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If all the recruits make it here, we will be much better than this year in that area and I'm looking forward to that. Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 8:32:47 AM  It has to be one of the most frustrating things to watch is seeing your team get pounded on the glass.  It's demoralizing to see your guys get a defensive stop and force a miss, only to see an offensive rebound give a 2nd or sometimes 3rd chance to score.  I think it was a big three ball Evans hit on Saturday came after an offensive board.  It would be scary to think about how badly we could be beating teams right now if we could clean up the glass, but at this point in a season, you are who you are.  It's not going to change now.  Let's just hope it doesn't bite us in the rear in March! Back to Top Chicken George General User Member Since: 1/2/2005 Post Count: 765 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 9:31:00 AM  As I posted elsewhere, with this concern in mind versus the more physical teams I'm surprised we don't play a lineup of DJ, Walt, TJ or Nick, Reggie and Kadeem/Smith more often.    Why not play two of the bigger guys together, especially when Ivo is doing nothing.  I think had Kadeem got more minutes up to this point, he would've more more than serviceable to just rebound and play physical.  Wouldn't get you many points, but then again the guys playing the 4 spot aren't either and why not at least insert a guy that can help you bang/rebound when you're getting killed in that area? Back to Top OUVan General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Bethesda, MD Post Count: 5,580 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 9:50:11 AM  Chicken George wrote: As I posted elsewhere, with this concern in mind versus the more physical teams I'm surprised we don't play a lineup of DJ, Walt, TJ or Nick, Reggie and Kadeem/Smith more often.    Why not play two of the bigger guys together, especially when Ivo is doing nothing.  I think had Kadeem got more minutes up to this point, he would've more more than serviceable to just rebound and play physical.  Wouldn't get you many points, but then again the guys playing the 4 spot aren't either and why not at least insert a guy that can help you bang/rebound when you're getting killed in that area? So you are worried about getting pounded on the boards and you want to sit our best defensive rebounder? Back to Top Casper71 General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Post Count: 3,090 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 10:02:37 AM  Let's face it, when you play dj, offut and nick as much as we do you are undersized at the #3 position, add in a 4 who is not a terrific rebounder and what do you expect?  Good news is we can shoot the ball and offut can usually beat his man with speed to the hoop offensively.  As someone said, at this point, we are what we are. Back to Top bigtillyoopsupsideurhead General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 1,926 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 10:13:45 AM  Chicken George wrote: As I posted elsewhere, with this concern in mind versus the more physical teams I'm surprised we don't play a lineup of DJ, Walt, TJ or Nick, Reggie and Kadeem/Smith more often.    Why not play two of the bigger guys together, especially when Ivo is doing nothing.  I think had Kadeem got more minutes up to this point, he would've more more than serviceable to just rebound and play physical.  Wouldn't get you many points, but then again the guys playing the 4 spot aren't either and why not at least insert a guy that can help you bang/rebound when you're getting killed in that area? People want to rag on Ivo, but the fact is that he is our best defensive rebounder. Here are the defensive rebound rates for everyone on our team. (Courtesy of kenpom.com) Cooper - 10.3 Keely - 15.9 Hall - 8.5 Taylor - 4.5 Offutt - 10.9 Baltic - 18.3 Johnson - 13.2 Kellogg - 9.2 Wilkins - 5.7 Smith - 14.8 Back to Top Chicken George General User Member Since: 1/2/2005 Post Count: 765 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 10:16:29 AM  No brainer decision in that when Ivo is playing the way we know he can play, he adds an element to the team nobody on the roster can replace.  Running the floor, attacking the room, driving/slashing---problem is, that guys been MIA for months.  I watched the tape of the Kent State game again yesterday and when the balls in the air Ivo's bailed out of the lane, especially on the offensive end.  In fact, he's running to the 3 pt. arch or releasing.  I will give TJ credit, when the balls in the air he's trying, but he's simply not a great inside player.  But if you watch, TJ is trying to add support.  Your point is that statistically he's averaging a bunch of defensive boards.  I just think that if Ivo's not providing any offensive production, Kadeem would get all the rebounds Ivo's getting and more.  Kadeem doesn't have an offensive game that we've seen so far and just hangs around the basket.  Against teams like Kent and Akron that is an attribute we could use versus a guy who wants no part of the paint. Back to Top mf279801 General User Member Since: 8/6/2010 Location: Newark, DE Post Count: 2,473 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 10:20:59 AM  Chicken George wrote: No brainer decision in that when Ivo is playing the way we know he can play, he adds an element to the team nobody on the roster can replace.  Running the floor, attacking the room, driving/slashing---problem is, that guys been MIA for months.  I watched the tape of the Kent State game again yesterday and when the balls in the air Ivo's bailed out of the lane, especially on the offensive end.  In fact, he's running to the 3 pt. arch or releasing.  I will give TJ credit, when the balls in the air he's trying, but he's simply not a great inside player.  But if you watch, TJ is trying to add support.  Your point is that statistically he's averaging a bunch of defensive boards.  I just think that if Ivo's not providing any offensive production, Kadeem would get all the rebounds Ivo's getting and more.  Kadeem doesn't have an offensive game that we've seen so far and just hangs around the basket.  Against teams like Kent and Akron that is an attribute we could use versus a guy who wants no part of the paint. I don't think its a given that Kadeem would out-board Ivo. Back to Top bigtillyoopsupsideurhead General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Location: Cincinnati Post Count: 1,926 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 11:04:01 AM  mf279801 wrote: Chicken George wrote: No brainer decision in that when Ivo is playing the way we know he can play, he adds an element to the team nobody on the roster can replace.  Running the floor, attacking the room, driving/slashing---problem is, that guys been MIA for months.  I watched the tape of the Kent State game again yesterday and when the balls in the air Ivo's bailed out of the lane, especially on the offensive end.  In fact, he's running to the 3 pt. arch or releasing.  I will give TJ credit, when the balls in the air he's trying, but he's simply not a great inside player.  But if you watch, TJ is trying to add support.  Your point is that statistically he's averaging a bunch of defensive boards.  I just think that if Ivo's not providing any offensive production, Kadeem would get all the rebounds Ivo's getting and more.  Kadeem doesn't have an offensive game that we've seen so far and just hangs around the basket.  Against teams like Kent and Akron that is an attribute we could use versus a guy who wants no part of the paint. I don't think its a given that Kadeem would out-board Ivo. I just went and looked it up on statsheet.com and it appears Kadeem's DREB% this year is 18.2. Nearly identical to Ivo's.  Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 11:14:42 AM  I think anyone paying attention to the game Saturday has to question what is going on in Ivo's head.  Like I said before, I don't think it's a physical effort issue, it's mental.  How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  He had a lane violation on a made free throw.  The pass he threw to Offutt on the sequence that led to Taylor's three was thrown at Walt's feet and was nearly a turnover.  He has plays like that, but then can have a big putback dunk, knock down a jumper, or make a good cut to the rim for a layup.  You just have to take the good with the bad, I guess.  Ivo giveth and Ivo taketh away. Last Edited: 2/18/2013 11:15:44 AM by 100%Cat Back to Top colobobcat66 General User Member Since: 9/1/2006 Location: Watching the bobcats run outside my window., CO Post Count: 4,552 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 11:15:35 AM  Frankly, I was thinking the answer would come from 1 or more of the new guys instead of anyone currently on the roster. I like J Smith a lot, but he has not been a scorer. Potentially we can get some scoring with the rebounds with any of the new tall guys . I know they will be new to the system JC is running this year, but the 2 JC guys aren't like guys just out of HS maturity wise and should hit the floor running, I hope. By the way, is Green not playing because of an injury or what? Last Edited: 2/18/2013 11:21:35 AM by colobobcat66 Back to Top UpSan Bobcat General User Member Since: 8/30/2005 Location: Upper Sandusky, OH Post Count: 3,812 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 11:56:42 AM  bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote: mf279801 wrote: Chicken George wrote: No brainer decision in that when Ivo is playing the way we know he can play, he adds an element to the team nobody on the roster can replace.  Running the floor, attacking the room, driving/slashing---problem is, that guys been MIA for months.  I watched the tape of the Kent State game again yesterday and when the balls in the air Ivo's bailed out of the lane, especially on the offensive end.  In fact, he's running to the 3 pt. arch or releasing.  I will give TJ credit, when the balls in the air he's trying, but he's simply not a great inside player.  But if you watch, TJ is trying to add support.  Your point is that statistically he's averaging a bunch of defensive boards.  I just think that if Ivo's not providing any offensive production, Kadeem would get all the rebounds Ivo's getting and more.  Kadeem doesn't have an offensive game that we've seen so far and just hangs around the basket.  Against teams like Kent and Akron that is an attribute we could use versus a guy who wants no part of the paint. I don't think its a given that Kadeem would out-board Ivo. I just went and looked it up on statsheet.com and it appears Kadeem's DREB% this year is 18.2. Nearly identical to Ivo's.  It's a very small sample size, though, and a good portion of it is in the final minutes of blowouts, so it's hard to say how it would translate into extended playing time when it matters. However, again in a small sample, Kadeem seemed to rebound pretty well for Missouri. Still a lot to be seen about what he really can bring to the table. Back to Top Pataskala General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: At least six feet away from anybody else Post Count: 9,365 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 12:19:14 PM  100%Cat wrote: How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  . I don't know.  How many? We will get by. We will get by. We will get by. We will survive. Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 1:13:22 PM  Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  . I don't know.  How many? I remember it happening at least 3 times.  That's a real "heady" play from a senior. (<--sarcasm alert) Back to Top bobcat695 General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Parkersburg, WV Post Count: 1,345 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 2:13:45 PM  Ohio is a smaller than average team built for speed and outside shooting.  The team gets out-rebounded by an average of 4 rebounds/game.  But, they average 4.3 steals/game more than the opponents.  In terms of possessions, it is even.  Plus, we have one of the best shooting percentages in the nation, coupled with making an average of 3.5 more 3 pt FGs/game than our opponents.  A team can lose one statistical category, but more than make up for it in another.   Our recruiting classes may be full of large bodies built for rebounding, but with that comes a change.  We will not have nearly as many steals, assists or 3 point shots made.  I'm not saying I disagree with a bigger lineup, but it will shift where our strengths are.   The stat that drives me nuts is FT shooting percentage.  If we are going to have a smaller lineup loaded with shooters, I think they should be able to make more than 69% as a team, especially when our big men shoot free throws pretty well.   "You can't un-fist a fist pump." - Saul Phillips 1/24/15 Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 2:24:44 PM  bobcat695 wrote: Ohio is a smaller than average team built for speed and outside shooting.  The team gets out-rebounded by an average of 4 rebounds/game.  But, they average 4.3 steals/game more than the opponents.  In terms of possessions, it is even.  Plus, we have one of the best shooting percentages in the nation, coupled with making an average of 3.5 more 3 pt FGs/game than our opponents.  A team can lose one statistical category, but more than make up for it in another.   Our recruiting classes may be full of large bodies built for rebounding, but with that comes a change.  We will not have nearly as many steals, assists or 3 point shots made.  I'm not saying I disagree with a bigger lineup, but it will shift where our strengths are.   The stat that drives me nuts is FT shooting percentage.  If we are going to have a smaller lineup loaded with shooters, I think they should be able to make more than 69% as a team, especially when our big men shoot free throws pretty well.   I've been pleasantly surprised in Jon Smith's free throw shooting this year.  I just checked the stats to see what the specific averages are, he is up 10% from last year shooting them at 78%.  He doesn't get a ton of attempts, but he makes good on what he gets.  Coop has had some poor free throw games, I'll chalk Saturday up to the illness.  Ricardo has been disappointing at the stripe. Even though DJ has dipped in free throw stats, I have confidence he gets them late in the game at crunch time. Back to Top Ohio69 General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Post Count: 3,062 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 2:36:34 PM  Pretty sure we got dominated in rebounding last year too.  Didn't seem to matter much. Can somebody hit a pull up jumper for me?..... Back to Top Pataskala General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: At least six feet away from anybody else Post Count: 9,365 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 2:36:45 PM  100%Cat wrote: Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  . I don't know.  How many? I remember it happening at least 3 times.  That's a real "heady" play from a senior. (<--sarcasm alert) Unfortunately, that's not a stat anybody keeps, because it's so subjective, so it's really just your opinion, which you're entitled to, even if it is wrong. We will get by. We will get by. We will get by. We will survive. Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 3:16:04 PM  Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  . I don't know.  How many? I remember it happening at least 3 times.  That's a real "heady" play from a senior. (<--sarcasm alert) Unfortunately, that's not a stat anybody keeps, because it's so subjective, so it's really just your opinion, which you're entitled to, even if it is wrong. Do you watch the games?  Or just read box scores?  I'm not trying to insult you by asking that question, but I think it's a logical question to ask with that type of reply.  Last time I checked, lane violations aren't a mainstream stat I can find on ESPN.com, either.  So that doesn't matter?  That point wasn't important in a game that goes to OT?  Bad passes that don't lead to turnovers aren't a stat, either...so they must not make any difference in a game, either.  Coach Christian even commended Walt in the post game interview for handling such a bad pass from Ivo.  Leaving your feet to pass the ball when you don't know where you're going with the ball is a horrible, horrible play in basketball.   It is not coached, ever.  There's a reason for that.  Back to Top Pataskala General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: At least six feet away from anybody else Post Count: 9,365 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 3:24:44 PM  100%Cat wrote: Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: Pataskala wrote: 100%Cat wrote: How many times did he drive baseline and go airborne without knowing where he was going to go with the ball?  . I don't know.  How many? I remember it happening at least 3 times.  That's a real "heady" play from a senior. (<--sarcasm alert) Unfortunately, that's not a stat anybody keeps, because it's so subjective, so it's really just your opinion, which you're entitled to, even if it is wrong. Do you watch the games?  Or just read box scores?  I'm not trying to insult you by asking that question, but I think it's a logical question to ask with that type of reply.  Last time I checked, lane violations aren't a mainstream stat I can find on ESPN.com, either.  So that doesn't matter?  That point wasn't important in a game that goes to OT?  Bad passes that don't lead to turnovers aren't a stat, either...so they must not make any difference in a game, either.  Coach Christian even commended Walt in the post game interview for handling such a bad pass from Ivo.  Leaving your feet to pass the ball when you don't know where you're going with the ball is a horrible, horrible play in basketball.   It is not coached, ever.  There's a reason for that.  Yes.  I watch the games.  But I'm not trying to bludgeon the kid with criticism.  You seem to be only interested in tearing him down, for whatever reason.  Lane violations do matter, but they also happen once in a while.  As far as I know THAT'S THE ONLY HE'S HAD ALL DAMN SEASON.  So why are you dwelling on it?  You're down on Ivo, so you're magnifying every little f*ing thing he might do wrong. Fortunately for you, Ivo only has 8 or 9 games left at Ohio, and maybe you can find somebody else to bitch about next year.  I for one plan to cherish these last few games with a good player and a good kid. We will get by. We will get by. We will get by. We will survive. Back to Top Casper71 General User Member Since: 12/1/2006 Post Count: 3,090 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 3:40:48 PM  I've said it before and I noticed it was said by Mick Cronin (UC coach) today: the team that makes the fewest mistakes usually wins the game.  So, I think what some are saying is ivo seems to make a lot of mistakes (along with good plays).  For example, if he dosesn't have the lane violation (first for the team this year or for a while maybe?) maybe we win by one in regulation.  Maybe if he "hedges" better on defense we give up a couple fewer baskets. And, I tend to agree with driving the base line and NOT shooting.  Most of those passes resulted in turnovers (mistakes).  Sure you can make up for mistakes with great passes (assists) and steals (for turnovers).  Bottom line, I think we'd all like to see our team continue to make fewer errors than the opponents for 10 or so more games. Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,630 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 4:11:48 PM  It's not dwelling on something, it's a huge mental lapse that cost us a point in a game where one point could have spared us OT.  I'm sure he is a good kid, I have never said anything to the contrary.  I understand being supportive of your team, and I am, but I do not understand turning a blind eye to bad basketball plays because "he's a good kid."  From my understanding, Coach Christian comes from a good family, has kids that love him, and a wife who helped bring him here with her Ohio roots.  Does that stop people from picking him apart on here all season?  Questioning his adjustments, questioning his demeanor, comparing him constantly to John Groce?  Of course not.  I'm a loyal fan and supporter of this program and have been for a long time.  I'll be going to Cleveland again to support this team, and I really do hope that Ivo can be a positive contributor down the stretch.  He is important to this team, and we need him to play SMARTER.  It's incredibly frustrating when a senior leader does not do that.  I'm sorry that I expect more from a player like him. Back to Top SBH General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Post Count: 4,293 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 4:17:34 PM  Ohio69 wrote: Pretty sure we got dominated in rebounding last year too.  Didn't seem to matter much. Really?  It didn't matter in the regular season?  We were only 10-6, correct, with some BAD losses? Back to Top TWT General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Alexandria, VA Post Count: 5,208 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 4:49:24 PM  bobcat695 wrote: Ohio is a smaller than average team built for speed and outside shooting.  The team gets out-rebounded by an average of 4 rebounds/game.  But, they average 4.3 steals/game more than the opponents.  In terms of possessions, it is even.  Plus, we have one of the best shooting percentages in the nation, coupled with making an average of 3.5 more 3 pt FGs/game than our opponents.  A team can lose one statistical category, but more than make up for it in another.   Our recruiting classes may be full of large bodies built for rebounding, but with that comes a change.  We will not have nearly as many steals, assists or 3 point shots made.  I'm not saying I disagree with a bigger lineup, but it will shift where our strengths are.     I question going away from a the heavy guard emphasis as a program. When Ohio was front court oriented in the 90's it was the small guard oriented teams that shut us down defensively. I don't mind having only 3-4 quality front court players on the roster like we do now with Smith, Keely, Baltic and Green. Only Smith is bringing it defensively with the blocks. I see where one true defensive specialist guy would be nice off the bench. Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended 2010 97-83 win over Georgetown in NCAA 1st round 2012 45-13 victory over ULM in the Independence Bowl 2015 34-3 drubbing of Miami @ Peden front of 25,086 Back to Top Pataskala General User Member Since: 7/8/2010 Location: At least six feet away from anybody else Post Count: 9,365 Status: Offline     RE: Next year- one change I expect    Posted: 2/18/2013 5:11:48 PM  100%Cat wrote: It's not dwelling on something, it's a huge mental lapse that cost us a point in a game where one point could have spared us OT.  I'm sure he is a good kid, I have never said anything to the contrary.  I understand being supportive of your team, and I am, but I do not understand turning a blind eye to bad basketball plays because "he's a good kid."  From my understanding, Coach Christian comes from a good family, has kids that love him, and a wife who helped bring him here with her Ohio roots.  Does that stop people from picking him apart on here all season?  Questioning his adjustments, questioning his demeanor, comparing him constantly to John Groce?  Of course not.  I'm a loyal fan and supporter of this program and have been for a long time.  I'll be going to Cleveland again to support this team, and I really do hope that Ivo can be a positive contributor down the stretch.  He is important to this team, and we need him to play SMARTER.  It's incredibly frustrating when a senior leader does not do that.  I'm sorry that I expect more from a player like him. It seems like Ivo is being singled out for criticism.  This started out as a thread discussing the need for better rebounding and quickly focused on Ivo.  He's not the only player underneath, and frankly he's not the only senior on the squad.  Where was Keely when Kent got 13 offensive rebounds Saturday?  Not boxing out properly on rebounds is something other seniors can be called out for, but haven't been singled out like Ivo has been.  And I haven't turned a blind eye to Ivo's failings.  I've been very frustrated this season that he hasn't manned-up against even some smaller guys like he should.  Maybe it's a mental thing.  Maybe it's a coaching thing.  I don't know.  But I've noticed some improvement over the last couple games (something that hasn't been recognized here); he's been around the glass quite a bit more, and the dunk trailing Kellogg's missed layup was awesome.  And he still leads the team in rebounds -- including a big edge in defensive rebounds -- and is second in assists, third in steals and third in blocked shots, despite having less playing time lately.  Yes, he's second in turnovers -- far behind DJ, tho -- but his scoring is about the same as last year.  Still, everybody on the team has issues.  As for playing smarter, I think that can be said about anybody on the bench, including the suits.  The play at the end of regulation Saturday was just awful; they had about 3 seconds left on the clock with an inbound at midcourt but started the play 75 feet from the bucket.  DJ wound up chucking a half-court shot that even tho it hit the glass and the rim, it never had a chance to go in.  Sweet 16 deja vu all over again.  But they never even tried to run somebody up the court for a shorter shot.  The point is, it's not just Ivo.  Everybody needs to play smarter. We will get by. We will get by. We will get by. We will survive. Back to Top Showing Replies:   1 - 25  of 33 Posts Jump to Page:   1 | 2    Next > View Other 'Ohio Basketball' Topics                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               WHO'S ONLINE There are 396 Active Visitors on BobcatAttack.com 396 Guests 0 Registered Users There are no other users looking at this page.

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