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Topic: Smith has been fired
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Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 7:38 AM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
Compare this to Michigans statement:

Statement from University of Michigan Athletic
Director Warde Manuel
U-M head football coach Sherrone Moore has been terminated, with cause, effective immediately. Following a University investigation, credible evidence was found that Coach Moore engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a staff member. This conduct constitutes a clear violation of University policy, and U-M maintains zero tolerance for such behavior.


You can see the difference.
Btw...the point of this isn't to defend Michigan. It's more like, "EVEN Michigan could say why they actually fired their coach,"
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Posted: 12/18/2025 7:50 AM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
Compare this to Michigans statement:

Statement from University of Michigan Athletic
Director Warde Manuel
U-M head football coach Sherrone Moore has been terminated, with cause, effective immediately. Following a University investigation, credible evidence was found that Coach Moore engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a staff member. This conduct constitutes a clear violation of University policy, and U-M maintains zero tolerance for such behavior.


You can see the difference.
Btw...the point of this isn't to defend Michigan. It's more like, "EVEN Michigan could say why they actually fired their coach,"
In fairness, their coach was in jail at that point, there'd been days of national press coverage, and the university had just come to the realization that they need to conduct an investigation into the culture of the athletic department.

If none of those things had been true, I suspect their statement would have been more in line with ours.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 8:09 AM
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:expand_more
Compare this to Michigans statement:

Statement from University of Michigan Athletic
Director Warde Manuel
U-M head football coach Sherrone Moore has been terminated, with cause, effective immediately. Following a University investigation, credible evidence was found that Coach Moore engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a staff member. This conduct constitutes a clear violation of University policy, and U-M maintains zero tolerance for such behavior.


You can see the difference.
Btw...the point of this isn't to defend Michigan. It's more like, "EVEN Michigan could say why they actually fired their coach,"
In fairness, their coach was in jail at that point, there'd been days of national press coverage, and the university had just come to the realization that they need to conduct an investigation into the culture of the athletic department.

If none of those things had been true, I suspect their statement would have been more in line with ours.
Not true. He was told he was fired, then went off the deep end. He was apprehended after the statement was released.

Perhaps we were more vague because of how Moore reacted. Maybe.
BryanHall
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Posted: 12/18/2025 8:28 AM
OUohYeahBobcat15 wrote:expand_more
New York Time$ article mentioning the alcohol reprimand.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6896890/2025/12/17/brian... /
This sounds like the university was investigating him and started asking questions to the staff. This came out and was logged as an incident. It probably doesn't get logged unless they are looking for something else. Could this be leaked by Smith's attorneys to change the narrative?

It’s a FOIA request. This is what OU was willing to become public. They’re the holders of the information, and good on the journalists who requested his personnel file. This means they withheld everything that may have been entered since the request was made. I used to be an editor at The Post. We’d be all over this. Hopeful the student journalists have done their due diligence, because this is how they’ll get a job and it’s not like the News or Messenger has done anything. Otherwise we’re lucky it’s now of national relevance. A shame it wasn’t sooner.

I was so excited about OU football entering this year. We were becoming a football school. Idk anymore.
This is good information. Is anyone HR savvy enough to know why other information would be withheld in a FOIA, and this would not? Is it to protect someone?
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Posted: 12/18/2025 8:38 AM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
Not true. He was told he was fired, then went off the deep end. He was apprehended after the statement was released.

Perhaps we were more vague because of how Moore reacted. Maybe.
Oh yeah, I guess he wasn't arrested for a few hours after the statement. But Michigan was well aware by that point of the 'history of domestic violence' towards the staffer. So they understood what was coming. She's the one who presented this info to the University.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6897448/2025/12/17/sherr... /
Last Edited: 12/18/2025 8:38:57 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 8:56 AM
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:expand_more
Not true. He was told he was fired, then went off the deep end. He was apprehended after the statement was released.

Perhaps we were more vague because of how Moore reacted. Maybe.
Oh yeah, I guess he wasn't arrested for a few hours after the statement. But Michigan was well aware by that point of the 'history of domestic violence' towards the staffer. So they understood what was coming. She's the one who presented this info to the University.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6897448/2025/12/17/sherr... /
Correct. I think that's part of the criticism of Michigan, that they should have provided extra security, mental health support, etc., after Moore was let go.

That said, we do not know if there is or there isn't a person cooperating with OU administration in Smith's case.
HeHateMiami
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Posted: 12/18/2025 9:23 AM
BryanHall wrote:expand_more
New York Time$ article mentioning the alcohol reprimand.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6896890/2025/12/17/brian... /
This sounds like the university was investigating him and started asking questions to the staff. This came out and was logged as an incident. It probably doesn't get logged unless they are looking for something else. Could this be leaked by Smith's attorneys to change the narrative?

It’s a FOIA request. This is what OU was willing to become public. They’re the holders of the information, and good on the journalists who requested his personnel file. This means they withheld everything that may have been entered since the request was made. I used to be an editor at The Post. We’d be all over this. Hopeful the student journalists have done their due diligence, because this is how they’ll get a job and it’s not like the News or Messenger has done anything. Otherwise we’re lucky it’s now of national relevance. A shame it wasn’t sooner.

I was so excited about OU football entering this year. We were becoming a football school. Idk anymore.
This is good information. Is anyone HR savvy enough to know why other information would be withheld in a FOIA, and this would not? Is it to protect someone?
It depends on what was actually requested in the public records request or perhaps some of the information is still being finalized so it doesn’t technically fall under the purview of a public records request. For instance, the announcement about Smith being dismissed references an administrative review. There should be some documentation capturing the findings of that review (which would be public record) but it’s possible that said report isn’t technically “final” yet so legal can get away with not including it in what they turn over.
Diamond Cat
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:27 PM
Can we assume there is no other documented violation in Smith's file during the period 11/25 - 12/1? If so, it doesn't appear the violation/misconduct have been made public?

The alcohol incident was addressed through a written reprimand and explicitly warned that FUTURE violations could result in termination. Doesn't this feel like any subsequent violations or misconduct were documented during that window? Would have to be. Right?

Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:36 PM
Diamond Cat wrote:expand_more
Can we assume there is no other documented violation in Smith's file during the period 11/25 - 12/1? If so, it doesn't appear the violation/misconduct have been made public?

The alcohol incident was addressed through a written reprimand and explicitly warned that FUTURE violations could result in termination. Doesn't this feel like any subsequent violations or misconduct were documented during that window? Would have to be. Right?

Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
They: "He did something bad!"

He: "I didn't do anything!"

(Case settles)

Media: "What did he do?"

They: "That matter is now confidential according to the terms of the settlement."
HeHateMiami
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:41 PM
Diamond Cat wrote:expand_more
Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
Ohio University cannot lawfully terminate a public employee for “serious professional misconduct” without creating records that support that decision. Those records may be redacted, summarized, or released after a delay, but they generally exist and are subject to disclosure if properly requested. A settlement does not erase existing public records. It only reduces the likelihood that litigation discovery compels broader disclosure.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:48 PM
HeHateMiami wrote:expand_more
Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
Ohio University cannot lawfully terminate a public employee for “serious professional misconduct” without creating records that support that decision. Those records may be redacted, summarized, or released after a delay, but they generally exist and are subject to disclosure if properly requested. A settlement does not erase existing public records. It only reduces the likelihood that litigation discovery compels broader disclosure.
Not always. University Equity and Civil Rights Compliance complaints and subsequent reports are not privy to public disclosure.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:53 PM
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
HeHateMiami
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Posted: 12/18/2025 12:58 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
Ohio University cannot lawfully terminate a public employee for “serious professional misconduct” without creating records that support that decision. Those records may be redacted, summarized, or released after a delay, but they generally exist and are subject to disclosure if properly requested. A settlement does not erase existing public records. It only reduces the likelihood that litigation discovery compels broader disclosure.
Not always. University Equity and Civil Rights Compliance complaints and subsequent reports are not privy to public disclosure.
That’s partly true. Equity and Civil Rights Compliance complaints and underlying investigative materials are often exempt from public disclosure. But that exemption doesn’t automatically extend to records documenting final employment actions. If a public university terminates an employee for “serious professional misconduct,” records showing the basis and timing of that decision typically still exist and are subject to public-records law, even if redacted.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 1:17 PM
HeHateMiami wrote:expand_more
Seems the discovery process is the risk for Ohio. Being terminated for "serious professional misconduct" without producing records tells me that is forthcoming or they settle without disclosure. Can that happen?
Ohio University cannot lawfully terminate a public employee for “serious professional misconduct” without creating records that support that decision. Those records may be redacted, summarized, or released after a delay, but they generally exist and are subject to disclosure if properly requested. A settlement does not erase existing public records. It only reduces the likelihood that litigation discovery compels broader disclosure.
Not always. University Equity and Civil Rights Compliance complaints and subsequent reports are not privy to public disclosure.
That’s partly true. Equity and Civil Rights Compliance complaints and underlying investigative materials are often exempt from public disclosure. But that exemption doesn’t automatically extend to records documenting final employment actions. If a public university terminates an employee for “serious professional misconduct,” records showing the basis and timing of that decision typically still exist and are subject to public-records law, even if redacted.
Thanks. So it perhaps is a delay in compiling these records?
HeHateMiami
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:23 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
Thanks. So it perhaps is a delay in compiling these records?
That's my guess. The communication we're getting from OU so far is frustratingly vague, but you could throw out that factor and it'd still be impressively fast to get public records for something like this, my guess is that The Athletic put in for Coach Smith's personnel file when the initial announcement of his suspension came out.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:25 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Bitchy Incognito
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:46 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
To be charitable to the university, the redacted section at the end may contain the name of the person with whom the coach apparently had the inappropriate relationship. On the other hand, it seems possible that it will lead to additional commentary about potential lack of transparency and/or effective PR/crisis management.
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:48 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Important to note the WOUB's tweet says "affair" and the letter says "affairs."
Doc Bobcat
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:51 PM
Mike Coleman wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Defense attorney says the Smiths were separated and divorce proceedings were under way so the defense was it wasn’t extramarital.

The bourbon may be enough but Frank escaped tequila and a wrong way vehicle incident.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:57 PM
Doc Bobcat wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Defense attorney says the Smiths were separated and divorce proceedings were under way so the defense was it wasn’t extramarital.

The bourbon may be enough but Frank escaped tequila and a wrong way vehicle incident.
This is insane response.

"Here's some bourbon!"

(Drinks bourbon)

"You're fired!"

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001736268141432989?s=46...

Response seems to indicate a redacted third-party filed these complaints.
colobobcat66
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Posted: 12/18/2025 2:58 PM
Doc Bobcat wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Defense attorney says the Smiths were separated and divorce proceedings were under way so the defense was it wasn’t extramarital.

The bourbon may be enough but Frank escaped tequila and a wrong way vehicle incident.
I love one of the lawyers last comments in the next to last paragraph about who gave Smith the bourbon! That’s a good one. After reading the lawyers letter I’m ready to welcome Smith back, although we may be missing something (you reckon). Grab some popcorn.
Last Edited: 12/18/2025 3:01:23 PM by colobobcat66
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Posted: 12/18/2025 3:15 PM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
I think we should also consider there may be a Rumor A and a Rumor B, and while neither, if true, may be enough to let Smith go, Rumor A+B would be.
BINGO!

https://x.com/kiefermedia/status/2001731585549492477?s=46...
Defense attorney says the Smiths were separated and divorce proceedings were under way so the defense was it wasn’t extramarital.

The bourbon may be enough but Frank escaped tequila and a wrong way vehicle incident.
I love one of the lawyers last comments in the next to last paragraph about who gave Smith the bourbon! That’s a good one. After reading the lawyers letter I’m ready to welcome Smith back, although we may be missing something (you reckon). Grab some popcorn.
Yeah after reading that I'm wondering how much is being blown out proportion, on both sides.
HeHateMiami
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Posted: 12/18/2025 3:17 PM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
After reading the lawyers letter I’m ready to welcome Smith back, although we may be missing something (you reckon). Grab some popcorn.
After reading the lawyer letter I'm going to predict that we end up paying out most of his remaining contract. "Nursing student" sounds scandalous. "41-year old after separation/divorce proceedings began" sounds like a nothing burger.
Mike Coleman
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Posted: 12/18/2025 3:24 PM
I can see it now:


Welcome to Ohio University! We named our field after Frank Solich, who had a nice career after being given a second chance after a DUI. We don't currently have a football coach, because he had a drink of bourbon. We may have to name the field after him after he sues us for several million dollars.
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Posted: 12/18/2025 3:25 PM
HeHateMiami wrote:expand_more
After reading the lawyers letter I’m ready to welcome Smith back, although we may be missing something (you reckon). Grab some popcorn.
After reading the lawyer letter I'm going to predict that we end up paying out most of his remaining contract. "Nursing student" sounds scandalous. "41-year old after separation/divorce proceedings began" sounds like a nothing burger.
I think you're conflating two things.

There's two different women, including an undergrad, right?
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