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Topic: RE: MAC Championship

Topic: RE: MAC Championship

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mid70sbobcat
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 655

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 5:20:00 PM

Recovering Journalist wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

Let me ask a question. How would many of you like to be criticized at your job for every mistake you make? I am guessing that many of you have made plenty of errors at work and will continue to do so. Do you get criticized for every move you make? The players and coaches at Ohio are not trying to lose games. Although after listening to some of the posters on this website, you would think they were perfect. Like all fans, I am not satisfied with the results in 2017. The Bobcats didn't win a conference title this year and haven't since 1968. They had a chance to win ten games and didn't. If you ask the team and all associated with the program, I am certain they are not happy about how the regular season ended. Bounce back Bobcats!. Beat UAB for win nine!

Do you make more than half a million dollars a year from a public institution? You think it's mean or unfair to be upset at yet another year of November collapses? Few people on this board call out the players, but all too many tolerate mediocrity from the coaching staff. And yes, winning seven or eight games a year in a weak division of an unremarkable G5 league is mediocre. I don't think Solich should be fired, but I can't believe the number of people on here who celebrate beating Hampton and Kent State then losing games that matter in November.

Hoping for more should be a good thing, yet those who do are called whiners. Imagine if the basketball team hadn't made the NCAA since 1968 - would we be whiners for wanting more?

So Frank and the coaching staff committed the turnovers that cost us both those games against Akron and Buffalo?

PA Bobcat Fan
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Member Since: 9/19/2005
Post Count: 78

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 7:01:16 PM

Buckeye to Bobcat wrote:

Recovering Journalist wrote:

Bobcat1996 wrote:

Get criticized everyday.....that's called life with a company chief.

We're not expecting perfection at all. It's when you can sit there and predict the script every stinking year because nothing changes it gets old. Remember the definition of insanity? We do the same thing every year with no change, outside of what jersey sponsor we went with this year

^^^^^^^^^This^^^^^^^^^^^^

In honor of our friend Monroe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz1Jwyxd4tE

Recovering Journalist
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Member Since: 8/17/2010
Location: Cleveland, OH
Post Count: 1,839

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 8:15:22 PM

mid70sbobcat wrote:

So Frank and the coaching staff committed the turnovers that cost us both those games against Akron and Buffalo?

You'd rather blame unpaid 18-22-year-olds who are trying their best? I'm more inclined to look at a staff of professionals who've had 13 years to build a championship program and have failed each and every season.

colobobcat66
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Member Since: 9/1/2006
Location: Watching the bobcats run outside my window., CO
Post Count: 4,158

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 8:18:00 PM

Recovering Journalist wrote:

mid70sbobcat wrote:

So Frank and the coaching staff committed the turnovers that cost us both those games against Akron and Buffalo?

I�m more inclined to say it�s a joint effort. I don�t think the kids put it all on the coaches.

Last Edited: 12/2/2017 8:18:57 PM by colobobcat66

Maddog13
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Member Since: 12/21/2004
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Post Count: 597

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 8:19:22 PM

Okay, let the Nation wide coaching search begin. Who do the critics of Solich and company have in mind to replace them? Are we thinking about Jimbo Fischer kind of money? Do we use an executive search firm? Perhaps, we can steal Scott Frost away from Nebraska if we act fast enough. I mean, we are Ohio, right!?!? The point I am making here is simple, in today's world of football, you got to pay to play and pay and pay. I don't think that Solich and company are any less frustrated than you guys are about the outcome of this season; however, I would like to hear some good advice about what can be done about the state of Ohio football from this point on. Have we, in fact, reached our full potential based on our recruiting base, attractiveness of our facilities, and the quality of our coaching staff, or is it truly realistic to expect more at this particular time? I won't get into the hundred dollar handshakes and other unsavory things that many top programs are constantly being alleged of doing. Perhaps, like Miami U. (Florida) did during their prominence, we can become the next "Convict U." and thus bring in terrific athletes, even though they may have alleged character flaws, so to speak. Are Ohio fans really willing to sell their souls to big business/media outlet Devil?

Recovering Journalist
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Member Since: 8/17/2010
Location: Cleveland, OH
Post Count: 1,839

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 8:45:51 PM

Maddog13 wrote:

"Be happy with what you have."

"Hey, at least it's not like Knorr!"

"It's way better than I was in school."

This thinking is sad.

I'm not calling for Solich's head. But I am saying it's no longer honorable or cool or exciting or positive that this staff has stayed the same for this long. You say yourself that we don't have big money--that's true. So it begs the question: Why have no coordinators gotten better offers? Other MAC programs have done much bigger and much better things. Two have made the access bowl. Toledo has a winning bowl record against better teams. Seven different teams have won championships since Solich started.

I'm happy that we're consistently among the top half of the MAC. That's much better than being consistently in the cellar. But we're not in the top tier of the MAC and this staff has not produced the consistent results it would take to put us there. At this program's best, it's won games it should and done great things in a game or two every season. Yet every season we have the same failures. It's a pattern, and some fans are OK with it, but I certainly don't think it's unreasonable that some want more.

PhiTau74
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Member Since: 8/6/2010
Location: Columbia, SC
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 9:33:49 PM

Robert Fox wrote:

Recovering Journalist wrote:

We can't control our conference, but we can stop pretending that 7-8 wins is anything special in the MAC East. With the vaunted continuity and "consistency" on this staff, we ought to expect more.

If it's not special, how come everyone's not doing it? Or are you putting us on a P5 measuring stick?

Since Frank arrived in 2005, Akron, BG twice, Miami and Buffalo have all won MAC Championships so we are certainly not special. Kent lost in double overtime.

Robert Fox
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Member Since: 11/16/2004
Location: Knoxville, TN
Post Count: 2,039

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 9:41:50 PM

PhiTau74 wrote:

Robert Fox wrote:

Recovering Journalist wrote:

We can't control our conference, but we can stop pretending that 7-8 wins is anything special in the MAC East. With the vaunted continuity and "consistency" on this staff, we ought to expect more.

If it's not special, how come everyone's not doing it? Or are you putting us on a P5 measuring stick?

Since Frank arrived in 2005, Akron, BG twice, Miami and Buffalo have all won MAC Championships so we are certainly not special. Kent lost in double overtime.

Does "special" equal "above average"? I don't know, but I'd feel comfortable describing this time as above average--in the MAC. Are we permanently stuck in a rut of 7-8 wins per year? I don't think so. Maybe you do. So be it. But if you're not satisfied, what do you want to happen?

Mark Lembright '85
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Location: Highland Heights, OH
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/2/2017 9:54:40 PM

Robert Fox wrote:

PhiTau74 wrote:

Robert Fox wrote:

Recovering Journalist wrote:

We can't control our conference, but we can stop pretending that 7-8 wins is anything special in the MAC East. With the vaunted continuity and "consistency" on this staff, we ought to expect more.

If it's not special, how come everyone's not doing it? Or are you putting us on a P5 measuring stick?

Since Frank arrived in 2005, Akron, BG twice, Miami and Buffalo have all won MAC Championships so we are certainly not special. Kent lost in double overtime.

Two things would be nice:

1) win MAC East road games against the likes of Akron and Buffalo.
2) defeat CMU when it�s a Homecoming game.

ZIPsCAT
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Member Since: 9/3/2014
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/3/2017 12:53:21 PM

I tend to always bring up Solich as something to strive for when people start calling for Bowden's head. How many teams have we seen in the MAC have one successful season and fall apart soon after the coach leaves? Consistent winning seasons is a treat, and you guys get them a lot more than you don't under Solich's tenure.

The grass isn't always greener, and there are definitely times I wish we'd had Ohio's success over the Last decade vs what we went through over the last decade.

Cats5
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Member Since: 6/14/2017
Post Count: 949

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/3/2017 8:58:17 PM

bshot44 wrote:

Bobcatboy5 wrote:

LynxRufus6 wrote:

Akron made sure they swarmed Detroit with their 1200 strong fanbase. What a joke of a conference championship. Could it be anymore embarrassing that Ohio lost to this same Akron team?

Also- considering not watching the bowl game. While this may be unpopular, I can�t see myself cheering for a team who shit the bed the last few games of the season, when things actually mattered. I feel like they�re being rewarded with a trip to paradise for being mediocre. Not so much the kids, as much as I�m upset with the coaching staff for sheer incompetence.

How about you stop talking shit about them and look at all of the positives this team had? Yeah it's annoying we didn't get the job done, but we're going to have most of our team back for next year. I'm tired of everybody being so negative. Does anybody remember how bad the team was in past years and now we're going to bowls and a couple MAC Championships. I'll always stick with them through thick and thin.

What is the laundry lists of positives?

Please ... enlighten us? Ohio beat Toledo and followed it up with a horrendous loss at Akron rendering that win over Toledo meaningless.

They went 8-5 again!?!? 5-3 in the MAC again?!?! Earned another mid-level bowl bid again?!??!

6 wins vs 6 of the worst 28 teams in the country and 1 vs FCS doormat?!?!

QUIT COMPARING THIS PROGRAM 13 YEARS INTO SOLICH ERA TO KNORR OR LICHTENBERG ERA!!!

That should NOT be the bar we set for expectations anymore...we're past that, aren't we?!?! 13 years in and we're still harping about how bad we were 20 years ago ...

Get over it.

Quit blasting folks for wanting more than a mediocre 8-5 championship-less season every year

Quit being a fan of OU if you are tired of having winning seasons, many bowl appearances,and always in contention for a conference championship. Yeah we haven't had won one in a long time but if you don't think this team will be amazing next year, you're crazy. I don't care if people give their opinion and I don't care to give you guys mine. The bar for expectations are always high but do you realize how good the offense was this year? These are players who aren't very highly recruited and they are able to be in the top 20 in the FBS for the entire year... Yeah they might not have had the year we wanted in the end but I don't think we should bash the team for losing like they did. It's upsetting to see it happen but mark my words, we'll be one of the best and will crack the top 25 next year. Just watch

NashvilleKat
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Location: Nashville, TN
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/3/2017 11:16:26 PM

Everyone gets mad about that elusive MAC championship. Meanwhile, WMU went from New Year's Access Bowl last year to no bowl this year. Toledo's reward is App State in the Mobile Bowl. Something we do regularly. MAC needs to step up its bowl game.

bshot44
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Member Since: 2/12/2012
Post Count: 2,211

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 2:14:15 AM

Bobcatboy5 wrote:

bshot44 wrote:

Bobcatboy5 wrote:

LynxRufus6 wrote:

Top 25 next year? Ha! Okay ... I'll be watching.

I've been hearing the "wait until next year" line so much in recent years you would think the Bobcats are the Chicago Cubs of the MAC.

Again....bowl appearances and "in contention" for a MAC title should be absolute rock bottom expectations for a coaching staff 13 years in scheduling the way they do.

No MAC team has had a coaching staff together this long for a very, very long time .... and none ... IN MAC HISTORY have had a head coach at a program this long and NOT win a MACC.

Those are just facts.

allen
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Member Since: 1/24/2006
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 4:16:56 AM

because they lose their coaches after they win a championship.

Nobody despises to lose more than I do. That's got me into trouble over the years, but it also made a man of mediocre ability into a pretty good coach. Woody Hayes

Recovering Journalist
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 8:32:01 AM

NashvilleKat wrote:

Crappy bowls have always been the reality of the MAC, and they always will be. So has the proliferation of crappy bowls, allowing crappy .500 teams to go to bowl games, rendering the "bowl team" standard nearly meaningless. If anything, those facts make a conference championship a much more important goal for G5 teams.

bshot44
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 8:33:23 AM

allen wrote:

because they lose their coaches after they win a championship.

Of course!!!

Pretty sure winning the championship is the goal, right?

Your statement does nothing to counter the statement that Solich is the longest tenured coach in MAC history to not win a MACC.

It has never taken a coach 13 years to win a MACC. Never in the history of the league.

But at least we aren't as bad as we were in 1994.

Because that is the ONLY conceivable alternative to what we have now.

Robert Fox
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 9:09:48 AM

bshot44 wrote:

Because that is the ONLY conceivable alternative to what we have now.

No, it's not. But it is one of them.

allen
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Member Since: 1/24/2006
Post Count: 4,630

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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 9:10:29 AM

bshot44 wrote:

allen wrote:

because they lose their coaches after they win a championship.

Yes, I am not justifying it. I am just letting the continuity folks know why other MAC teams have not been bowl eligible for eight straight years like we have. They win and their coaches move on.

Nobody despises to lose more than I do. That's got me into trouble over the years, but it also made a man of mediocre ability into a pretty good coach. Woody Hayes

GoCats105
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 10:54:04 AM

Fine, I'll say it:

Stability and continuity, in this day and age of college football, is overrated. How many Group of Five programs which have been unstable can be counted as having more notoriety than Ohio on a national landscape? A TON. Yeah, you can make the argument that they lost their coaches to bigger programs, but that's because they won titles.

Just like in basketball, you win big and you probably lose your coach unless you pony up the dollars. Were we upset as a fan base when John Groce left for Illinois in hoops? Of course, but that's the nature of the beast. Why are fans of Ohio football so numb to the fact this idea of the stability of the Solich era is such a good thing? If that's what the goal is, then that's what the goal is. But good luck recruiting the best athletes you can get that way.

John Groce got us on the front page of the USA Today after beating Georgetown in the NCAA Tournament and got us within a whisker of upsetting North Carolina in the Sweet 16, then he was gone. I wouldn't trade that for anything. Even if you had told me Groce would be leaving after that season, I would have taken it in a heartbeat.

Let's just call the Group of Five and lower level conferences what they are: feeder systems for coaches of the Power Five, and sometimes, even a feeder system for student-athletes. So why shouldn't Ohio as a school, try and take advantage of that? Be the flash in the pan for a year or two and explode onto the national scene.

The Sports Illustrated article which appointed Ohio as the next Boise State ruined this program. Boise State is NOT the norm. They are the exception to the norm. And even their rise to continued success has seen three different head coaches. Ohio may be trying to recreate that magic, but if that's the case why haven't we seen the championships yet? Why haven't we seen a bowl game against someone not from C-USA/Moutain West/Sun Belt?

Cool, we beat Penn State. Cool, we beat Illinois and Pitt. Cool, we beat Kansas twice. You know what the combined record of those teams are? 18-41. Those were GREAT moments for the program, especially Pitt and Penn State. But then you look at the just absolute head-scratching, gut-punching and generally terrible losses and you just shake your damn head because you know the team should be and could be better than this. Especially after 13 years.

So that begs the question who could Ohio hire? Get out there and look at winning programs and look at their coordinators to start. Frank laid the groundwork for winning football here, built the IPF and now the Academic Center. But get a plan in place to bring some new blood into this program or it's going to fall flat on its face when Frank is ready to retire. And that answer is NOT Jim Burrow or Tim Albin or both. I hope they prove me wrong, but the "coach-in-waiting" thing almost never works.

Last Edited: 12/4/2017 10:56:55 AM by GoCats105

bshot44
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 11:48:35 AM

GoCats105 wrote:

This. This. And this.

People are so damn afraid that Ohio will fall back into football irrelevancy like they were in the 70s, 80s and most of the 90s. (HINT, HINT, HINT ... we're not all that relevant now outside the MAC East)

Yes ... that is certainly an option. But I don't think falling that far, that fast is really going to happen considering what Frank has already built. Starting with the facilities, this program is pretty stable. I would hope Jim Schaus is capable of bringing in a guy who can continue to win the 7-8 games vs. these awful schedules that Frank has been able to do.

I don't think he's going to hire a moron that is going to run the program into the ground. It hasn't happened in basketball when he's had to replace Groce and Christian.

Why not have a little faith in Schaus like a majority here seem to have in Frank?

Burrow/Albin are NOT the answer. This program needs an infusion of new blood that can relate to these kids and generate a little excitement into the fan base/student body. Things are really starting to get stale ... you can see it in attendance and general interest. Folks are "bored" with the 7/8 win nondescript seasons that they keep churning out.

Frank IS NOT GOING TO BE FIRED NOR SHOULD HE BE. Re-read that as many times as necessary.

That is not the point of any of this commentary.

The point is that when Frank decides (on his own terms) that he's done ... I am excited to see where the program can go. I think it's obvious, Frank has taken it as far as he can.

I'm tired of the "next year is our year" stuff ... they've been saying that since 2012. And every year ends just about the same. 7/8 wins and a nondescript bowl game.

The investments in this program should make it a pretty enticing landing spot for an up and coming coach .... just like in basketball ... that is willing to come here and cut his teeth and win big (and then maybe leave)

MAC Football is what it is .... and if Frank & Co. after 13 years have NOT been able to take this league by the throat and dominate it ... do you really think you're going to find another coach that is going to come in here and make Athens his final stop and build Ohio to a national brand? It did NOT happen with Frank. It will NOT happen on a long term basis with anyone else.

But there is really no reason why Ohio can't find the next star coach and bring them in and have them take this program to a level Frank & Co have not been able to .... even if it is just for a few short years.

Frank is not the jenga piece that will topple this entire program if removed. I very seriously doubt he spent 13 years building this thing in a way that would crumble the day he walks away.

Last Edited: 12/4/2017 11:49:43 AM by bshot44

Buckeye to Bobcat
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 12:26:07 PM

Maddog13 wrote:

I am going to answer your questions one by one:

Head Coach: Before this thing froze, I actually had some concepts for what we could do, and I will make this short and sweet.

We can always go a few ways:

The Retread Hire-Butch Jones comes to mind here if we were going to go the Akron John Groce route in football. Someone looking to prove himself again and had a successful background prior to last season at Tennessee while also proving to be a relentless recruiter. In addition, Bo Pelini (Actual OU Sports AD Alum) could be in play here, but I don't see him leaving home to come to Athens.

The Coordinator from the power schools-Greg Schiano and Kevin Wilson from Ohio $tate, Jim Leonhard from Wisconsin come to mind here. Wouldn't mind the first two options, especially because both have familiarity with building solid programs while with Schiano being able to identifying younger coaches who could potentially continue the successful pipeline of coaches similar to what Toledo has now and what NIU had for a while with its pipeline.

The Up-and-Comer: Toledo and Central Michigan have figured this out, where they successfully mined Mount Union and Grand Valley State respectively for their next coaching pools. It's a strategy I always like due to the discount we can get a coach at while also having access to future coaches who come from a similar system. In addition, coaches at the smaller level are used to winning without resources and judging by our resources in comparison to the conference, we would need to find someone who can go toe-to-toe and scrap.

For us, I think our answer lies down in Chattanooga by the name of Tom Arth. 36 year old Northeast Ohio native who coached at John Carroll for four years and ACTUALLY beat Mount Union in his time there. Program was 19-21 prior to him taking the reins, went 40-8 during his time at John Carroll. First year coach at Chattanooga and will need 1-2 years to decide how good he can do recruiting that area. Definitely someone we can get on discount before he gets plucked by some Sun Belt team or some other MAC program. Option 2 would be to go after the coordinators of O$U in my opinion, especially given how cheap we could get Schiano who has done well in identifying potential coaches.

Again, my recommendations for coaches:

1. Tom Arth
2. Greg Schiano
3. Kevin Wilson
4. Butch Jones

Facilities: I think everyone knows my stance on this. Our coaches offices are in the tower and not near the weight room, along with our stadium being on its last legs. Our facilities as well are already lagging behind other schools and with EMU's new updates, we will fall further behind in the conference. To fix this, our question comes down to whether we renovate the current stadium or build a new one. The answer to this, and I think Alan Swank knows more to this equation than I do to this, is the Fairgrounds for a future athletic village for football and a future basketball arena/practice facility. If we go the new stadium route, the problems can be fixed on this new site.

However, sticking with the current site would require in my opinion building new offices where Victory Hill is and expanding the weight room/locker room. In this scenario, along with the academic center, this would allow for suites to be sold and be a new source of revenue for the athletic department since we have not been able to capitalize on such revenue in the years of having that tower. With this extra revenue (projecting at least $75,000 per year minimum based on revenue), we would be able to move fans into the Tower Club that had not been able to in the past. Overall this would generate north of $200,000 per year when the musical chairs of upgrades/suite purchases would be complete.

The stadium stands itself need repaired along with ADA expansion. Ohio has done great jobs in attempting to create a better experience for all, but the stadium itself is crumbling. Would have to be quick moves to rebuild the main stands.

The indoor practice facility is great, but if we're going to commit to athletics then the general campus can't have access to this. I still find this to be the biggest load of crap in the history of college athletics that the practice facility is being split with the general university and still operating it. If we're going to move forward as an athletic department, then this thing needs to be solely for Ohio Athletics and no outsiders. I know that goes against the grain at Ohio, but if you want to win you got to make sure your athletes get first dibs when they need it. It shouldn't be a question if Rourke wants to go throw routes in this building and can't because intramural sports are happening in it.

The academic center is a great start too. As I mentioned from a revenue end, academically it helps that this will all be in a building that has far more space than the tower. This will pay off I think moving forward, especially with the building being larger to accommodate more class projects and such.

Recruiting: We have not done as great of a job in developing our Ohio inroads up and down the I-71 corridor along with Western Pennsylvania. Right now, Toledo attacks Western PA and is no mystery to why they are in the hunt for the MAC the last couple decades. Our Florida recruiting has netted well, but within the area we have no executed as well as we could. Columbus should be our honeypot no questions asked with the talent spilling out of there.

Where we do really well and no one can dispute it is our ability to find walk-ons. Definitely a trait from Solich's Nebraska days that I admire, but right now we have missed on too many scholarships in the past. If there is one part I would want to keep moving forward is our walk-on program.

Quality of OUr Coaching Staff: Developing talent, I would say mixed bags. Have done decently well in getting kids into the pros given what we have recruited. X's and O's in big games.....well you know my stance here. We definitely need a spice up here in regards to play-calling and recruiting connections in-state. The one thing that does drive me bonkers about Solich is his loyalty to Albin and Burrow. If either is allowed to become our head coach, I think we would be looking at the Brian Knorr era all over again.

O$U Handshakes: C'mon, really? If I ever heard of this at Ohio I would be mortified and shocked. Then again, get an army of car dealers who believe in shoot, shovel, and shut up along with a couple rogue donors, and it can happen. I wouldn't approve, but you would be shocked at how easy it is to do and get away with.

I think this answers your questions reasonably if we were to move away from Solich and not in a manner that attacks your opinion.

Last Edited: 12/4/2017 12:46:14 PM by Buckeye to Bobcat

Buckeye to Bobcat
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 12:49:05 PM

So yes Maddog13, we have given some thought as to who we want within reason. I know folks are going to rip me for considering the O$U assistants, but let's be real: both are going to have jobs within 3 years at another school because of how good they did at crap schools prior to getting fired or moving on. Remember, Schiano had an 11 win season at Rutgers. Care to guess how many double digit win seasons Rutgers has had? As to Kevin Wilson, he won games at Indiana where we all know it is difficult to win. The guy will be back in a coaching job I think faster than people think.

Last Edited: 12/4/2017 12:49:45 PM by Buckeye to Bobcat

OhioStunter
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Location: Chicago
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 1:11:50 PM

What is the real value of a MAC title in football?

Other than a banner and sweatshirt, does it really change the outcome of where you play?

Toledo's title gets them to the Dollar General Bowl in Mobile (done that).

How did a conference title work for Ohio St.?

Does Alabama care it didn't win a conference title?

I think some people put way too much stock into a short-term value of MAC title over the overall big picture of the program's success.

Mark Lembright '85
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Location: Highland Heights, OH
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 1:14:58 PM

OhioStunter wrote:

I don't think the two are mutually exclusive.

Buckeye to Bobcat
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RE: MAC Championship

Posted: 12/4/2017 1:15:03 PM

OhioStunter wrote:

Well, winning the MAC gives you a better chance of going to an Access Bowl like UCF and Boise State has now done twice in the last 10 years.

If we don't care about a conference championship, might as well play for participation ribbons. I hate to say it, that sounds like someone not wanting the program to continue pushing itself and instead spin its tires in the same mud spot. Might as well go to FCS or down to Division III like Ping wanted us to

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