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Topic:  RE: Solich contract?

Topic:  RE: Solich contract?
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/12/2017 9:39:31 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
I am often amazed at some of the thinking (???) on this, a website 'affiliated with' an institution of education. More simply, what are some of you thinking?...

On this part of your post, we can agree. It's odd that you point out that these sports are 'affiliated with' an institution of education. From reading some posts I might have concluded that these teams were part of a professional sports franchise, where the only goals are winning and making money. Given that the teams are, however, 'affiliated with' an institution of education, it would seem that their first and foremost goal must be to enhance the educational process.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/12/2017 10:04:42 PM 
L.C. wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
I am often amazed at some of the thinking (???) on this, a website 'affiliated with' an institution of education. More simply, what are some of you thinking?...

On this part of your post, we can agree. It's odd that you point out that these sports are 'affiliated with' an institution of education. From reading some posts I might have concluded that these teams were part of a professional sports franchise, where the only goals are winning and making money. Given that the teams are, however, 'affiliated with' an institution of education, it would seem that their first and foremost goal must be to enhance the educational process.


+1

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/12/2017 11:22:16 PM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
L.C. wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
I am often amazed at some of the thinking (???) on this, a website 'affiliated with' an institution of education. More simply, what are some of you thinking?...

On this part of your post, we can agree. It's odd that you point out that these sports are 'affiliated with' an institution of education. From reading some posts I might have concluded that these teams were part of a professional sports franchise, where the only goals are winning and making money. Given that the teams are, however, 'affiliated with' an institution of education, it would seem that their first and foremost goal must be to enhance the educational process.


+1



WRONG.

Do you think that a poll across all of America would find education, instead of winning, would be the first goal of football at the college level?

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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 6:58:58 AM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
L.C. wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
I am often amazed at some of the thinking (???) on this, a website 'affiliated with' an institution of education. More simply, what are some of you thinking?...

On this part of your post, we can agree. It's odd that you point out that these sports are 'affiliated with' an institution of education. From reading some posts I might have concluded that these teams were part of a professional sports franchise, where the only goals are winning and making money. Given that the teams are, however, 'affiliated with' an institution of education, it would seem that their first and foremost goal must be to enhance the educational process.


+1


Below from the Ohio Student-Athlete Handbook

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/ohio/genrel/auto_pdf/...

OHIO ATHLETICS’ MISSION
The mission of OHIO Athletics is to successfully develop the student-athlete as a person, student and athlete. Athletics also contributes to the University through athletic and academic achievement, generates visibility, promotes institutional pride, enhances campus life and serves as a connection with alumni and fans.

OHIO ATHLETICS’ VISION
OHIO Athletics strives to be a national level program through all sports, participating in post-season competition, earning recognition as the premier athletic program in the Mid-American Conference, while renowned for academic excellence through outstanding graduation rates and scholastic honors. Athletics will provide exceptional value and benefit to the mission of Ohio University and community, demonstrate unrivaled pride,and foster relationships with all constituents. OHIO Athletics is committed to the utmost integrity through NCAA rules compliance, fiscal responsibility and student-athlete personal development.

Last Edited: 1/13/2017 7:46:36 AM by Bcat2

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 8:45:49 AM 
Bcat2 wrote:
the Ohio Student-Athlete Handbook wrote:

OHIO ATHLETICS’ MISSION
The mission of OHIO Athletics is to successfully develop the student-athlete as a person, student and athlete. Athletics also contributes to the University through athletic and academic achievement, generates visibility, promotes institutional pride, enhances campus life and serves as a connection with alumni and fans.

That must be a misprint or oversight. It says nothing about winning MAC championships, and we're told that that's the only goal, or at least, the primary one.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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mid70sbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 9:51:16 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
L.C. wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
I am often amazed at some of the thinking (???) on this, a website 'affiliated with' an institution of education. More simply, what are some of you thinking?...

On this part of your post, we can agree. It's odd that you point out that these sports are 'affiliated with' an institution of education. From reading some posts I might have concluded that these teams were part of a professional sports franchise, where the only goals are winning and making money. Given that the teams are, however, 'affiliated with' an institution of education, it would seem that their first and foremost goal must be to enhance the educational process.


+1



WRONG.

Do you think that a poll across all of America would find education, instead of winning, would be the first goal of football at the college level?



You really don't get it do you?

Do we call the guys on the team athlete-students? Or do we call them student-athletes?

And what will 99.99% of the Bobcats players be doing after their college playing days are over? They'll be out in the real world and that education (degree) will be a lot more important than whatever slant you want to put on things.
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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 12:04:48 PM 
Truly that they are called student-athletes and that a handbook emphasizes education means that everyone regards college football as first and foremost an educational endeavor.

The Ivy League recruiting advantage is keeping Alabama from having a quality program.


The next time that you see Santa Claus or The Tooth Fairy, could you put in a good word for me.








Last Edited: 1/13/2017 12:05:31 PM by Monroe Slavin

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ShoreCat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 1:39:04 PM 
Making noise on a message board isn't going to bring about institutional change. All it might do is scare away some regular posters who are tired of the noise. I agree with other responses to this question...contact Schaus directly if you hope to bring about change. Posting on BobcatAttack isn't going to accomplish anything.

It's clear that in the minds of the current administration that Solich has earned the right to coach here as long as he wants.

I've said before that I've had doubts after certain games if we've peaked. But then I remember the success and stability the Solich era has brought the program, especially compared to the years I attended OU when we celebrated victories over KSU by tearing down the goalposts. I'm much happier with the state of the program now.
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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 1:42:04 PM 
I think folks are confusing the objective and interest of the program with that of the student-athlete. And I know at least one poster appears to be confusing OHIO football with Alabama.

The goal of the OHIO football (and other sports) program is to win games (and yes, a MACC) with student-athletes that proudly represent the university both on and off the field. The goal at an Alabama, Clemson, FSU, etc. absolutely takes a shift to the winning versus the concern for the student-athlete. Let's be clear, anyone that thinks Saban has the same concern for the student-athlete as Frank (or other MAC coaches) is delusional. Saban, et all, only care about eligibility, OHIO cares about the student.

All student-athletes come on campus with, yes, the team goal of winning, but also with the individual athletic goals to 1. compete, 2. start, 3. excel, 4. possibly have the opportunity to play professionally. Outside of the football factories, most appreciate that "4" is a dream. A reality that is often quickly realized.

At Ohio, the student-athlete comes on campus with the first and foremost goal of getting an education.

While there are student-athletes at Alabama, Clemson, etc. that appreciate the academic opportunity afforded them (I personally know the starting TE at Georgia and he falls into this area) most set foot on campus of a factory with the single-minded goal (often delusional) that they will be playing on Sunday. Few do. At OHIO we do not regularly attract such an athlete (both from an athletic ability and delusional perspective). And that is okay.

While on campus, I had the pleasure to get to know most every basketball player my junior and senior year. Because of student housing, I also became friends with a number of football players. While each wanted to win games, there was not one that would trade their diploma for a MACC. Not one. Not even considered. Student first. Athlete second. Champion third.

As an alum, I would not want a player that put a MACC ahead of his diploma (or even his/her grades). I would not want an administration that encouraged such values in the program, or encouraged such values in our student-athletes. And as an administration, I would tell any fan or booster that harbored even an inkling of such an environment to take their allegiance and finances and go elsewhere - for you are not OHIO.

As a University we are not the athletic program of Alabama, OSU, Clemson, nor do I want to be. As an academic institution, we are not a Harvard, nor can we be...nor do I want to be.

We are not going to be Boise in football.
We are not going to be a Gonzaga in basketball.
We are OHIO. Our attitude towards athletics is different. Our ethos as a university are different. If, as an alum, you don't get that (or want that)....then you don't get OHIO. And that is a shame.





Last Edited: 1/13/2017 2:40:29 PM by cc-cat
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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 1:47:40 PM 
Thank you.

Now that I know the correct and allowed opinion and point of view, I will change my thinking.



Can't wait until the next election for POTUS when there will be only one viewpoint, the correct viewpoint, such that there will be only one candidate on the ballot.



Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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rpbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 2:15:25 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:


Can't wait until the next election for POTUS when there will be only one viewpoint, the correct viewpoint, such that there will be only one candidate on the ballot.



Presuming that the one candidate is DJT,I'm O.K. with that. :-)
(O.K.,let the slings and arrows begin)
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Robert Fox
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 2:23:19 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
an MACC


I just can't accept this. An MACC? An? The word MACC is to be read as "Mack" or "Championship" or "Mid American Championship," all of which call for the aricle A. Not An.

Come on...

(kidding)
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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 2:33:32 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Thank you.
Now that I know the correct and allowed opinion and point of view, I will change my thinking.

Can't wait until the next election for POTUS when there will be only one viewpoint, the correct viewpoint, such that there will be only one candidate on the ballot.


First of all, you are welcome. And no, you are more than welcome to have a differing view. Everyone knows you are all about a MACC. But now we are getting into a deeper discussion of ethos and attitudes, so I'd be interested in what it is I presented that you find disturbing or off?

Two points I presented: 1. that we should not (and I do not) want the OHIO football program to reflect the same priorities as an Alabama. A university that (having spoken to Alabama alum this week) sees this past season as a disappointment because they did not win the Nat. Championship (the equivalent of Ohio winning a MACC) - "erase it from memory." And a program that in order to reach that annual goal sees its players as athletes-students. A program that over recruits and runs players off to make room for new meat, and whose academic focus regarding the player is on eligibility.

I do not want a program with those priorities. Do you. I don't want to hear, "12 years without a MACC..."

Alabama approach yes....no --- you see the results they get. Approach -- Yes....No

Second point - Student athlete. I do not want OHIO to have athletes that put winning a MACC above attaining their diploma. Frankly, I don't want athletes that even contemplate the question.

Student first. Athlete second. Champion third.

Agree? Yes....No

(I know, the second one is a no-brainer. There is not a member of this board that would want such an athlete (MACC First) representing OHIO....or is there?)

FYI - I am more than happy to turn this into an election regarding the state of the OHIO program on these issues.

Last Edited: 1/13/2017 3:03:22 PM by cc-cat
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 2:33:56 PM 
Robert Fox wrote:
cc-cat wrote:
an MACC


I just can't accept this. An MACC? An? The word MACC is to be read as "Mack" or "Championship" or "Mid American Championship," all of which call for the aricle A. Not An.

Come on...

(kidding)

Other than that, that was an outstanding post by cc-cat.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 2:36:41 PM 
"Bless me Robert for I have sinned. My last spell check was two days ago."

(those raised Catholic will get that)
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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 3:06:41 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
"Bless me Robert for I have sinned. My last spell check was two days ago."

(those raised Catholic will get that)


Converted to from Methodist, yet still got it. You are on a roll. Your thoughts on Ohio student-athletics dovetail perfectly with what I believe Coach Solich was hired to maintain. After Nebraska, I believe he had no desire to manage another factory.

Last Edited: 1/13/2017 6:35:39 PM by Bcat2

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giacomo
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 3:32:13 PM 
CCcat, LS, et al, you've put it all in black and white and some much needed perspective.
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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 6:42:07 PM 
True. And without any self-righteousness!


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MonroeClassmate
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 7:07:17 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
I think folks are confusing the objective and interest of the program with that of the student-athlete. And I know at least one poster appears to be confusing OHIO football with Alabama.

We are not going to be Boise in football.



We are not going to be Boise in football. (Nor WMU, Toledo, NIU or CMU) We ARE OHIO. By Gaud, I think I got it!

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cc-cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/13/2017 9:31:15 PM 
MonroeClassmate wrote:
cc-cat wrote:
I think folks are confusing the objective and interest of the program with that of the student-athlete. And I know at least one poster appears to be confusing OHIO football with Alabama.

We are not going to be Boise in football,


We are not going to be Boise in football. (Nor WMU, Toledo, NIU or CMU) We ARE OHIO. By Gaud, I think I got it!


No, we can be WMU, Toldeo, etc. but not Boise. Simply because, as has been outlined on other threads, we do not have the fan population (Boise/all of Idaho), and more importantly do not have the corporate base to support the program. Boise has a $15 million stadium rights deal and have a TV deal (on top of the Mountain West deal) that assures them an additional $1.2 to $1.8 million per year. How long have we been looking for a naming rights sponsor? Four years I believe it has been.

The reference to Gonzaga was for the same population and corporate opportunities. And of course it helps their basketball program that they do not have football taking dollars out of the register.

Monroe Slavin wrote:
True. And without any self-righteousness!


I'm more often called pragmatic. Whatever. Rather be the self-righteous guy than the cowbell guy.

Last Edited: 1/13/2017 9:34:45 PM by cc-cat
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catfan28
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/14/2017 12:26:56 AM 
If we could have gotten ranked (and stayed there) in 2012, I do tend to believe we could have become Boise-esque. Frank would have stayed, recruiting would have improved and we could have maintained success at a level above other MAC programs.

But alas, we lost to Fiami and Tettleton decided to become a diva. The rest, as they say, is history.

It would be hard to become a Boise without a coach that plans to stay and not jump at the first hint of mild success. Usually in the MAC, a coach staying beyond 4 years is a rarity.
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/14/2017 8:26:35 AM 
"But alas, we lost to Fiami and the fans blamed Tettleton and turned on him. The rest, as they say, is history."

Fixed that.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/14/2017 1:43:11 PM 
Seriously, you blame fans for their opinions?

You think any drop off in his performance was because of opinions expressed here?



Again, the new rules and accepted orthodoxy: All results must be happily accepted. It must be understood that the program is in perfect, unassailable shape.




There has been very little criticism of TT on this board.



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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/14/2017 3:11:27 PM 
Are you saying that I'm not entitled to my opinion? I was shocked at the time by the attacks on him, and said so at the time. It's true that just because the change in his performance came immediately after the attacks, that does not guarantee causation, but I will always believe there was causation. You're proud enough of your opinion that you post it repeatedly. Why not go ahead and accept the logical consequences?

As I have said before, I don't think that criticism of players on here today has the same effect as it did in 2012. The players know not to come here, and know that if they do, they won't find support nor knowledgeable commentary. From 2005 until the Miami game in 2012 was a special time on BA. The players had universal support, and you saw parents posting here, and even occasionally players. That is gone forever.

Seriously, though, why do fans cheer? Because we think it will improve our team's performance. Why do we boo or criticize foes? Because we think it will have a negative effect on performance. I don't see anything particularly strange about my opinion. It seems to be pretty consistent with psychological theory.

Last Edited: 1/14/2017 3:28:33 PM by L.C.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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Mark Lembright '85
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  Message Not Read  RE: Solich contract?
   Posted: 1/14/2017 5:14:40 PM 
Agreed LC, posts generally seem much more caustic on BA than they were 7-8 years ago, and that sad fact is not up for debate unfortunately.
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