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Topic:  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?

Topic:  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 10:43:28 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


Do you disagree with my suggestions of what needs to be done? This is a once in 100 year pandemic. I don't understand why there is a single person out in public.



I'm sorry you were called a moron. Seems like you're handling it well.


More than willing to have the debate. I'm open to any reasoning as to why this entire Country is not shutdown. No sports, no nothing. It's simply too dangerous. Does everyone in the United States want their Grandmothers to die? We are all in this together.


To me, the main reason the country should remain open is because in the very early days of the pandemic, me and the politicians I support insisted loudly that this wasn't a real threat. We decided it was just politics, and just the flu, and turned this -- like literally everything else -- into a culture issue. And so, since that was my opinion in the early days, and I'm very smart and a very rational, "common sense" sorta guy, I've decided that the best way to feel smart is to position the only possible alternative as one where Americans are shot for leaving the house. That way, I'm right. And that's what's most important here.




So you don't believe the virus is deadly? Can you not see the numbers? Close the Country down immediately! I've seen the light!

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 10:44:22 AM by ohiocatfan1
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 11:01:15 AM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:

So you don't believe the virus is deadly? Can you not see the numbers? Close the Country down immediately! I've seen the light!



I've seen the numbers, but the best part of numbers is how easy they are to ignore when they don't support my viewpoint. See, watch this:

420,000 deaths? Have you considered that maybe there weren't 420,000 deaths?

It's that simple. I don't need to support that opinion, cite evidence, or anything. And now if anybody asks me to support that stance, what I'll do is, I'll just start talking in hyperbole and refuse to engage like an adult. Because I'm really smart, and smart people do that.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 11:01:55 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 11:06:10 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:

So you don't believe the virus is deadly? Can you not see the numbers? Close the Country down immediately! I've seen the light!



I've seen the numbers, but the best part of numbers is how easy they are to ignore when they don't support my viewpoint. See, watch this:

420,000 deaths? Have you considered that maybe there weren't 420,000 deaths?

It's that simple. I don't need to support that opinion, cite evidence, or anything. And now if anybody asks me to support that stance, what I'll do is, I'll just start talking in hyperbole and refuse to engage like an adult. Because I'm really smart, and smart people do that.



I guess if someone wants to put themselves at risk by stepping off their front porch it's up to them but not me. I know how dangerous this is. It's dangerous enough that not a single general admission spectator can be inside the 13,000 seat convocation center. That's proof enough for me.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 11:48:20 AM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I guess if someone wants to put themselves at risk by stepping off their front porch it's up to them but not me. I know how dangerous this is. It's dangerous enough that not a single general admission spectator can be inside the 13,000 seat convocation center. That's proof enough for me.



Are you sure you want to go to games? Because as you said, you're more likely to get into a car accident than you are to catch Covid.

And just based on the numbers you yourself cited, that means that if you go to every home game, you average a car accident a season.

That's actually legitimately dangerous, not to mention expensive. That's a lot of car repairs and likely a very high insurance bill. I know you like basketball and all, but doesn't seem worth it.
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 11:55:16 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I guess if someone wants to put themselves at risk by stepping off their front porch it's up to them but not me. I know how dangerous this is. It's dangerous enough that not a single general admission spectator can be inside the 13,000 seat convocation center. That's proof enough for me.



Are you sure you want to go to games? Because as you said, you're more likely to get into a car accident than you are to catch Covid.

And just based on the numbers you yourself cited, that means that if you go to every home game, you average a car accident a season.

That's actually legitimately dangerous, not to mention expensive. That's a lot of car repairs and likely a very high insurance bill. I know you like basketball and all, but doesn't seem worth it.


I have seen the light. This virus is more dangerous than anything I can think of. I may be late to the party but I'm better informed now. Some of our elected leaders are right. Shut everything down NOW! My only hope is others will have a change of tune like I did.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 12:10:40 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I have seen the light. This virus is more dangerous than anything I can think of. I may be late to the party but I'm better informed now. Some of our elected leaders are right. Shut everything down NOW! My only hope is others will have a change of tune like I did.


You're still arguing with nobody, my man. And somehow you're still losing.
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 12:15:50 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I have seen the light. This virus is more dangerous than anything I can think of. I may be late to the party but I'm better informed now. Some of our elected leaders are right. Shut everything down NOW! My only hope is others will have a change of tune like I did.


You're still arguing with nobody, my man. And somehow you're still losing.


I would think the fact that I've finally understood how deadly this virus is should be pleasing to so many people. For too long I was one of the selfish ones who thought things like making a living to provide food and shelter for your family were important. I couldn't have been more wrong. I encourage everyone to close your place of business, advocate for the stoppage of all sports, close all schools & places of worship. After all we are in this together if it saves just one life.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 12:28:13 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I would think the fact that I've finally understood how deadly this virus is should be pleasing to so many people. For too long I was one of the selfish ones who thought things like making a living to provide food and shelter for your family were important. I couldn't have been more wrong. I encourage everyone to close your place of business, advocate for the stoppage of all sports, close all schools & places of worship. After all we are in this together if it saves just one life.



Earlier in the thread, you and I were having a reasonable conversation and found some middle ground. Then somebody called you a name, and you've kept up this weird little act for like 10 posts.

We get it -- you disagreed with that poster who said "if it just saves one life." Next step there would be to engage with that poster about why you disagree, you know like an adult does. Instead, it's just hyperbole and pointless trolling.

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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 12:33:44 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


I would think the fact that I've finally understood how deadly this virus is should be pleasing to so many people. For too long I was one of the selfish ones who thought things like making a living to provide food and shelter for your family were important. I couldn't have been more wrong. I encourage everyone to close your place of business, advocate for the stoppage of all sports, close all schools & places of worship. After all we are in this together if it saves just one life.



Earlier in the thread, you and I were having a reasonable conversation and found some middle ground. Then somebody called you a name, and you've kept up this weird little act for like 10 posts.

We get it -- you disagreed with that poster who said "if it just saves one life." Next step there would be to engage with that poster about why you disagree, you know like an adult does. Instead, it's just hyperbole and pointless trolling.



You just can't please some people. I've changed my thinking to the reasonable position and you're still unhappy.

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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 1:07:29 PM 
What I find befuddling is that people still think that if Big Brother Government would just allow businesses to "open up" then folks would flock to bars, restaurants, movie theaters, etc. - as if its the regulations that are killing businesses - when in fact it is the virus killing and sending people the hospital that is stopping people from going out and about. You want the economy to open up - get the vaccine as soon as possible.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 1:08:12 PM by cc-cat
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 3:25:25 PM 
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.
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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 3:46:39 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest.


Don't you just hate it when your plan backfires.

ohiocatfan1 wrote:
If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


Except two things.

1. by "living your lives" you put others in danger. Be like staying "if I want to drink and drive I will. If that makes you feel in danger just stay off the road."

2. As I've stated, there are not enough "you" to change the dynamics at your favorite bar, restaurant, etc. they will still only be filled 25% - 50% capacity because too many people will continue to stay away until the vaccine impacts the numbers.

In the meantime - wear a mask, maintain 6-feet and get a vaccine as soon as possible. I appreciate those three things can be viewed as an incredible impediment on ones rights and liberties, but if you truly want the economy to open up, you'll have to take one for the team.

Doesn't mean you have to be a hermit. Just be responsible and aware. I've been out to eat or at a bar each of the last three weeks. I just keep a fair distance and am aware of others.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 3:55:24 PM by cc-cat
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 3:52:31 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest.


Don't you just hate it when your plan backfires.

ohiocatfan1 wrote:
If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


Except two things.

1. by "living your lives" you put others in danger. Be like staying "if I want to drink and drive I will. If that makes you feel in danger just stay off the road."

2. As I've stated, there are not enough "you" to change the dynamics at your favorite bar, restaurant, etc. they will still only be filled 25% - 50% capacity because too many people will continue to stay away until the vaccine impacts the numbers.

In the meantime - wear a mask, maintain 6-feet and get a vaccine as soon as possible. I appreciate those three things can be viewed as an incredible impediment on ones rights and liberties, but if you truly want the economy to open up, you'll have to take one for the team.


I respectfully disagree. In my opinion the mandates are keeping people away and causing the owners untold financial destruction. I am all for anyone wearing a mask and all the rest. I've never made a habit of sneezing on people and not washing my hands. I don't need a mandate to teach me that.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 3:54:00 PM by ohiocatfan1
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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 4:08:07 PM 
As a professional who consults with the hospitality industry I can assure you the research backs my point that it is the virus, not the mandates keeping people from going out in needed numbers. Just completed research for North Carolina Department of Commerce. The numbers have changed little since March. They started to ebb down a little in the fall, but are right back up. 70% still do not want to travel - in fact 50% are less likely now than 3 months ago. 50% of those that says they will travel will only travel IF they can prepare their own meals - simply do not what to be in bars and restaurants. interest in going out in your own community is a little better, but not much.
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 4:14:11 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
As a professional who consults with the hospitality industry I can assure you the research backs my point that it is the virus, not the mandates keeping people from going out in needed numbers. Just completed research for North Carolina Department of Commerce. The numbers have changed little since March. They started to ebb down a little in the fall, but are right back up. 70% still do not want to travel - in fact 50% are less likely now than 3 months ago. 50% of those that says they will travel will only travel IF they can prepare their own meals - simply do not what to be in bars and restaurants. interest in going out in your own community is a little better, but not much.


Understood. My opinion is based on only anecdotal evidence.

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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 4:29:32 PM 
Replicating the research every 3-4 weeks - next round will have more "vaccine" time included - will keep you posted on any change in trends / trajectory.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 4:32:40 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


How did you do that, exactly?
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 4:51:51 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


How did you do that, exactly?


By quoting things I've heard for months. The idiocy of the reaction to this virus is astounding.
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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 5:18:08 PM 
Agree. From its just the flu. To it will miraculously go away when it gets hot. To maybe we could just inject bleach. To let's go for herd "mentality." To "it is what it is" - idiocy of the reaction to this virus has been astounding. And that's just from the guy who says he's a genius and knows more than the doctors.

Mask up. Stand back.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 5:44:11 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


How did you do that, exactly?


By quoting things I've heard for months. The idiocy of the reaction to this virus is astounding.



I didn't see you quote anything. Or cite anything. You just took a hyperbolic position -- one that doesn't represent any mainstream thinking -- and made fun of it.

Which is exactly what I pointed out after your very first post. You're arguing against something nobody here's saying.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 5:45:08 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 6:48:53 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:


By quoting things I've heard for months. The idiocy of the reaction to this virus is astounding.



Here are some real, actual quotes from this very board:

From April:

Quote:

Imperial College and the University of Washington predicted over 200,000 deaths with strong mitigation and warned Sweden that if they didn't lock down (which they have not) they could face a significant portion of their populace in the hospital, with many dead. Well there is no hospital bed shortage in Stockholm, and the beers and shots continue to be poured in their bars as well. They are on track for their usual number of deaths in a typical flu season. Now these self professed experts have dropped their death count to well below 50,000 for the US, the usual flu deaths for this country.


420,000 deaths to date. Sweden has had 43,471 cases and 11,500 deaths. Their next door neighbors Norway and Finland have had 4,300 and 4,900 cases respectively. Norway's had 561 deaths; Finland has had 671.

From May:
Quote:

The Chief Epidemiologist of Stockholm says herd immunity will be achieved in days, if not a few weeks.


Still not there, 8 months later.

Quote:

it's called COVID-19 because it's the 19th strain/mutation of the Coronavirus - a virus that has been known and around for a LONG time. Shoot, read a Lysol label. It literally states "Disinfects:" and lists "Human Coronavirus".


Spoiler: none of that's true.

Quote:

COVID-19 isn't going to do jack squat


Quote:

Weird...fear mongering and panic because of a small threat disease during an election year.


There are dozens of examples just like these. It's really easy to look back in retrospect and be critical of components of the response, and even to rightfully point out where the response went overboard.

But it's important to remember that a large portion of the population -- including the ruling party at the time -- spent a huge part of the beginning of this pandemic insisting this was literally nothing but a political hoax. And that insistence backed them into a corner. Since the prevailing message on the Right was that the virus wasn't a major health concern, it meant that there wasn't any political will for the economic response that was necessary. As a result, we ended up with a health risk that far exceeded their expectations and an economic response that was insufficient.

And pretty much all of the folks who were insisting this was a political hoax are now standing alongside of you in the "common sense" crowd being critical when they see overreach, and completely ignoring how wrong they were a year ago.

So forgive me if the "financial cost of this crisis will outweigh the health cost" argument makes me skeptical. The people who made it early on -- at least here -- all grossly underestimated the health risk.

Last Edited: 2/1/2021 7:52:59 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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JSF
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 7:36:35 PM 
If our government had done what they should have and propped up businesses and people, we'd be in a much better place today. I know that because the countries that did exactly that are doing much better than we.

"Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season.

My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8

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BillyTheCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/1/2021 8:27:49 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


Many states have lifted regulations, and guess what people are still not doing business as usual. Yet strangely, people in those states are still blaming the government. Fact is many people think they have to have a boogie man.
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ohiocatfan1
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/2/2021 1:36:45 PM 
BillyTheCat wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


Many states have lifted regulations, and guess what people are still not doing business as usual. Yet strangely, people in those states are still blaming the government. Fact is many people think they have to have a boogie man.


Lifted what regulations? From where I sit there are no states without some type of restrictions on bars, restaurants, sporting events, schools and large gatherings. Does it not bother anyone that here in Ohio NONE of these mandates have gone through the elected legislature? They have all been issued by one office holder.

Last Edited: 2/2/2021 1:38:41 PM by ohiocatfan1
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: A way to get fans back in the stands?
   Posted: 2/2/2021 1:54:02 PM 
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
BillyTheCat wrote:
ohiocatfan1 wrote:
My past few posts have been to show the idiocy of these mandates, regulations & all the rest. If anyone feels unsafe STAY HOME! Let the rest of us live our lives.


Many states have lifted regulations, and guess what people are still not doing business as usual. Yet strangely, people in those states are still blaming the government. Fact is many people think they have to have a boogie man.


Lifted what regulations? From where I sit there are no states without some type of restrictions on bars, restaurants, sporting events, schools and large gatherings. Does it not bother anyone that here in Ohio NONE of these mandates have gone through the elected legislature? They have all been issued by one office holder.


There are a lot of places that have basically no restrictions in place: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/states-reopen...

As was pointed out to you yesterday, with actual data, people are choosing to spend less time at bars, restaurants, sporting events, large gatherings, etc. They're doing so because they view Covid as a risk, and one which they can help mitigate for themselves and others by taking precautions.

The notion that it's the restrictions themselves causing the change in behavior just doesn't seem supported by the data.

Last Edited: 2/2/2021 1:58:43 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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