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Topic:  Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive

Topic:  Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
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FearLeon
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  Message Not Read  Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 9:20:19 AM 
I've said it many times here...I'm a Boals guy. But I also said from day one that he'll be judged just like Larry, Timmy, Groce, Jimmy C and Saul Ball. Let's take a deeper dive at what I believe is a significant black eye during the Boals era.

Boals vs Akron/Toledo/Kent Regular Season/MAC Tourney

2019-2020

Lost by 9 to Toledo
Lost by to Akron
Lost by 15 to Kent
Beat Kent by 6
Lost to Akron by 7

Record: 1-3
---------

2020-21

Lost to Akron by 20
Lost to Toledo by 17
Lost to Kent by 10
Beat Akron by 17
Beat Kent by 23 MAC tourney
Beat Toledo by 7 MAC tourney

Record: 3-3
MAC Tournament Champs
-----

2021-2022

Beat Akron by 6
Beat Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 18
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Kent by 23
Lost to Akron by 8
Lost to Kent by 6 MAC

Record: 2-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2022-2023

Lost to Kent by 5
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Akron by 6
Beat Akron by 9
Lost to Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 7 MAC

Record: 1-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2023-2024

Lost to Toledo by 9

Record: 0-1
MAC Tournament? Will we even qualify?
------------------


Boals overall record vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: 7-17. Let me repeat.....7-17.

On the broadcast last night, Boals told the announcers all that matters in this conference is 3 days in Cleveland. He's correct about that and that's been my stance as well since this conference will never ever be a 2-bid league again moving forward. And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. Which is why he has rope and can never be compared truly to Saul. BUT. BUT. He needs to right the ship.

Folks...Ohio basketball is currently ranked #217 in the NET. I never truly thought I'd see that number under Boals. Mr “no one wants to play us” has systemic issues with this team. His best player (Hunter) is broken. His offense has a bizarre and unorganized flow. There’s no effort to get AJC shots because he’s buried down low. The D last night was a mess. When your highlight is “The Whiz wasn’t dreadful” that’s not much.

Somebody mentioned it on another post that Boals just doesn't look like the Boals of the past on the bench. Did he get content? His safe is seat for a long time. There is no pressure on him. Hell...we can't get a student media member to ask him why IJ "Bahamas" Ezuma is wearing street clothes this season.

I'm not pushing the panic button. But this staff seems to be well behind the upper echelon of the league right now. Toledo played five freshmen last night and three of them are major contributors right now. Meanwhile, we have Ben Nichol redshirting. Is Burris really going to come in and contribute right out of the gate next year? This year looks done. And quite frankly....looking at the roster of what is coming back currently...how can we say next season looks much better? But hey...regardless...remember...nobody wants to play Ohio. Well, except Defiance.


Last Edited: 1/3/2024 9:33:42 AM by FearLeon

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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Bobcat Jerry
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 9:24:59 AM 
Dreadful and unrecognizable last night. While there is some talent the overall cast is deficient. Hoping James and AJ will play next year and pull off this bandaid !
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greencat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 9:32:42 AM 
Hypothetically....is it possible he just wants I J to stay in school long enough to get his grades up enough to transfer somewhere? Anywhere. But that he knows that schollie will be available to use toward portal shopping in the near future.
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colobobcat66
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Location: Watching the bobcats run outside my window., CO
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 9:35:35 AM 
When a coach says all that counts is March, I’m out. Never have liked that philosophy and never will. If nothing else counts, why do they even keep score and charge for attending if it doesn’t count? Coach Boals is very fortunate to have had 2-3 really good guys from the Saul era.
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 10:26:09 AM 
Yea, for how much we dog Todd K on here for not winning the MAC tourney; he sure owns Boals H2H. Even on what looked like what should have been a down season for Toledo, given all the talent it lost.

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.

I think he’s brought in some pretty talented players (with his share of whiffs) over the years, but how he’s deployed them has been an entirely different story. Never did I expect to be under .500 this season. Imagine if the Defiance game remained a P5 opponent and we didn’t catch a lucky break against Delaware. We might be 4-9.

I like Boals and his staff, but they’re trending in the wrong direction in year 5.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 11:37:46 AM 
FJC31 wrote:
Yea, for how much we dog Todd K on here for not winning the MAC tourney; he sure owns Boals H2H. Even on what looked like what should have been a down season for Toledo, given all the talent it lost.

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.

I think he’s brought in some pretty talented players (with his share of whiffs) over the years, but how he’s deployed them has been an entirely different story. Never did I expect to be under .500 this season. Imagine if the Defiance game remained a P5 opponent and we didn’t catch a lucky break against Delaware. We might be 4-9.

I like Boals and his staff, but they’re trending in the wrong direction in year 5.


This is where I am, too.

I was thinking about starting a new thread about something you touched on. But may as well discuss here instead.

Can anybody explain what Boals' brand of basketball is? What is Boals' offensive philosophy? What sort of players does he need to make it work?

With Groce, that was very clear early on. His teams attacked on offense, spread the floor, and ran pick and roll actions to get talented guards into space and then surrounded them with shooters.

It's hard to see a coherent vision with Boals' teams. Right now, it feels rudderless.
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colobobcat66
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Location: Watching the bobcats run outside my window., CO
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 11:43:33 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
Yea, for how much we dog Todd K on here for not winning the MAC tourney; he sure owns Boals H2H. Even on what looked like what should have been a down season for Toledo, given all the talent it lost.

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.

I think he’s brought in some pretty talented players (with his share of whiffs) over the years, but how he’s deployed them has been an entirely different story. Never did I expect to be under .500 this season. Imagine if the Defiance game remained a P5 opponent and we didn’t catch a lucky break against Delaware. We might be 4-9.

I like Boals and his staff, but they’re trending in the wrong direction in year 5.


This is where I am, too.

I was thinking about starting a new thread about something you touched on. But may as well discuss here instead.

Can anybody explain what Boals' brand of basketball is? What is Boals' offensive philosophy? What sort of players does he need to make it work?

With Groce, that was very clear early on. His teams attacked on offense, spread the floor, and ran pick and roll actions to get talented guards into space and then surrounded them with shooters.

It's hard to see a coherent vision with Boals' teams. Right now, it feels rudderless.

Whatever it is, it works better with a Preston or Cooper.
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CatsUp
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 12:23:40 PM 
colobobcat66 wrote:
When a coach says all that counts is March, I’m out. Never have liked that philosophy and never will. If nothing else counts, why do they even keep score and charge for attending if it doesn’t count? Coach Boals is very fortunate to have had 2-3 really good guys from the Saul era.


I’m with you on this c66. That statement, if true, is about to alter my thinking going forward (I have come to the point where it doesn’t need much urging) until that philosophy changes; at least from leadership. There is no apparent reason for me to keep renewing my six regular season tickets every year if those games mean nothing. I’ll go to Cleveland if I’m so inclined and if I haven’t completely lost interest by then. Even if someone has adopted the “all about March” way of thinking, apparently they are hoping to get what would be considered upsets in the MAC tournament and then be rewarded with a 15 seed instead of a 12, 13 or even a 10 or 11. (You know, what they might get if the regular season mattered, they were good and it wasn’t “all about March”.
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bobcatsquared
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 12:58:37 PM 
colobobcat66 wrote:
When a coach says all that counts is March, I’m out. Never have liked that philosophy and never will. If nothing else counts, why do they even keep score and charge for attending if it doesn’t count? Coach Boals is very fortunate to have had 2-3 really good guys from the Saul era.


Couldn't agree more.

Ohio is not competitive with these teams lately because of a needed upgrade to its roster. We don't have the players that Coach K, Groce and Senderoff are putting on the floor. And I'm afraid a few other MAC programs with new coaches (Ball St., NIU, BG) might be passing us by as well.
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GraffZ06
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Location: Dayton, OH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 2:42:55 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
FJC31 wrote:

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.


This is where I am, too.

I was thinking about starting a new thread about something you touched on. But may as well discuss here instead.

Can anybody explain what Boals' brand of basketball is? What is Boals' offensive philosophy? What sort of players does he need to make it work?

With Groce, that was very clear early on. His teams attacked on offense, spread the floor, and ran pick and roll actions to get talented guards into space and then surrounded them with shooters.

It's hard to see a coherent vision with Boals' teams. Right now, it feels rudderless.


One thing about Jeff is, I don't think he has a hard, rigid, ideological scheme or style he's tied to. He's willing to deploy whatever style is the best fit for the current team he has. Some people chastise other coaches for trying to fit square pegs in round holes just because "that's our system". Jeff doesn't do that. I think it's a tremendous quality for a coach in today's day and age where you're literally re-recruiting and re-signing/paying the entire roster of free agents every single season. Trying to impose systematic consistency on top of all that turnover is a recipe for doom IMO.

Now, this years team isn't good. Some of that is on Jeff and the staff not getting good enough or complimentary enough pieces for sure. If you blind-folded me and then just had me assess the roster by looking at them, I'd bet you $100 this years team was a Saul recruited team with the lack of size and athleticism.

I know some of you want Jeff to run more with this team. That's just because we're small, but not because that's a brand of basketball this roster would thrive at IMO (though some would - AJB/EJ4). I've mentioned it in other threads but we aren't deep enough to be a 40 minutes of hell, run and gun team. We have 9 scholarship players. Also, this team is terrible on defense. Playing up-tempo gives the opponents more possessions as well. We might score more, but we'd give up a LOT more.

In the end I don't think you can say "this is Boals style" because his style is one of adaptation. This year, I think he's searching for answers (probably why he's grumpy) and none of them are working well.

This team would look a LOT different if the 2-deep was:

PG: J Hunter / S Mitchell
SG: AJ Brown / M Brown
SF: E James / I Cornish
PF: A Clayton / A Hadaway
C : I Ezuma / G Wiznitzer
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GraffZ06
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 2:44:03 PM 
colobobcat66 wrote:

Whatever it is, it works better with a Preston or Cooper.


And the Bulls worked better with Jordan. Having NBA players indeed helps.
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GoCats105
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 4:14:46 PM 
FJC31 wrote:
Yea, for how much we dog Todd K on here for not winning the MAC tourney; he sure owns Boals H2H. Even on what looked like what should have been a down season for Toledo, given all the talent it lost.

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.

I think he’s brought in some pretty talented players (with his share of whiffs) over the years, but how he’s deployed them has been an entirely different story. Never did I expect to be under .500 this season. Imagine if the Defiance game remained a P5 opponent and we didn’t catch a lucky break against Delaware. We might be 4-9.

I like Boals and his staff, but they’re trending in the wrong direction in year 5.


Here's a hypothetical. Take the five best recruits from the previous staff and put them against the five best from Boals' tenure. Who are you taking in a one-off game?

It's a good game but I'd be hard pressed not to take a team of Preston, BVP, Carter, Dartis and Laster/Block/Doug Taylor (not even including Ryan Taylor).

Who are Boals' best five? Sears, Roderick, McDay (technically a Saul recruit), Wilson...who's the 5th? Still up in the air between Miles Brown, AJ Brown, EJ4, and Hunter I guess. And three of those five (Sears, Roderick and McDay) each had *something* hindering the progress of the team whether it be transfer, lack of performance or simply walking away from the game.

The NCAA Tournament run was awesome but it was done with the previous staff's catalysts. And we all know Saul had his fair share of big whiffs, but Boals isn't far behind. You could argue differing circumstances considering the portal and NIL also.

Last Edited: 1/3/2024 4:16:34 PM by GoCats105
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 5:00:54 PM 
GraffZ06 wrote:
=

One thing about Jeff is, I don't think he has a hard, rigid, ideological scheme or style he's tied to. He's willing to deploy whatever style is the best fit for the current team he has. Some people chastise other coaches for trying to fit square pegs in round holes just because "that's our system". Jeff doesn't do that. I think it's a tremendous quality for a coach in today's day and age where you're literally re-recruiting and re-signing/paying the entire roster of free agents every single season. Trying to impose systematic consistency on top of all that turnover is a recipe for doom IMO.



I hear you on this. But I'm not convinced this is a good thing, and suspect that it: 1) makes recruiting harder and 2) makes developing players more difficult.

It's a hard thing to implement and learn a new system every year, and recruiting players for specific roles is helpful.
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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 5:27:34 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
=

One thing about Jeff is, I don't think he has a hard, rigid, ideological scheme or style he's tied to. He's willing to deploy whatever style is the best fit for the current team he has. Some people chastise other coaches for trying to fit square pegs in round holes just because "that's our system". Jeff doesn't do that. I think it's a tremendous quality for a coach in today's day and age where you're literally re-recruiting and re-signing/paying the entire roster of free agents every single season. Trying to impose systematic consistency on top of all that turnover is a recipe for doom IMO.



I hear you on this. But I'm not convinced this is a good thing, and suspect that it: 1) makes recruiting harder and 2) makes developing players more difficult.

It's a hard thing to implement and learn a new system every year, and recruiting players for specific roles is helpful.


Wish our style was run people off the floor. We dont need to commit to it long term - but this season with 7 guards shorter than I am we have to adapt - and they have not. We're still running - or trying to - run an offense that we've only had success with dominate big men and/or a ball distributor. We have neither.

Maybe next season Evans is the answer to all our hopes and dreams... then again, maybe hes not.
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OUcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 7:53:44 PM 
FearLeon wrote:
I've said it many times here...I'm a Boals guy. But I also said from day one that he'll be judged just like Larry, Timmy, Groce, Jimmy C and Saul Ball. Let's take a deeper dive at what I believe is a significant black eye during the Boals era.

Boals vs Akron/Toledo/Kent Regular Season/MAC Tourney

2019-2020

Lost by 9 to Toledo
Lost by to Akron
Lost by 15 to Kent
Beat Kent by 6
Lost to Akron by 7

Record: 1-3
---------

2020-21

Lost to Akron by 20
Lost to Toledo by 17
Lost to Kent by 10
Beat Akron by 17
Beat Kent by 23 MAC tourney
Beat Toledo by 7 MAC tourney

Record: 3-3
MAC Tournament Champs
-----

2021-2022

Beat Akron by 6
Beat Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 18
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Kent by 23
Lost to Akron by 8
Lost to Kent by 6 MAC

Record: 2-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2022-2023

Lost to Kent by 5
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Akron by 6
Beat Akron by 9
Lost to Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 7 MAC

Record: 1-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2023-2024

Lost to Toledo by 9

Record: 0-1
MAC Tournament? Will we even qualify?
------------------


Boals overall record vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: 7-17. Let me repeat.....7-17.

On the broadcast last night, Boals told the announcers all that matters in this conference is 3 days in Cleveland. He's correct about that and that's been my stance as well since this conference will never ever be a 2-bid league again moving forward. And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. Which is why he has rope and can never be compared truly to Saul. BUT. BUT. He needs to right the ship.

Folks...Ohio basketball is currently ranked #217 in the NET. I never truly thought I'd see that number under Boals. Mr “no one wants to play us” has systemic issues with this team. His best player (Hunter) is broken. His offense has a bizarre and unorganized flow. There’s no effort to get AJC shots because he’s buried down low. The D last night was a mess. When your highlight is “The Whiz wasn’t dreadful” that’s not much.

Somebody mentioned it on another post that Boals just doesn't look like the Boals of the past on the bench. Did he get content? His safe is seat for a long time. There is no pressure on him. Hell...we can't get a student media member to ask him why IJ "Bahamas" Ezuma is wearing street clothes this season.

I'm not pushing the panic button. But this staff seems to be well behind the upper echelon of the league right now. Toledo played five freshmen last night and three of them are major contributors right now. Meanwhile, we have Ben Nichol redshirting. Is Burris really going to come in and contribute right out of the gate next year? This year looks done. And quite frankly....looking at the roster of what is coming back currently...how can we say next season looks much better? But hey...regardless...remember...nobody wants to play Ohio. Well, except Defiance.




And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. ...

TRUE ...


Also, let's agree that every team in the MAC likely has a comparable record vs. those three teams in the same period of time ... if not worse!!!

The challenge for Boals and Co. is to first, make that a four-team MAC monster, second, rise to .500 consistently vs. the other three ... and finally, rise above.

The challenge here is, consistency. I would say, based on the last 5 years, the MAC has been led by Toledo, Buffalo, Akron, Kent

...Over the last 10 years Buffalo, Toledo Akron, Kent

... Over the last 15 years, Akron (for the most part) and Kent

... Over the last 20 years, Kent.

Ohio has too many sub-4th place finishes over the last 20 years to be in that group, even as the 'Cats have risen in MAC Tournament play from below No. 4 to win it all.

Winning the league regular season may not hold the true luster it should, but it still signals the team or teams/programs to beat, year in and year out. Ohio has great basketball name recognition, but frankly, other MAC programs are consistently stronger. And that is tough to admit.

I would say hands down the most consistent team in the bunch is Kent ... w/out looking at the standings I'd say they were lower than 4th in MAC standing over that 20-year span maybe 3 times, and top 3 more often than not. By no means always the best team ... but year in and year out nobody is surprised when Kent pulls a MAC upset.

That is where Ohio has to get up to or back to, consistently. That's not just a Boals problem, that's an Ohio problem.
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Urban Bobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 9:52:36 PM 
OUcat wrote:
FearLeon wrote:
I've said it many times here...I'm a Boals guy. But I also said from day one that he'll be judged just like Larry, Timmy, Groce, Jimmy C and Saul Ball. Let's take a deeper dive at what I believe is a significant black eye during the Boals era.

Boals vs Akron/Toledo/Kent Regular Season/MAC Tourney

2019-2020

Lost by 9 to Toledo
Lost by to Akron
Lost by 15 to Kent
Beat Kent by 6
Lost to Akron by 7

Record: 1-3
---------

2020-21

Lost to Akron by 20
Lost to Toledo by 17
Lost to Kent by 10
Beat Akron by 17
Beat Kent by 23 MAC tourney
Beat Toledo by 7 MAC tourney

Record: 3-3
MAC Tournament Champs
-----

2021-2022

Beat Akron by 6
Beat Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 18
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Kent by 23
Lost to Akron by 8
Lost to Kent by 6 MAC

Record: 2-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2022-2023

Lost to Kent by 5
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Akron by 6
Beat Akron by 9
Lost to Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 7 MAC

Record: 1-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2023-2024

Lost to Toledo by 9

Record: 0-1
MAC Tournament? Will we even qualify?
------------------


Boals overall record vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: 7-17. Let me repeat.....7-17.

On the broadcast last night, Boals told the announcers all that matters in this conference is 3 days in Cleveland. He's correct about that and that's been my stance as well since this conference will never ever be a 2-bid league again moving forward. And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. Which is why he has rope and can never be compared truly to Saul. BUT. BUT. He needs to right the ship.

Folks...Ohio basketball is currently ranked #217 in the NET. I never truly thought I'd see that number under Boals. Mr “no one wants to play us” has systemic issues with this team. His best player (Hunter) is broken. His offense has a bizarre and unorganized flow. There’s no effort to get AJC shots because he’s buried down low. The D last night was a mess. When your highlight is “The Whiz wasn’t dreadful” that’s not much.

Somebody mentioned it on another post that Boals just doesn't look like the Boals of the past on the bench. Did he get content? His safe is seat for a long time. There is no pressure on him. Hell...we can't get a student media member to ask him why IJ "Bahamas" Ezuma is wearing street clothes this season.

I'm not pushing the panic button. But this staff seems to be well behind the upper echelon of the league right now. Toledo played five freshmen last night and three of them are major contributors right now. Meanwhile, we have Ben Nichol redshirting. Is Burris really going to come in and contribute right out of the gate next year? This year looks done. And quite frankly....looking at the roster of what is coming back currently...how can we say next season looks much better? But hey...regardless...remember...nobody wants to play Ohio. Well, except Defiance.




And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. ...

TRUE ...


Also, let's agree that every team in the MAC likely has a comparable record vs. those three teams in the same period of time ... if not worse!!!

The challenge for Boals and Co. is to first, make that a four-team MAC monster, second, rise to .500 consistently vs. the other three ... and finally, rise above.

The challenge here is, consistency. I would say, based on the last 5 years, the MAC has been led by Toledo, Buffalo, Akron, Kent

...Over the last 10 years Buffalo, Toledo Akron, Kent

... Over the last 15 years, Akron (for the most part) and Kent

... Over the last 20 years, Kent.

Ohio has too many sub-4th place finishes over the last 20 years to be in that group, even as the 'Cats have risen in MAC Tournament play from below No. 4 to win it all.

Winning the league regular season may not hold the true luster it should, but it still signals the team or teams/programs to beat, year in and year out. Ohio has great basketball name recognition, but frankly, other MAC programs are consistently stronger. And that is tough to admit.

I would say hands down the most consistent team in the bunch is Kent ... w/out looking at the standings I'd say they were lower than 4th in MAC standing over that 20-year span maybe 3 times, and top 3 more often than not. By no means always the best team ... but year in and year out nobody is surprised when Kent pulls a MAC upset.

That is where Ohio has to get up to or back to, consistently. That's not just a Boals problem, that's an Ohio problem.





What MAC school has the most NCAA Tournament wins over the last 10 to 20 years?

URBAN BOBCAT

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OUcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/3/2024 10:34:00 PM 
Urban Bobcat wrote:
OUcat wrote:
FearLeon wrote:
I've said it many times here...I'm a Boals guy. But I also said from day one that he'll be judged just like Larry, Timmy, Groce, Jimmy C and Saul Ball. Let's take a deeper dive at what I believe is a significant black eye during the Boals era.

Boals vs Akron/Toledo/Kent Regular Season/MAC Tourney

2019-2020

Lost by 9 to Toledo
Lost by to Akron
Lost by 15 to Kent
Beat Kent by 6
Lost to Akron by 7

Record: 1-3
---------

2020-21

Lost to Akron by 20
Lost to Toledo by 17
Lost to Kent by 10
Beat Akron by 17
Beat Kent by 23 MAC tourney
Beat Toledo by 7 MAC tourney

Record: 3-3
MAC Tournament Champs
-----

2021-2022

Beat Akron by 6
Beat Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 18
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Kent by 23
Lost to Akron by 8
Lost to Kent by 6 MAC

Record: 2-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2022-2023

Lost to Kent by 5
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Akron by 6
Beat Akron by 9
Lost to Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 7 MAC

Record: 1-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2023-2024

Lost to Toledo by 9

Record: 0-1
MAC Tournament? Will we even qualify?
------------------


Boals overall record vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: 7-17. Let me repeat.....7-17.

On the broadcast last night, Boals told the announcers all that matters in this conference is 3 days in Cleveland. He's correct about that and that's been my stance as well since this conference will never ever be a 2-bid league again moving forward. And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. Which is why he has rope and can never be compared truly to Saul. BUT. BUT. He needs to right the ship.

Folks...Ohio basketball is currently ranked #217 in the NET. I never truly thought I'd see that number under Boals. Mr “no one wants to play us” has systemic issues with this team. His best player (Hunter) is broken. His offense has a bizarre and unorganized flow. There’s no effort to get AJC shots because he’s buried down low. The D last night was a mess. When your highlight is “The Whiz wasn’t dreadful” that’s not much.

Somebody mentioned it on another post that Boals just doesn't look like the Boals of the past on the bench. Did he get content? His safe is seat for a long time. There is no pressure on him. Hell...we can't get a student media member to ask him why IJ "Bahamas" Ezuma is wearing street clothes this season.

I'm not pushing the panic button. But this staff seems to be well behind the upper echelon of the league right now. Toledo played five freshmen last night and three of them are major contributors right now. Meanwhile, we have Ben Nichol redshirting. Is Burris really going to come in and contribute right out of the gate next year? This year looks done. And quite frankly....looking at the roster of what is coming back currently...how can we say next season looks much better? But hey...regardless...remember...nobody wants to play Ohio. Well, except Defiance.




And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. ...

TRUE ...


Also, let's agree that every team in the MAC likely has a comparable record vs. those three teams in the same period of time ... if not worse!!!

The challenge for Boals and Co. is to first, make that a four-team MAC monster, second, rise to .500 consistently vs. the other three ... and finally, rise above.

The challenge here is, consistency. I would say, based on the last 5 years, the MAC has been led by Toledo, Buffalo, Akron, Kent

...Over the last 10 years Buffalo, Toledo Akron, Kent

... Over the last 15 years, Akron (for the most part) and Kent

... Over the last 20 years, Kent.

Ohio has too many sub-4th place finishes over the last 20 years to be in that group, even as the 'Cats have risen in MAC Tournament play from below No. 4 to win it all.

Winning the league regular season may not hold the true luster it should, but it still signals the team or teams/programs to beat, year in and year out. Ohio has great basketball name recognition, but frankly, other MAC programs are consistently stronger. And that is tough to admit.

I would say hands down the most consistent team in the bunch is Kent ... w/out looking at the standings I'd say they were lower than 4th in MAC standing over that 20-year span maybe 3 times, and top 3 more often than not. By no means always the best team ... but year in and year out nobody is surprised when Kent pulls a MAC upset.

That is where Ohio has to get up to or back to, consistently. That's not just a Boals problem, that's an Ohio problem.





What MAC school has the most NCAA Tournament wins over the last 10 to 20 years?



Easy answer .... Ohio!!!

What MAC school should dominant MAC basketball, but doesn't.

Easy answer ... Ohio!!!

All I'm saying is look in the mirror folks. 'Cats go to the NCAA Tournament once or twice a decade, win a few games, then slide back to the middle of the pack. Is that the picture of a dominant 'program.'

When folks outside this footprint mention MAC basketball ... the first words should not be Buffalo, or Toledo, or Akron or any other MAC program. It should be Ohio. And except for those years the Bobcats rise up for a few weeks in March, only to fade back, that is not the case.

Sorry I cracked your mirror.
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100%Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 8:20:31 AM 
I didn't think I'd say it, but I'm becoming less convinced by the game that Boals is the guy. Remove the one NCAA win, and how much different is our situation now compared to where we were under Saul? And Boals' 1 NCAA win was fueled by two of Saul's recruits, Preston and BVP. It feels like Boals has had just as many recruiting whiffs as Saul had here. We're not a good basketball team right now, and looking down the road at next year, how convincing is it that it will get better?

Olumide Adelodun
Colin Granger
IJ
Jalen White
Rifen Miguel
Sam Towns
Marvin Price
Nolan Foster

Who am I forgetting? People on this board ridiculed Saul for his recruiting whiffs, but Boals has formed a pretty solid list, himself. On top of that, we had Ben Roderick regress later in his career here and Lunden McDay mysteriously walk away. He got Dwight here, which turned out to be a big "get." Sears was really good, but he bolted for Bama.

How comfortable should we be, accepting being a 4-6 seed in the MAC and losing in the semis in Cleveland?

Last Edited: 1/4/2024 8:32:40 AM by 100%Cat
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 8:37:14 AM 
GoCats105 wrote:
FJC31 wrote:
Yea, for how much we dog Todd K on here for not winning the MAC tourney; he sure owns Boals H2H. Even on what looked like what should have been a down season for Toledo, given all the talent it lost.

I’m not entirely sure what Boals brand of basketball is at this point. With the way that this season is going, it does look like a lot of his on-court credibility is tied to Preston.

I think he’s brought in some pretty talented players (with his share of whiffs) over the years, but how he’s deployed them has been an entirely different story. Never did I expect to be under .500 this season. Imagine if the Defiance game remained a P5 opponent and we didn’t catch a lucky break against Delaware. We might be 4-9.

I like Boals and his staff, but they’re trending in the wrong direction in year 5.


Here's a hypothetical. Take the five best recruits from the previous staff and put them against the five best from Boals' tenure. Who are you taking in a one-off game?

It's a good game but I'd be hard pressed not to take a team of Preston, BVP, Carter, Dartis and Laster/Block/Doug Taylor (not even including Ryan Taylor).

Who are Boals' best five? Sears, Roderick, McDay (technically a Saul recruit), Wilson...who's the 5th? Still up in the air between Miles Brown, AJ Brown, EJ4, and Hunter I guess. And three of those five (Sears, Roderick and McDay) each had *something* hindering the progress of the team whether it be transfer, lack of performance or simply walking away from the game.

The NCAA Tournament run was awesome but it was done with the previous staff's catalysts. And we all know Saul had his fair share of big whiffs, but Boals isn't far behind. You could argue differing circumstances considering the portal and NIL also.


I think everyone (myself included) will take the the team with the NBA player. No denying Preston, BVP, and Carter are the more accomplished.

I do like the type of recruits Boals has brought in such as AJB, EJ4, and Sears. Even Evans seems like the type we'd want (athletic). So, I don't think Boals has a recruiting problem -- outside of size, but rather figuring out how to maximize guys (and keep them) once they get here seems to be the disconnect.

Last Edited: 1/4/2024 8:38:43 AM by FJC31
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FJC31
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 8:45:01 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
GraffZ06 wrote:
=

One thing about Jeff is, I don't think he has a hard, rigid, ideological scheme or style he's tied to. He's willing to deploy whatever style is the best fit for the current team he has. Some people chastise other coaches for trying to fit square pegs in round holes just because "that's our system". Jeff doesn't do that. I think it's a tremendous quality for a coach in today's day and age where you're literally re-recruiting and re-signing/paying the entire roster of free agents every single season. Trying to impose systematic consistency on top of all that turnover is a recipe for doom IMO.



I hear you on this. But I'm not convinced this is a good thing, and suspect that it: 1) makes recruiting harder and 2) makes developing players more difficult.

It's a hard thing to implement and learn a new system every year, and recruiting players for specific roles is helpful.


Yea, I'm (twice now, shockingly) with BLSS on this. I can appreciate being fluid and adaptable to your roster, but the argument can be made that hasn't even been the case this season.

I also feel like that would pose recruiting problems. Suddenly, it becomes more of a spray and pray approach rather than strategic.

For instance, we can look at Jaylin and Shereef as PG recruits. Solid players, but neither are the same facilitator type of PG Boals had success with in Preston. Seems like that's what he needs to make whatever his offense is go, no?
I feel like it can't be that hard to find a pass first PG.
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 11:39:04 AM 
FearLeon wrote:
I've said it many times here...I'm a Boals guy. But I also said from day one that he'll be judged just like Larry, Timmy, Groce, Jimmy C and Saul Ball. Let's take a deeper dive at what I believe is a significant black eye during the Boals era.

Boals vs Akron/Toledo/Kent Regular Season/MAC Tourney

2019-2020

Lost by 9 to Toledo
Lost by to Akron
Lost by 15 to Kent
Beat Kent by 6
Lost to Akron by 7

Record: 1-3
---------

2020-21

Lost to Akron by 20
Lost to Toledo by 17
Lost to Kent by 10
Beat Akron by 17
Beat Kent by 23 MAC tourney
Beat Toledo by 7 MAC tourney

Record: 3-3
MAC Tournament Champs
-----

2021-2022

Beat Akron by 6
Beat Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 18
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Kent by 23
Lost to Akron by 8
Lost to Kent by 6 MAC

Record: 2-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2022-2023

Lost to Kent by 5
Lost to Toledo by 15
Lost to Akron by 6
Beat Akron by 9
Lost to Kent by 7
Lost to Toledo by 7 MAC

Record: 1-5
MAC Semifinals Appearance
---------

2023-2024

Lost to Toledo by 9

Record: 0-1
MAC Tournament? Will we even qualify?
------------------


Boals overall record vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: 7-17. Let me repeat.....7-17.

On the broadcast last night, Boals told the announcers all that matters in this conference is 3 days in Cleveland. He's correct about that and that's been my stance as well since this conference will never ever be a 2-bid league again moving forward. And right now Boals is living large off of the 3 days in Cleveland in 2021. Which is why he has rope and can never be compared truly to Saul. BUT. BUT. He needs to right the ship.

Folks...Ohio basketball is currently ranked #217 in the NET. I never truly thought I'd see that number under Boals. Mr “no one wants to play us” has systemic issues with this team. His best player (Hunter) is broken. His offense has a bizarre and unorganized flow. There’s no effort to get AJC shots because he’s buried down low. The D last night was a mess. When your highlight is “The Whiz wasn’t dreadful” that’s not much.

Somebody mentioned it on another post that Boals just doesn't look like the Boals of the past on the bench. Did he get content? His safe is seat for a long time. There is no pressure on him. Hell...we can't get a student media member to ask him why IJ "Bahamas" Ezuma is wearing street clothes this season.

I'm not pushing the panic button. But this staff seems to be well behind the upper echelon of the league right now. Toledo played five freshmen last night and three of them are major contributors right now. Meanwhile, we have Ben Nichol redshirting. Is Burris really going to come in and contribute right out of the gate next year? This year looks done. And quite frankly....looking at the roster of what is coming back currently...how can we say next season looks much better? But hey...regardless...remember...nobody wants to play Ohio. Well, except Defiance.




Don't dare bring up the question of why is Ezuma is not suited up. I was almost ran off of this forum for even mentioning it.

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JSF
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Location: Houston, TX
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 7:27:17 PM 
It took Dambrot a few tries to figure out how to win in Cleveland. Once he did, the lid was off and Akron was arguably the conference's top program. I know we're talking about a longer timeframe with Toledo, but be careful about hanging that albatross on Tod. One good week could completely change the next decade.

"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

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M.D.W.S.T
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 8:19:01 PM 
JSF wrote:
It took Dambrot a few tries to figure out how to win in Cleveland. Once he did, the lid was off and Akron was arguably the conference's top program. I know we're talking about a longer timeframe with Toledo, but be careful about hanging that albatross on Tod. One good week could completely change the next decade.


Make a run in March and nobody remembers we cant hit a bulls ass with a handful of corn in December.
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Bobcat Love
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/4/2024 11:09:26 PM 
JSF wrote:
It took Dambrot a few tries to figure out how to win in Cleveland. Once he did, the lid was off and Akron was arguably the conference's top program. I know we're talking about a longer timeframe with Toledo, but be careful about hanging that albatross on Tod. One good week could completely change the next decade.


I think TK is the best Coach in the conference, and has been for quite a while. One of these years, it's all going to click in Cleveland - and like JSF said - watch out.

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FearLeon
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  Message Not Read  RE: Boals Vs Akron/Kent/Toledo: A Deep Dive
   Posted: 1/5/2024 8:28:40 AM 
Bobcat Love wrote:
JSF wrote:
It took Dambrot a few tries to figure out how to win in Cleveland. Once he did, the lid was off and Akron was arguably the conference's top program. I know we're talking about a longer timeframe with Toledo, but be careful about hanging that albatross on Tod. One good week could completely change the next decade.


I think TK is the best Coach in the conference, and has been for quite a while. One of these years, it's all going to click in Cleveland - and like JSF said - watch out.



Hard to disagree with these statements.

#BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT

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