alumni who arrive in time to rehearse and then perform throughout the day. (Three years ago I had as homecoming guests a married couple from The Netherlands. At one point during the day, the man said in wonderment, "We don't have anything like this in The Netherlands.") I recall clearly when my daughter Andrea - OU '94 - was attending orientation. An administrator commented that some 90% of OU students remain in Athens on weekends. At that time we were living a 4-hour drive from Athens. I told Andrea that if she ever wanted to come home for a weekend she would have to geta ride, because I wouldn't do two 8-hour roundtrips for a weekend visit. My son Ben - OU '96 - heard the same message. Each spent 4 years at OU and not once came home for a weekend. That OU consistently is at or near the top in MAC football and basketball attendance I believe results largely from prevailing campus culture. Many students remain on campus on weekends, become fans and remain fans as alums. http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author Back to Top Casper71 General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Post Count: 3,090 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 2:17:43 PM  I can only use UC as an example of a COMMUTER school that has built a football program that is now light years ahead of where it was when you start talking about winning. And, guess what happened? Attendance is now regularly double what it was. My point: YOU WIN AND THE CAMPUS CULTURE WILL CHANGE. approach You really think if you change the Campus Culture the wins will come? I don't think so. After all, why has OHIO's attendance risen lately, some change in Campus Culture or just more consistent Winning? Winning changes attitudes on any Campus! Back to Top Mike Johnson General User Member Since: 11/11/2004 Location: North Canton, OH Post Count: 1,735 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 2:37:31 PM  Casper71 wrote: I can only use UC as an example of a COMMUTER school that has built a football program that is now light years ahead of where it was when you start talking about winning. And, guess what happened? Attendance is now regularly double what it was. My point: YOU WIN AND THE CAMPUS CULTURE WILL CHANGE. approach You really think if you change the Campus Culture the wins will come? I don't think so. After all, why has OHIO's attendance risen lately, some change in Campus Culture or just more consistent Winning? Winning changes attitudes on any Campus! True enough, Casper 71. But I stand by my belief that existing campus culture does contribute positively to attendance for both football and basketball. As I observed above, Akron and Kent, with consistently strong basketball programs, draw poorly. http://www.facebook.com/mikejohnson.author Back to Top Ohio69 General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Post Count: 3,058 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 4:07:01 PM  Someone post that picture of the completely full Bobcat Blackout student section for Zips-Balsy.... As for for the faculty/staff relationship with students.... I'm not sure I fully understand the question. But, I believe there is a great, supportive relationship between faculty/staff and students. A great deal of faculty and staff attend football and basketball games (with their family) as well. As do many local citizens. Winning certainly helps. Can somebody hit a pull up jumper for me?..... Back to Top Jeff McKinney Moderator Member Since: 11/12/2004 Post Count: 6,154 Status: Offline     RE: What's Up at Akron?    Posted: 2/23/2015 4:20:57 PM  I agree with most of the remarks here, but I don't think I'd go so far as to say that Akron draws poorly for basketball. They usually have decent sized, involved crowds. I like going to games there and at Kent for that matter. Back to Top Showing Replies:   1 - 25  of 41 Posts Jump to Page:   1 | 2    Next > View Other 'Ohio Football' Topics                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               WHO'S ONLINE There are 259 Active Visitors on BobcatAttack.com 257 Guests 2 Registered Users:   colobobcat66, Ryan Carey There are no other users looking at this page.

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