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Topic: Senderoff to Kent...

Topic: Senderoff to Kent...

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Bobcat Love
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Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/6/2011 7:17:08 PM

Done.

O-zone should have plenty of fodder for him.

ts1227
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/6/2011 7:34:53 PM

http://www.kentstatesports.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releas...

bornacatfan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/6/2011 8:18:52 PM

Even the wicked get a reprieve.

He fits the culture. Sweet move Laing.

never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Winter comes and asks how you spent your summer.....

The game loves and rewards those who love and reward the game

BobcatGman
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/7/2011 2:21:43 PM

1st order of business for Senderoff, he needs to hire a Lawyer and a Parole Officer as Assistant Coaches, cuz he's gonna need them.

--------------------------------------

Dennis "Gman" " DON'T FLINCH "

bornacatfan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/7/2011 4:40:40 PM

Holy moly

dakich melted down on Senderhoof, McCallum and Sampson today. Sent him an email telling him to put that podcast up but I think he will it go.

Scathing and blatantly honest about the culture those folks had let go in Bloomington and the disgust he felt when he walked into the whole mess. Not happy that "Cheaters and slime" get places onthe coaching tree without the NCAA doing anything of substance.

ts1227
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/7/2011 7:31:35 PM

His show-cause order isn't up until November, but the NCAA must not really care (or Kent proved that they are hiring a reformed man).

Unfortunately, they probably figured since it was a MAC school, no one really cared.

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/7/2011 11:26:02 PM

It's up in a few weeks, not November.

"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

ts1227
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/8/2011 8:01:59 AM

JSF wrote:

It's up in a few weeks, not November.

Ah, OK. I couldn't find anything regarding actual dates, so I assumed it was just 3 years from when they issued it (Nov. 08)

OhioCatFan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/14/2011 10:17:16 PM

This hire is a microcosm of what's wrong with college athletics as is the UK men's basketball program. Coach does wrong, school suffers, coach moves on to next job. This is not to say that people can't change and learn from their mistakes. Forgiveness is important when the facts warrant, but what he have now is no accountability for the perps of these bad deeds except for the institutions -- no personal accountability. The system is a mess.

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/15/2011 8:32:33 AM

What? You're 100% wrong. Senderoff paid a big penalty. If Kent didn't hire him, there's a decent chance he's out of the profession.

OhioCatFan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/15/2011 10:37:35 PM

Oh, I see your logic, being hired at Kent was a stinging penalty. Nah . . . the only way I'd buy this argument was if he was hired at Oxford Tech. But wouldn't that be "cruel and unusual punishment" prohibited by the US Constitution?

Edit: A so-called "show cause" penalty isn't much. Sounds harsh, but it really doesn't have any teeth.

Last Edited: 4/15/2011 10:43:51 PM by OhioCatFan

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/16/2011 9:00:17 AM

No, you don't see my logic. Again, if Kent didn't hire him, he's more than likely out of the profession. He was nuclear. Nobody wanted to touch him. If you think the show cause is no big deal, I don't know what to tell you. It's nicknamed the death penalty for a reason. Ask a certain former Columbus coach if he thinks it's nothing to worry about.

Flomo-genized
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/16/2011 9:47:01 AM

Sure the show cause penalty could have been damaging, but in reality he never skipped a beat. He got hired at Kent, and is now a head coach at one of the best mid-major stepping stone jobs in the country. So, at the end of the day, at most it forced him to take a step back from IU to Kent, and cost him some salary, but career wise it hasn't had any real impact so far. Maybe it will in a couple years if he is unable to move up to a better job, but for the time being his actual punishment served has been minimal.

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/16/2011 3:43:33 PM

It has certainly hurt his salary the last few years.

OhioCatFan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/16/2011 5:36:51 PM

JSF wrote:

I'm not buying that. If Kent hadn't hired him back, he'd have hooked on somewhere else. These coaches all seem to have a way to get back in the game after they and/or their institutions are hit with penalties.

The last real penalties that the NCAA handed down in D1 where the "death penalty" to SMU in football and USL in basketball. Bobby Collins, the head man at SMU, had his reputation totally ruined, and he was never able to find a D1 coaching gig again. It seems that the NCAA either does slaps on the wrists or throws the nuclear bomb. There doesn't seem to be much in between. I guess I'm for lobing the occasional nuclear bomb, it keeps 'em on their toes. However, I must admit that the Sampson-Senderoff thing was probably not nuclear-bomb worthy, but something a little harsher than a "show cause" should have been in order. As it was Sampson got a $750,000 "settlement" from IU and now has an assistant coaching job in the NBA. I wouldn't at all be surprised to see him as a head collegiate coach again. Again, that's OK, if he is truly repentant, but I really think the initial penalties on these perps ought to be more than it is.

Here, compliments of the ever semi-accurate wikipedia, is a list of what real penalties look like:

The death penalty is the popular term for the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA)'s power to ban a school from competing in a sport for at least one year. It is the harshest penalty that an NCAA member school can receive.

It has been implemented only five times:

The University of Kentucky basketball program for the 1952–53 season.
The basketball program at the University of Southwestern Louisiana (now the University of Louisiana at Lafayette) for the 1973-74 and 1974-75 seasons
The Southern Methodist University football program for the 1987 and 1988 seasons.
The Division II college soccer program at Morehouse College for the 2004 and 2005 seasons.
The Division III Men's Tennis program at MacMurray College for the 2005-06 and 2006-07 season

Last Edited: 4/16/2011 5:40:55 PM by OhioCatFan

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/17/2011 9:43:56 AM

I would be surprised to see Sampson back in the NCAA. He's in the NBA now. Is the NBA supposed to punish him for something he did while working in another industry?

bornacatfan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/18/2011 12:03:41 AM

Flomo-genized wrote:

, but for the time being his actual punishment served has been minimal.

This is TRUE

You want to hear how little it means callinto the Dakich show and get him statrted on just how little the NCAA has affected any of the lives of the guys who trashed tthe entire IU program. As soon as Samsons time is up some yutz university will take a chance on him .

in most places the creem is allowed to rise to the top...in the NCAA it is often covered by rising slime.

JSF ....your comments are without base. Senderhoff and McCallum (yes he is a personal friend and a Muncie Guy) should have both been tossed along with Samson for their part not onlyin the infractions but for the culture of the program they created. Athletes coming into their next university with more than 14hours of phys ed credits and other discrepancies with regard to the APR progress on their transcript should go back ot hose coaches who created the problem and the SHOULD be kept away from ALL college athletes for some period of time. Unless you have spent time talking to and listening to AD's and coaches discussing the individuals and who would hire them I dont think you have any business telling this board they were "nuclear" because Detroit jumped on Ray and IMHO Senderhoff had more than Kent to fall back on.

Last Edited: 4/18/2011 12:11:22 AM by bornacatfan

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/18/2011 9:58:47 AM

Dude, I didn't say anything about McCallum. Don't shove those words in my mouth. And I have spoken to people, including those in the Kent AD, so it's your comments that are off base.

Last Edited: 4/18/2011 9:59:53 AM by JSF

bornacatfan
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 9:59:29 AM

One of the reasons I really enjoyed being away from here for a year was that I have been at home in a Rivals.com place full of men who have seen way more hoops than me and bills itself as being for only the most serious of Hoosier Hysteria faithful - The thinking man's civil place to discuss basketball....where folks do not twist what you say and actually think about what they are replying to because most of the guys there actually know way more about hoops than those of us who have only been around the game on the margins. I have enjoyed being back here as I still have a passion for Ohio and the fanbase here especially those who have acquired or renewed a thirst for Ohio Basketball under the Groce regime. Hopefully some of that ambience of the Rivals site oozes over here and the joke about dealing with facts here gets abolished someday.

I am sure if you got that Senderhoff "could have beenout of the profession had we not hired him" from a Kent AD then that has to be the opinion of 341 other schools AD's , donors and Head Coac hes. \

Same thing with Samson. OCF is correct in saying these penalties mean nothing. The NCAA has no sack. Calhoun gets suspended and is allowed to caoh while another athlete is immediately suspended during his conference tourney because his mother accepted and repaid loans for rent from his AAU coach his freshman year in HS. Calhoun nor samson nor senderhoof nor McCallum got anything near what they should have for the roles they played. And because of the the penalties willlapse and someon has or will hire each of them and let them around kids and parents again.

If you want to put words in my mouth .....OK I guess. My tirade on McCallum and Senderhoff was an indictment of all the culture surrounding the program as I have understood it firsthand from Players, Alums, Donors, Coaches in the system and out, Admins in the program and out, guys on Peegs.com with first hand knowledge of all the characters in the play..... and after listening to all .....evaaluating and rethinking as new info comes to light I replied. I never put any words in your mouth and I did not imply anything as I am not convinced you would even know who Ray McCallum or any of the dozens of characters not alluded to on the ESPN ticker is......but ya know what ....you just go right on ahead and be right....i really dont care .....I will just be over here....a littel off base not knowing anything of which i speak.

Last Edited: 4/19/2011 10:12:28 AM by bornacatfan

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 10:44:58 AM

bornacatfan wrote:

I am sure if you got that Senderhoff "could have beenout of the profession had we not hired him" from a Kent AD then that has to be the opinion of 341 other schools AD's , donors and Head Coac hes.

Oh man, you're right. I should have talked to several people involved with every D-I program. That was a huge misfire on my part.

bornacatfan wrote:

I never put any words in your mouth

That's exactly what you did. I quote: "Unless you have spent time talking to and listening to AD's and coaches discussing the individuals and who would hire them I dont think you have any business telling this board they were "nuclear" because Detroit jumped on Ray and IMHO Senderhoff had more than Kent to fall back on."

You used the word "they," including McCallum, who I never even came close to talking about. That is putting words in my mouth. It's your opinion that Senderoff had more than Kent. Similarly, it's my opinion that he really didn't. If the IU thing doesn't happen, he never steps foot in the MAC Center. If the IU scandal doesn't happen, he's not their coach today. If the Sampson violations didn't happen, bigger schools won't hesitate to hire Senderoff when he's a success at Kent (and I bet they will). Did the punishment fit the crime? That's a matter for debate, but there's no question in my mind it set his career back a few years and cost him several hundred thousand dollars. Kent got to hire him below what market value would have been. Pretty significant to me, at least. Laing Kennedy, never one to waste an opportunity, essentially threw the man a life preserver. Without it, he would have been trying not to drown. That is the conclusion I've come to with the information and conversations I've had. You can disagree if you like, but try to do it like an adult.

bornacatfan wrote:

and I did not imply anything as I am not convinced you would even know who Ray McCallum or any of the dozens of characters not alluded to on the ESPN ticker is

McCallum is a professional bowler, right? I don't know who he is.

bornacatfan wrote:

......but ya know what ....you just go right on ahead and be right....i really dont care .....I will just be over here....a littel off base not knowing anything of which i speak.

I know it's almost Easter, but the martyr act is a bit much.

Mike Coleman
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 11:51:00 AM

JSF wrote:

If the IU thing doesn't happen, he never steps foot in the MAC Center. If the IU scandal doesn't happen, he's not their coach today.

I'm not sure why you say that. The MAC has had a ton of top assistants from the Big 10 start out in the MAC. Like, you know, John Groce. Even IU. Like Dakich.

JSF
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 12:14:35 PM

Mike Coleman wrote:

JSF wrote:

If the IU thing doesn't happen, he never steps foot in the MAC Center. If the IU scandal doesn't happen, he's not their coach today.

I'm not sure why you say that. The MAC has had a ton of top assistants from the Big 10 start out in the MAC. Like, you know, John Groce. Even IU. Like Dakich.

I say that because of his career trajectory. He already left Kent to be an assistant at Indiana. He ended up back in Kent because of the scandal. And considering he was hired to be Kent's head man mainly to keep program continuity, I think it's a reasonable conclusion the Sampson scandal is the main reason he ended up in Kent a second time and why he's their coach now. I think he would've been hired to lead another program by now had the scandal never taken place. Is it possible he ends up Kent's coach anyway? Sure, but it's not probable.

bobcatsquared
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 1:05:44 PM

bornacatfan wrote:

And to think all of us ignorant basketball fans from Ohio survived your 1-year sabbatical.

Donuts
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 1:33:44 PM

bornacatfan wrote:

Seriously, that is one of the most stuck up things I have read. Since we probably can't be on your level, you should probably go back to your other message board. You know, the one filled with all those great basketball minds that decided to pick chatting on a Rivals message board over actually doing productive things in the basketball community. They have all that great knowledge they picked up by obsessing over 15-18 year olds playing basketball in one stoplight towns "the Indiana (or right, since that's interchangeable) way."

Mike Coleman
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RE: Senderoff to Kent...

Posted: 4/19/2011 2:00:11 PM

JSF wrote:

Mike Coleman wrote:

JSF wrote:

If the IU thing doesn't happen, he never steps foot in the MAC Center. If the IU scandal doesn't happen, he's not their coach today.

I'm not sure why you say that. The MAC has had a ton of top assistants from the Big 10 start out in the MAC. Like, you know, John Groce. Even IU. Like Dakich.

You could be right. I guess it's about as probable as Boals coming back to coach Ohio, but a lot of people on here are hoping.

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