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Ohio Basketball

Topic: Plus / Minus...

Topic: Plus / Minus...

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Bobcat Love
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
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Plus / Minus...

Posted: 12/30/2010 9:32:31 PM

On the postgame show, Groce mentioned sorting through the team's +/- stats.

Can anyone post those through the Temple or NSU game? Would like to see.

Couldn't find them anywhere upon first look.

JSF
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Member Since: 1/29/2005
Location: Houston, TX
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 12/30/2010 9:54:58 PM

The question is whether they're looking at individual or unit plus/minus. I don't think there's much worth in individual, but for units there is.

I think that's a stat the team keeps itself and does not release.

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Bobcat Love
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 12/30/2010 10:16:43 PM

Agree they are probably looking at it by specific rotation, but I would still like to see the Individual +/- which I am unable to find. I'll have Ted piece together everything else in his spare time.

potstirred
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/1/2011 1:49:36 PM

WIN=+ Loss=- Nothing else matters

tiptondevilcat
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/1/2011 8:32:21 PM

Butler used to have a board member who kept this stat updated all year long for each individual player. They have now migrated that to a new thread which uses NBA efficiency statistics (maybe because they now have a player in the NBA they upgraded?).

The discussion seems to be that the new analysis favors offensive minded players at the expense of guys who are more apt or prone to find success on the defensive end which is a Butler trademark. I am not an advocate of one method over another but my eyeball test tells me when certain players are on the floor the team is better regardless of whether the kid is scoring, facilitating or making the Offense or Defense better.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/1/2011 9:37:42 PM

First, defense.

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doubledribble
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/2/2011 11:00:56 AM

Monroe, you are spot on. Defense, or the lack of it will tell the tale with this team. If the Bobcats are to be competitive night in and night out in the MAC, they are going to have to show improved consistency at the defensive end and on the glass. The league is terrible....probably the worst it has ever been from my seat, and I have been close to it for many many years from some different angles, so that could help us!

JSF
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/2/2011 11:28:38 AM

Defense doesn't matter if you can't score. Offense doesn't matter if you can't defend.

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/2/2011 1:26:41 PM

Bobcat Dragon wrote:

Defense doesn't matter if you can't score. Offense doesn't matter if you can't defend.

?? The light is only on when it's not off.

Defense first because it can win for you even if your offense is uneven or not so good at all. Also, it seems more a product of thinking, effort and coaching than pure skill. Seems to me that a team can will it's way to solid defense more readily than it can will it's way to solid offense.

When I played, setback to the game that it was, I was rather horrid on offense but could stay on stay on the court due to thinking effort on defense and rebounding.

Plus, it was my ball. If I didn't get choosed I'd take it and go home.

JSF
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/2/2011 4:55:20 PM

And offense can win if you can't keep the other guy from scoring so much.

We can go back and forth forever. The point is: It's not an either/or proposition.

bobcat2nc
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Member Since: 12/28/2004
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/3/2011 9:35:34 AM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

[

When I played, setback to the game that it was, I was rather horrid on offense but could stay on stay on the court due to thinking effort on defense and rebounding.

Plus, it was my ball. If I didn't get choosed I'd take it and go home.

Monroe..That sounds like me..only most of the time it was MY COURT too :)

When a game gets close a couple of key defensive stops (or lack of them) seems to set the tone for the game more than things on the offensive end, at least in my opinion.

Ted Thompson
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/10/2011 10:32:33 AM

Funny that you mention this because over the last few years I've passively looked at a way to do this. I figured I could get each game into spreadsheet form and then put into a database for analysis. Only I didn't know all the data fields I wanted to capture or in what form. There is someone that does individual plus/minus for all college players and I can point you in that direction if you want.

However, according to Ken Pomeroy, maybe I shouldn't waste my time:
http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/a_treatise_on_plus_minus/

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JSF
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Location: Houston, TX
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RE: Plus / Minus...

Posted: 1/10/2011 10:47:39 AM

Man, I denounced it a full two weeks before Pomeroy did. Go me.

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