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Topic:  BCS teams say no to OHIO

Topic:  BCS teams say no to OHIO
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sargentfan
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  Message Not Read  BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 3:30:19 PM 
It was interesting to see in today's POST article the topic come up about OHIO being unable to get home and home series with BCS teams while other MAC teams do.  Schaus responds basically saying that those same BCS teams willing to do home and home series with other MAC teams don't seem to be interested in doing the same with us.  It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.  Because if Schaus is correct that OHIO is just not getting the love through no fault of our own, it kind of kills some of the arguments on this board.  Now I understand we could always get rid of the FCS-opponent home game and add another BCS-opponent away game, but that would defeat the current plan Schaus has for OHIO.  As some like myself have said we need to build a consistently winning and successful program before we start front-loading our schedule with hard games that could derail seasons for OHIO teams that aren't as resilient and confident.  I am kind of hoping that those future time slots that Schaus mentioned are waiting to be filled after this year or next year to see how the team is progressing.  Because if things continue improving for OHIO we might lure better opponents as well as offers for home and home series against BCS teams.
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 3:32:30 PM 
Seems pretty simply to me: Our stadium only holds 24,000 and we need to sell tickets at a net loss to fill it.  There's no financial upside to BCS schools coming to Athens.
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Jeff McKinney
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 3:41:49 PM 

But these other MAC schools usually aren't drawing more than 24,000 when they have BCS teams in, right?  Might be a few instances where they do, but usually not.  Correct me if I'm wrong here. 
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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:16:09 PM 
sargentfan wrote:
Schaus responds basically saying that those same BCS teams willing to do home and home series with other MAC teams don't seem to be interested in doing the same with us.  It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.


What was said is Bowling Green had Indiana at home but it was a 3 game series. West Virginia has a policy of not playing MAC schools on the road period. If there isn't a school out there among the BCS that will play us 1 for 1 then try to at least sign MWC or CUSA schools in the house on a 1 for 1 basis. Noting Ohio's overall poor track record seems like an excuse IMO for scheduling light. The phone is ringining off the hook for 2016 and beyond so I would hope to see something better at home next time around than SBC or WAC series.

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2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:20:58 PM 
Jeff McKinney wrote:

But these other MAC schools usually aren't drawing more than 24,000 when they have BCS teams in, right?  Might be a few instances where they do, but usually not.  Correct me if I'm wrong here. 




Toledo does better than 24k for BCS teams.  Plus no other school to my knowledge is charging $5 to fill seats for these games.
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Robert Fox
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:28:49 PM 
I don't know that Ohio is regularly charging $5 either. They did for UConn. Anyone else?
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:36:44 PM 
UConn was our last BCS school, correct?
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Robert Fox
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:45:17 PM 
I think that's correct, but that's a mighty short "trend."
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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 5:57:16 PM 
SBH wrote:
Jeff McKinney wrote:

But these other MAC schools usually aren't drawing more than 24,000 when they have BCS teams in, right?  Might be a few instances where they do, but usually not.  Correct me if I'm wrong here. 




Toledo does better than 24k for BCS teams.  Plus no other school to my knowledge is charging $5 to fill seats for these games.




I see Ohio is only charging 10 dollars for the Miami game this year. Yet Marshall is a 30 dollar ticket? 

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2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
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SBH
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 6:13:00 PM 
To lengthen the "trend," I think we can agree that both the Minnesota and Iowa State home games fell far short of sellouts at normal ticket prices.  I'm pretty sure the Pitt game (Frank's first) featured lots of free and discounted tickets.
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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 6:46:43 PM 
SBH wrote:
Seems pretty simply to me: Our stadium only holds 24,000 and we need to sell tickets at a net loss to fill it.  There's no financial upside to BCS schools coming to Athens.


The idea has to be to optimize alumni interest with the schedule. The only way the Bobcats are going to build a strong fanbase is by appealing to alumni. The local community is too poor to support the program by itself. An alternative idea might be to play 2 Big Ten schools on the road for money every year with CUSA schools at home to ensure the 6 home game objective.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 9:43:54 PM 
sargentfan wrote:
It was interesting to see in today's POST article the topic come up about OHIO being unable to get home and home series with BCS teams while other MAC teams do.  Schaus responds basically saying that those same BCS teams willing to do home and home series with other MAC teams don't seem to be interested in doing the same with us.  It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.  Because if Schaus is correct that OHIO is just not getting the love through no fault of our own, it kind of kills some of the arguments on this board.  Now I understand we could always get rid of the FCS-opponent home game and add another BCS-opponent away game, but that would defeat the current plan Schaus has for OHIO.  As some like myself have said we need to build a consistently winning and successful program before we start front-loading our schedule with hard games that could derail seasons for OHIO teams that aren't as resilient and confident.  I am kind of hoping that those future time slots that Schaus mentioned are waiting to be filled after this year or next year to see how the team is progressing.  Because if things continue improving for OHIO we might lure better opponents as well as offers for home and home series against BCS teams.


The article had one error.  Although BSU's game vs. IU is a "home" game, it's scheduled for Lucas Oil Field in Indy.  You'll probably see more IU fans there than BSUers.

I seem to remember that a few years ago some of the scheduling of Big 6 games was handled through the MAC office. Could some arrangement like that help bring some equity to scheduling Big 6 schools?

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anorris
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 10:23:38 PM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
I see Ohio is only charging 10 dollars for the Miami game this year. Yet Marshall is a 30 dollar ticket? 
September Saturday vs. November Tuesday.
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D.A.
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/20/2011 10:29:39 PM 
sargentfan wrote:
It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.


Bingo.  Many here want to espouse their knowledge of "deals gone awry", but no one knows what the contracts/stipulations for each instance were, so I think we largely owe those in position to make the decisions the benefit of the doubt.

The Few, The Proud, The Bobcats!

And for the record, I hate tOSU, and Ricordati and Torgerson are DB's.

"This isn't just another walkover from the MAC." Kirk Herbstreit, another DB, on College Football Gameday
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UpSan Bobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/21/2011 12:59:14 AM 
SBH wrote:
To lengthen the "trend," I think we can agree that both the Minnesota and Iowa State home games fell far short of sellouts at normal ticket prices.  I'm pretty sure the Pitt game (Frank's first) featured lots of free and discounted tickets.




Minnesota attendance in 2003 was listed as 20,227. Iowa State in 2001 was listed as 24,000. Pittsburg game in 2005 listed as 24,545.
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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/21/2011 1:12:54 AM 
D.A. wrote:
sargentfan wrote:
It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.


Bingo.  Many here want to espouse their knowledge of "deals gone awry", but no one knows what the contracts/stipulations for each instance were, so I think we largely owe those in position to make the decisions the benefit of the doubt.


True. The problem though is the weak scheduling method by Schaus(Solich) doing nothing to build the long term fanbase for the program. A weak schedule does raise the probability of an undefeated Bobcat team and that would be the greatest potential boost in interest. Interest around success greatly diminishes when a program drops from 12-0 down to even a record of 10-2. Ohio loses that BCS game and drops a tough MAC game on the road and its 10-2, a sagarin rating of only 50, and completely out of the public eye. Ohio instead plays 2 Big Ten schools a year and 2 games against MWC or CUSA level schools that schedule would make a 10-2 team a top 25 team and bring a sense of pride to the university. The nothing ventured nothing gained approach by Schaus isn't getting the program anywhere. 

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Deciduous Forest Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/21/2011 10:03:49 AM 
SBH wrote:
To lengthen the "trend," I think we can agree that both the Minnesota and Iowa State home games fell far short of sellouts at normal ticket prices.  I'm pretty sure the Pitt game (Frank's first) featured lots of free and discounted tickets.




You're right about minnesota, but Iowa state was the first home game after the renovations and was a packed house.
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D.A.
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/21/2011 10:49:11 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
D.A. wrote:
sargentfan wrote:
It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.


Bingo.  Many here want to espouse their knowledge of "deals gone awry", but no one knows what the contracts/stipulations for each instance were, so I think we largely owe those in position to make the decisions the benefit of the doubt.


True. The problem though is the weak scheduling method by Schaus(Solich) doing nothing to build the long term fanbase for the program. A weak schedule does raise the probability of an undefeated Bobcat team and that would be the greatest potential boost in interest. Interest around success greatly diminishes when a program drops from 12-0 down to even a record of 10-2. Ohio loses that BCS game and drops a tough MAC game on the road and its 10-2, a sagarin rating of only 50, and completely out of the public eye. Ohio instead plays 2 Big Ten schools a year and 2 games against MWC or CUSA level schools that schedule would make a 10-2 team a top 25 team and bring a sense of pride to the university. The nothing ventured nothing gained approach by Schaus isn't getting the program anywhere. 


I'm all for two for one's with buyout clauses or one offs at BCS schools, and only having five homes at Peden every year, a la today's Kent article because I always have to travel to see the Cats.  How about the season ticket holders residing in Ohio, or better yet the students that are the primary revenue stream for athletics funding?  Do they deserve six home games?

The Few, The Proud, The Bobcats!

And for the record, I hate tOSU, and Ricordati and Torgerson are DB's.

"This isn't just another walkover from the MAC." Kirk Herbstreit, another DB, on College Football Gameday
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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/21/2011 11:18:08 AM 
D.A. wrote:
Uncle Wes wrote:
D.A. wrote:
sargentfan wrote:
It would be interesting to see what the reasons for this are and if the type of home and home agreement we want differs than what the other MAC schools proposed.


Bingo.  Many here want to espouse their knowledge of "deals gone awry", but no one knows what the contracts/stipulations for each instance were, so I think we largely owe those in position to make the decisions the benefit of the doubt.


True. The problem though is the weak scheduling method by Schaus(Solich) doing nothing to build the long term fanbase for the program. A weak schedule does raise the probability of an undefeated Bobcat team and that would be the greatest potential boost in interest. Interest around success greatly diminishes when a program drops from 12-0 down to even a record of 10-2. Ohio loses that BCS game and drops a tough MAC game on the road and its 10-2, a sagarin rating of only 50, and completely out of the public eye. Ohio instead plays 2 Big Ten schools a year and 2 games against MWC or CUSA level schools that schedule would make a 10-2 team a top 25 team and bring a sense of pride to the university. The nothing ventured nothing gained approach by Schaus isn't getting the program anywhere. 


I'm all for two for one's with buyout clauses or one offs at BCS schools, and only having five homes at Peden every year, a la today's Kent article because I always have to travel to see the Cats.  How about the season ticket holders residing in Ohio, or better yet the students that are the primary revenue stream for athletics funding?  Do they deserve six home games?


Yes they deserve 6 home games. We have to have 6 games at home as 1 or 2 will be moved to a midweek timeslot almost every year for ESPN. If it truely is that difficult to get a BCS to play in Athens on a 1 for 1 basis then try to sign series with better mid majors. We have a CUSA on the schedule every year with Marshall and due to money purposes that makes a lot of sense to continue. Its that far away WAC game that doesn't make a lot of economic sense. Idaho and NMSU are extremely difficult to attend from Southern Ohio. Why aren't we playing Army and Navy often in 2 for 2 type of series like other MAC schools or at least upgrade to solid MWC teams. A Fresno State or Air Force series would be better than what we have now. There is no reason with the program built under Solich that we should continue to sign the dregs of FBS to 1 and 1 series. 

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2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 1:08:19 AM 
Winning solves every problem.

Wait until there's that 16 team playoff all you fools want.  What, about 12 conferences will be guaranteed spots.  MAC won't.  MAC will be left to hope to be considered for one of the at-large spots.  Which will probably never happen.  So, then, if they still exist we can go to a non-playoff bowl game.  Which no one will care about at all, since the playoff games will get all the attention.

Playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.

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TWT
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 4:18:41 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Winning solves every problem.

Wait until there's that 16 team playoff all you fools want.  What, about 12 conferences will be guaranteed spots.  MAC won't.  MAC will be left to hope to be considered for one of the at-large spots.  Which will probably never happen.  So, then, if they still exist we can go to a non-playoff bowl game.  Which no one will care about at all, since the playoff games will get all the attention.

Playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.


I don't see a playoff happening Monroe so you have nothing to worry about. The trend we are seeing from the BCS boys is they are gradually getting their domination down to an exact science. Gone are the days like the Tangerine Bowl where the MAC #1 played the SEC #4 in Orlando. The Big East would be lucky to get that matchup with the SEC today.  I love the way Ohio has taken the program to another level under Solich and ESPN games. The football budget is now tops among the MAC. The postseason system though offers little mobility. That is why I'm focused on scheduling, its the one thing in our control that we could be doing a better job of. At a minimum if Ohio's going to continue the 1 BCS game a year thing it has to be against a Penn State, Notre Dame, Nebraska type of opponent. Playing Rutgers for a payday as the BCS on the schedule when the cats may be favored to win isn't the answer.

Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round
2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl
2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086

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Robert Fox
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 8:48:57 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.


Actually it's: Poorly designed playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.  It sounds to me like you're anti-playoff only because you expect to get screwed in the process. While that may be true, your problem is not necessarily with a playoff. Your problem is with the process.
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JSF
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 11:08:07 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:

Playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.


Death sentence? It's already dead.

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Pataskala
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 2:59:49 PM 
JSF wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:

Playoff system = death sentence for MAC football.


Death sentence? It's already dead.


Not dead, just very ill.  Just as in basketball, where the so-called mid-majors have two tiers (with the MAC in the lower tier), non-AQ football has developed into two tiers --  WAC and MWC are the upper and the MAC, CUSA and Sun Belt are the lower. 

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Jeff McKinney
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  Message Not Read  RE: BCS teams say no to OHIO
   Posted: 5/22/2011 5:03:17 PM 
I agree that a playoff system couldn't make anything worse for MAC football than it already is.

I think the most likely system would have the 11 conference champions plus five at-larges.  Monroe, I don't know where you're coming up with 12 conferences. 
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