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Topic:  RE: General Chaos

Topic:  RE: General Chaos
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OhioCatFan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 14,016

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 12:02:13 AM 
Students were not always this apathetic, but you have go back a long ways to find it otherwise, with a few notable exceptions in recent decades -- like the Pitt game in the Solich Era and the Iowa State game during Knorr's tenure. But, going way back to my day (and there are a few others on here that came verify this), you could drive by Peden Stadium at about 10:30 on a Saturday game day (with a 1:00 or 1:30 kickoff) and see the student side half to three-quarters filled already, with card sections practicing their various messages. Probably some of you will have to ask your grandparents what card sections were, as I've very seldom seen them in recent years. Students would stay through the whole game unless it was a real blowout one way or the other and then you'd see a gradual emptying of the stadium in the late third and early fourth quarters. There was no mass exodus after the band played. I started school before the 110 was conceived and ended my undergraduate career when the 110 had just begun as an all-male band. This was 1962-1968. I wasn't really a six-year undergraduate. I had a stint in 1964-66 as an active duty naval reservist.

Last Edited: 9/9/2016 12:05:26 AM by OhioCatFan


The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 12:07:35 AM 
11+ years in there's no reason to think anything will change unless something significant changes.

Some of us are not satisfied. Some of us love OHIO UNIVERSITY. Some of us want a MAC title.



Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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Campus Flow
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Location: Alexandria, VA
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 12:17:31 AM 
GoCats105 wrote:
Bcat2 wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
. . . Ohio? Staff together 11+ years and no offers....


You know this for a fact?



What I believe is that Ohio/Solich has provided stability for coaches who are seeking that. Athens is great, the money is good enough, why leave? Stability and security are magnets for coaches who just want to coach.



That is the very definition of apathy and mediocrity. "Oh well, money is good, I like where I live, why try to get anything better?"

If that's truly how Ohio's coaches think, then please lets change things up. This isn't Athens, GA. It's Athens, OH. I want coaches who have a FIRE to be better than what they are.

Athens, OH is great for normies like us who loved college and never wanted to leave. For a football coach, he should want to win 12 games and get a better job outta there. Ohio plays in the MAC, one maybe two steps up from the worst conferences in college football. Give me some coaches who want to move on to bigger things. That's the nature of MAC schools. Frank and Co. being around for so long is not the standard. They are the exception to the rule.

My favorite example of this is Arkansas State. They had 4 different head coaches in 4 years: Hugh Freeze, Gus Malzahn, Bryan Harsin and Blake Anderson. You wanna know their season results?

2011: Freeze, 10-3 and Sun Belt Conference Champs
2012: Malzahn, 10-3, Sun Belt Conference Champs, bowl win
2013: Harsin, 8-5, Sun Belt Conference Co-Champ, bowl win
2014: Anderson, 7-6, bowl game

And then another Sun Belt Championship in 2015 at 9-4.

Four straight years of instability in the program, yet they've won or shared a Sun Belt championship 4/5 years.


Solich is a bargain compared to those Arkansas State coaches with almost as much success. To bring in a top assistant it will do more for Ohio once a few more facility projects are complete. Schaus won't move on another coach until the next president arrives which buys Frank a few more years.


Most Memorable Bobcat Events Attended
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Maryland Bobcat
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Location: Annapolis, MD
Post Count: 167

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 7:49:21 AM 
boydhallbobcat wrote:
Do all stations take that many media timeouts? Seems like the National games don't take as many. I thought maybe the smaller CBS sports (I know CBS isn't small, but their little sports channels aren't on basic cable) have to take more commercial breaks bc they can't get people to pay a lot for a time slot during an Ohio/Tx State type game. It was torturous.


Welcome to games on CBS SportsNet! I was actually at the game televised prior on CBSSN (Navy) as I am most weeks. They've been a broadcast partner now for several years, and I can tell you it's wearing thin on people here, too. I was actually surprised the OU game was aired on time because most weeks the Navy games go 4+ hours. The AD in Annapolis continues to send out emails asking people to stay four quarters, but for a lot of us we can't. I have a toddler and after about 2 hours starts losing interesting. We actually downgraded our real seats to SRO on the hill so we can at least move around. If we knew an end was in site we'd stay, but at the two-hour mark is usually halftime.

I'm fine with taking media timeouts, but they are excruciatingly long. College football has to start understanding this or they will continue to lose game-day attendance.
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GoCats105
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Location: Seattle, WA
Post Count: 6,870

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 8:43:14 AM 
Uncle Wes wrote:
GoCats105 wrote:
Bcat2 wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
. . . Ohio? Staff together 11+ years and no offers....


You know this for a fact?



What I believe is that Ohio/Solich has provided stability for coaches who are seeking that. Athens is great, the money is good enough, why leave? Stability and security are magnets for coaches who just want to coach.



That is the very definition of apathy and mediocrity. "Oh well, money is good, I like where I live, why try to get anything better?"

If that's truly how Ohio's coaches think, then please lets change things up. This isn't Athens, GA. It's Athens, OH. I want coaches who have a FIRE to be better than what they are.

Athens, OH is great for normies like us who loved college and never wanted to leave. For a football coach, he should want to win 12 games and get a better job outta there. Ohio plays in the MAC, one maybe two steps up from the worst conferences in college football. Give me some coaches who want to move on to bigger things. That's the nature of MAC schools. Frank and Co. being around for so long is not the standard. They are the exception to the rule.

My favorite example of this is Arkansas State. They had 4 different head coaches in 4 years: Hugh Freeze, Gus Malzahn, Bryan Harsin and Blake Anderson. You wanna know their season results?

2011: Freeze, 10-3 and Sun Belt Conference Champs
2012: Malzahn, 10-3, Sun Belt Conference Champs, bowl win
2013: Harsin, 8-5, Sun Belt Conference Co-Champ, bowl win
2014: Anderson, 7-6, bowl game

And then another Sun Belt Championship in 2015 at 9-4.

Four straight years of instability in the program, yet they've won or shared a Sun Belt championship 4/5 years.


Solich is a bargain compared to those Arkansas State coaches with almost as much success. To bring in a top assistant it will do more for Ohio once a few more facility projects are complete. Schaus won't move on another coach until the next president arrives which buys Frank a few more years.


For comparison's sake:

Freeze's salary at Arkansas State was a little over $200K.

http://www.memphisflyer.com/CityBeatBlog/archives/2011/11...

Malzahn made $850K. Probably because he won a national championship as a coordinator at Auburn. He earned that.

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/12/19/arkansas-stat... /

Harsin's was $700K with a buyout clause of $1.75 million.

http://www.arkansasnews.com/roy-ockert/new-coach-s-contra...




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OhioStunter
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Member Since: 2/18/2005
Location: Chicago
Post Count: 2,516

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 10:29:34 AM 
GoCats105 wrote:
Bcat2 wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
. . . Ohio? Staff together 11+ years and no offers....


You know this for a fact?



What I believe is that Ohio/Solich has provided stability for coaches who are seeking that. Athens is great, the money is good enough, why leave? Stability and security are magnets for coaches who just want to coach.



That is the very definition of apathy and mediocrity. "Oh well, money is good, I like where I live, why try to get anything better?"

If that's truly how Ohio's coaches think, then please lets change things up. This isn't Athens, GA. It's Athens, OH. I want coaches who have a FIRE to be better than what they are.

Athens, OH is great for normies like us who loved college and never wanted to leave. For a football coach, he should want to win 12 games and get a better job outta there. Ohio plays in the MAC, one maybe two steps up from the worst conferences in college football. Give me some coaches who want to move on to bigger things. That's the nature of MAC schools. Frank and Co. being around for so long is not the standard. They are the exception to the rule.

My favorite example of this is Arkansas State. They had 4 different head coaches in 4 years: Hugh Freeze, Gus Malzahn, Bryan Harsin and Blake Anderson. You wanna know their season results?

2011: Freeze, 10-3 and Sun Belt Conference Champs
2012: Malzahn, 10-3, Sun Belt Conference Champs, bowl win
2013: Harsin, 8-5, Sun Belt Conference Co-Champ, bowl win
2014: Anderson, 7-6, bowl game

And then another Sun Belt Championship in 2015 at 9-4.

Four straight years of instability in the program, yet they've won or shared a Sun Belt championship 4/5 years.


Given the option of having a coach that is committed to the program and Athens, Ohio, is not a bad thing in my opinion. Especially when he runs a winning program. Sure, we could want the next young buck to coach our team for a few years, make a big splash and then leap to the next big-time program for a bigger payday. Then what will our complaints be?

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shabamon
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Location: Cincinnati
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 10:40:44 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:



If there are any students or recent grads here, I'd like to hear what they have to say about the typical student. Of course, just the fact that a student or recent grad is here makes them personally more attuned to OHIO FOOTBALL.



The typical student sees a team that is not top 25 and assumes it sucks.
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OU_Country
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Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 10:57:18 AM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
Long time reader and first time poster. 2015 grad and rarely missed a football or basketball game since 2010.

Monroe is spot on. Ohio st ruins any hope of establishing a great culture for athletics for students. High school seniors with any interest in college sports stay in c-bus, simple as that. Nothing infuriated me more than seeing kids walking around in red jerseys on Saturdays.

Court st takes priority over pretty much everything in Athens from a students' standpoint.



Does this apply, in your opinion, to Football only, or basketball as well? I ask because I believe 2/3 of people who call themselves OSU fans really only care about the football team. And the majority of those only do it because it's the socially in thing to do on Saturdays.


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spongeBOB CATpants
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 11:24:48 AM 
OU_Country wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
Long time reader and first time poster. 2015 grad and rarely missed a football or basketball game since 2010.

Monroe is spot on. Ohio st ruins any hope of establishing a great culture for athletics for students. High school seniors with any interest in college sports stay in c-bus, simple as that. Nothing infuriated me more than seeing kids walking around in red jerseys on Saturdays.

Court st takes priority over pretty much everything in Athens from a students' standpoint.



Does this apply, in your opinion, to Football only, or basketball as well? I ask because I believe 2/3 of people who call themselves OSU fans really only care about the football team. And the majority of those only do it because it's the socially in thing to do on Saturdays.




I would say it depends mostly on if the team was good or not that season. From my experience the most hype for football came right after we beat Penn St, I could really sense a heightened..."awareness" that we had a decent team.

Basketball seemed to have attracted more passionate students and I think this is partly because the ozone sits right on the floor. I also witnessed some damn good games/players during those years so it was easy to get excited for. Nature Boy was a huge reason a lot of students came to games during his 2 seasons same with DJ Cooper. They were flashy and fun to watch.

I should also note that I was a student-athlete so I had a more personal connection with every team at Ohio.
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GoCats105
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Location: Seattle, WA
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 12:49:04 PM 
OhioStunter wrote:
GoCats105 wrote:
Bcat2 wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
. . . Ohio? Staff together 11+ years and no offers....


You know this for a fact?



What I believe is that Ohio/Solich has provided stability for coaches who are seeking that. Athens is great, the money is good enough, why leave? Stability and security are magnets for coaches who just want to coach.



That is the very definition of apathy and mediocrity. "Oh well, money is good, I like where I live, why try to get anything better?"

If that's truly how Ohio's coaches think, then please lets change things up. This isn't Athens, GA. It's Athens, OH. I want coaches who have a FIRE to be better than what they are.

Athens, OH is great for normies like us who loved college and never wanted to leave. For a football coach, he should want to win 12 games and get a better job outta there. Ohio plays in the MAC, one maybe two steps up from the worst conferences in college football. Give me some coaches who want to move on to bigger things. That's the nature of MAC schools. Frank and Co. being around for so long is not the standard. They are the exception to the rule.

My favorite example of this is Arkansas State. They had 4 different head coaches in 4 years: Hugh Freeze, Gus Malzahn, Bryan Harsin and Blake Anderson. You wanna know their season results?

2011: Freeze, 10-3 and Sun Belt Conference Champs
2012: Malzahn, 10-3, Sun Belt Conference Champs, bowl win
2013: Harsin, 8-5, Sun Belt Conference Co-Champ, bowl win
2014: Anderson, 7-6, bowl game

And then another Sun Belt Championship in 2015 at 9-4.

Four straight years of instability in the program, yet they've won or shared a Sun Belt championship 4/5 years.


Given the option of having a coach that is committed to the program and Athens, Ohio, is not a bad thing in my opinion. Especially when he runs a winning program. Sure, we could want the next young buck to coach our team for a few years, make a big splash and then leap to the next big-time program for a bigger payday. Then what will our complaints be?



No different than the complaints we see on the basketball board. Sure there are a select few who get mad when a successful coach like Groce goes on to bigger things, but most people realize that's the nature of the business for schools the size of Ohio.

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Monroe Slavin
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Location: Oxnard, CA
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 3:59:46 PM 
So, big wins--Penn State uptick mentioned above--do count.

A coach who'd run off if he led us to a MAC title-so we shouldn't go that way because he'd win and leave. Seriously, you don't want signature wins and a MAC title because of that? Sorry, that makes no sense to me.


Consider: the downfalling consistency of the last 11+ years looks like it's on the verge of uh oh. Sad; student almost total apathy.





Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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OhioStunter
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 4:34:26 PM 
I guess I don't see the rationale to be "disappointed" with a coach who has been committed to Ohio University and Athens, Ohio, while running a winning program.

If the argument is that you'd rather have more turnover at the head coaching level with hungrier, younger talent that leaves for greener pastures after a few years, I'm not sure that is really all that better than what we have now.


Over the past 11 years:

Ohio
-1 head coach
-80 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-0 MACC

Toledo
-3 head coaches
-79 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

WMU
-2 head coaches
-68 wins
-5 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

BGSU
-3 head coaches
-74 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-3 losing seasons
-2 MACC

CMU
-3 head coaches
-77 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-3 MACC
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OU_Country
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Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 4:43:46 PM 
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
OU_Country wrote:
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:
Long time reader and first time poster. 2015 grad and rarely missed a football or basketball game since 2010.

Monroe is spot on. Ohio st ruins any hope of establishing a great culture for athletics for students. High school seniors with any interest in college sports stay in c-bus, simple as that. Nothing infuriated me more than seeing kids walking around in red jerseys on Saturdays.

Court st takes priority over pretty much everything in Athens from a students' standpoint.



Does this apply, in your opinion, to Football only, or basketball as well? I ask because I believe 2/3 of people who call themselves OSU fans really only care about the football team. And the majority of those only do it because it's the socially in thing to do on Saturdays.




I would say it depends mostly on if the team was good or not that season. From my experience the most hype for football came right after we beat Penn St, I could really sense a heightened..."awareness" that we had a decent team.

Basketball seemed to have attracted more passionate students and I think this is partly because the ozone sits right on the floor. I also witnessed some damn good games/players during those years so it was easy to get excited for. Nature Boy was a huge reason a lot of students came to games during his 2 seasons same with DJ Cooper. They were flashy and fun to watch.

I should also note that I was a student-athlete so I had a more personal connection with every team at Ohio.



Thanks for the feedback. Adds fuel to the argument for the excitement about the "big win" that everyone references in football.

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Monroe Slavin
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Location: Oxnard, CA
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 6:30:51 PM 
OhioStunter wrote:
I guess I don't see the rationale to be "disappointed" with a coach who has been committed to Ohio University and Athens, Ohio, while running a winning program.

If the argument is that you'd rather have more turnover at the head coaching level with hungrier, younger talent that leaves for greener pastures after a few years, I'm not sure that is really all that better than what we have now.


Over the past 11 years:

Ohio
-1 head coach
-80 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-0 MACC

Toledo
-3 head coaches
-79 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

WMU
-2 head coaches
-68 wins
-5 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

BGSU
-3 head coaches
-74 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-3 losing seasons
-2 MACC

CMU
-3 head coaches
-77 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-3 MACC



Wait a minute. I appreciate your efforts. But where are the other 6 MACC over those years.

Then, I'm not sure that this will prove anything other than 1 man can win a lot of games coaching a MAC team (which faces 4-6 patsies a year) if he sticks around long enough.


Also, I'd like t see two groupings: teams that have MACC in last 11 years vs. those that don't.







Last Edited: 9/9/2016 6:32:23 PM by Monroe Slavin


Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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CA Bobcat
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Location: San Ramon, CA
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 7:18:24 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
OhioStunter wrote:
I guess I don't see the rationale to be "disappointed" with a coach who has been committed to Ohio University and Athens, Ohio, while running a winning program.

If the argument is that you'd rather have more turnover at the head coaching level with hungrier, younger talent that leaves for greener pastures after a few years, I'm not sure that is really all that better than what we have now.


Over the past 11 years:

Ohio
-1 head coach
-80 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-0 MACC

Toledo
-3 head coaches
-79 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

WMU
-2 head coaches
-68 wins
-5 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

BGSU
-3 head coaches
-74 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-3 losing seasons
-2 MACC

CMU
-3 head coaches
-77 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-3 MACC



Wait a minute. I appreciate your efforts. But where are the other 6 MACC over those years.

Then, I'm not sure that this will prove anything other than 1 man can win a lot of games coaching a MAC team (which faces 4-6 patsies a year) if he sticks around long enough.


Also, I'd like t see two groupings: teams that have MACC in last 11 years vs. those that don't.









If you want to see two groupings, then put it together and post it.
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OhioStunter
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Location: Chicago
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/9/2016 7:58:27 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
OhioStunter wrote:
I guess I don't see the rationale to be "disappointed" with a coach who has been committed to Ohio University and Athens, Ohio, while running a winning program.

If the argument is that you'd rather have more turnover at the head coaching level with hungrier, younger talent that leaves for greener pastures after a few years, I'm not sure that is really all that better than what we have now.


Over the past 11 years:

Ohio
-1 head coach
-80 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-0 MACC

Toledo
-3 head coaches
-79 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

WMU
-2 head coaches
-68 wins
-5 bowl appearances
-4 losing seasons
-0 MACC

BGSU
-3 head coaches
-74 wins
-6 bowl appearances
-3 losing seasons
-2 MACC

CMU
-3 head coaches
-77 wins
-7 bowl appearances
-2 losing seasons
-3 MACC



Wait a minute. I appreciate your efforts. But where are the other 6 MACC over those years.

Then, I'm not sure that this will prove anything other than 1 man can win a lot of games coaching a MAC team (which faces 4-6 patsies a year) if he sticks around long enough.


Also, I'd like t see two groupings: teams that have MACC in last 11 years vs. those that don't.




The other 6 MACCs came from NIU (3), Akron, Miami and Buffalo.

NIU just does it right. But for the other 3 teams with MACCs, would you want any of these performances over the past 11 years? -- (that's 26 combined losing seasons)

Akron
-3 head coaches
-45 wins
-2 bowl appearances
-8 losing seasons
-1 MACC

Buffalo
-4 head coaches
-48 wins
-2 bowl appearances
-9 losing seasons (bowl or bust?)
-1 MACC

Miami
-4 head coaches
-41 wins (Solich has nearly double that)
-1 bowl appearance
-9 losing seasons
-1 MACC

My point remains: Ohio's 11-year record under Frank Solich compared to other MAC team records over the same period (and multiple coaches) is pretty, pretty good. Clearly, NIU and CMU did better with 6 MACCs between them.

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Monroe Slavin
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Location: Oxnard, CA
Post Count: 9,121

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 2:32:16 AM 
That's a possible conclusion.

But if the goal is a MAC title, I like the approach of evaluating a coach on his progress toward that. And changing if need be.

How many years does Solich get?


How many years do other MAC schools give guys who can't get it done?

Note that the record is 80-62. And that includes all games (not just MAC games). So the average is about 7-6 per year--against a sched with 4-6 patsies per year.

I don't agree with the number of total wins over a period of years as a criteria. The goal is a MAC title.

See the thread where there's some discussion about how students feel about the program. 'What football? What program?' seems to be the widespread feeling.


Sorry. When a coach is hired for one prime goal, one goal clearly above other goals, and doesn't get it done in 11 years in a weak conference such as the MAC....hey, how'd you enjoy 54-56 vs. Texas State?


And nearing three months with barely a single bit of news in the recruiting threads....there's beginning to be an air about this...


Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Pets On The Go Collection of pet gear travel bags
The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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OhioStunter
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Member Since: 2/18/2005
Location: Chicago
Post Count: 2,516

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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 12:12:15 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:


I don't agree with the number of total wins over a period of years as a criteria. The goal is a MAC title.



If the criteria is only winning a MAC title, would you call the last 11 years of Akron, Miami and Buffalo football a success? A MACC, but also 8-9 losing seasons? I wouldn't.

I wouldn't trade any of their records for Ohio over the past 11 years. Do I want at least one MACC? Absolutely. Is my program a complete failure because I haven't achieved it? If I have 80 wins (second only to NIU during that span), 7 bowl appearances and only 2 losing seasons, I don't think so. But I know some people believe that.

Monroe Slavin wrote:

See the thread where there's some discussion about how students feel about the program. 'What football? What program?' seems to be the widespread feeling.



I really don't believe that has ANYTHING to do with a MACC. I just don't. We've consistently led the MAC in FB attendance, but this is never going to be the Horseshoe. General fan apathy at OU has been an issue for years, but I don't think it's ever been better for football than under Solich.

Monroe Slavin wrote:



Sorry. When a coach is hired for one prime goal, one goal clearly above other goals, and doesn't get it done in 11 years in a weak conference such as the MAC....hey, how'd you enjoy 54-56 vs. Texas State?



Where was this goal - "one goal clearly above other goals" - ever stated? I looked back at the presser when he was hired -- no mention of this as the goal. None. It talked about building a winning program, great academics and being at the top of the conference. Surely, a MACC must be implied, but was never defined as the clear, "end-all-be-all" goal for Solich to be evaluated for success.(http://www.ohiobobcats.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/12160... )


Monroe Slavin wrote:



And nearing three months with barely a single bit of news in the recruiting threads....there's beginning to be an air about this...



I think this is the area I'm most disappointed with. I would have thought with the reputation of Solich, the consistency of the coaching staff, the athletic facilities, the campus, the national TV exposure, the bowl games, etc., we would have a better recruiting advantage over other MAC schools. And I don't think that has been the case.

His record in the conference over the past four years has been average -- and I do expect better performance in the conference.







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The Optimist
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 12:24:56 PM 
shabamon wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:



If there are any students or recent grads here, I'd like to hear what they have to say about the typical student. Of course, just the fact that a student or recent grad is here makes them personally more attuned to OHIO FOOTBALL.



The typical student sees a team that is not top 25 and assumes it sucks.


Yes.

I'll point to my avatar at left as one of the examples of student interest under Solich.

I don't think there is much room for debate that Solich has brought us better crowds than any of the coaches immediately preceding him and it isn't even close.

Maintaining momentum is hugely important and an opening week loss like we saw last week is very costly. It isn't time to abandon ship yet though. We win some games and the students will show up.

Last Edited: 9/10/2016 12:28:39 PM by The Optimist


I've seen crazier things happen.

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 12:34:54 PM 
Stunter--Not going to argue back too much, other than this: If a CEO doesn't hit the main thing he's hired for and, in fact starts to have milestone type bade results, then what happens?

If MAC title is not the goal, then what is? (And don't tell me it's baseline, minimum goals such as student progress.)

Answer: How many years does a coach get with no MAC? How many years if the last 3-4 of his tenure are filled with 3-4 real stinko losses a year?


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The Optimist
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 12:38:52 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:

If MAC title is not the goal, then what is?



Top 25 rankings.


I've seen crazier things happen.

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/10/2016 3:49:32 PM 
So you're angry because we've hit that for what--one week in 11+ years...and moving away from it over the last 4 years?



Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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OhioStunter
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/12/2016 6:05:43 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Stunter--Not going to argue back too much, other than this: If a CEO doesn't hit the main thing he's hired for and, in fact starts to have milestone type bade results, then what happens?

If MAC title is not the goal, then what is? (And don't tell me it's baseline, minimum goals such as student progress.)

Answer: How many years does a coach get with no MAC? How many years if the last 3-4 of his tenure are filled with 3-4 real stinko losses a year?



The CEO should absolutely deliver on the main thing she/he is hired for. No argument there. But if we are going to use this analogy, it is important to determine what exactly the CEO was hired to do.

They are typically given a set of goals to reach and the Board determines at the end of each contract if those goals have been achieved to their satisfaction.

I would imagine Solich has the same set of criteria. I haven't seen it, but I doubt the only thing listed is:

__ Win Conference Championship

It may very well be in there, but he most likely would be measured on:

__ Maintaining winning percentage

__ Helping drive donations for athletic facilities

__ Continuing above-average graduation rates

__ Maintaining above-average team GPA

__ Creating a strong, credible image locally and nationally

__ Dealing with team discipline issues quickly and according to the process

__ Creating a strong relationship with alumni

__ Building the recruiting pipeline

__ Consistently competing for a conference championship

The point of this original discussion -- for me anyway -- was to point out that other than NIU and CMU, I wouldn't trade the 11-year performance of Ohio with any other MAC school -- even if one of those schools did win a MACC.
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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/12/2016 6:36:31 PM 
OhioStunter wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Stunter--Not going to argue back too much, other than this: If a CEO doesn't hit the main thing he's hired for and, in fact starts to have milestone type bade results, then what happens?

If MAC title is not the goal, then what is? (And don't tell me it's baseline, minimum goals such as student progress.)

Answer: How many years does a coach get with no MAC? How many years if the last 3-4 of his tenure are filled with 3-4 real stinko losses a year?



The CEO should absolutely deliver on the main thing she/he is hired for. No argument there. But if we are going to use this analogy, it is important to determine what exactly the CEO was hired to do.

They are typically given a set of goals to reach and the Board determines at the end of each contract if those goals have been achieved to their satisfaction.

I would imagine Solich has the same set of criteria. I haven't seen it, but I doubt the only thing listed is:

__ Win Conference Championship

It may very well be in there, but he most likely would be measured on:

__ Maintaining winning percentage

__ Helping drive donations for athletic facilities

__ Continuing above-average graduation rates

__ Maintaining above-average team GPA

__ Creating a strong, credible image locally and nationally

__ Dealing with team discipline issues quickly and according to the process

__ Creating a strong relationship with alumni

__ Building the recruiting pipeline

__ Consistently competing for a conference championship

The point of this original discussion -- for me anyway -- was to point out that other than NIU and CMU, I wouldn't trade the 11-year performance of Ohio with any other MAC school -- even if one of those schools did win a MACC.


+1


"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: General Chaos
   Posted: 9/12/2016 8:24:37 PM 
The CEO analogy is a pretty good one. And a CEO is is pretty much judged on ONLY the quarterly EPS.

Harsh? Maybe. But it's 1) the reality and 2) why CEOs get paid a LOT of money.

The CEO analogy is very apt re a head football coach in D1.

All the measures that can be done by anyone without winning and/or that are minimal (must be done or else firing justified, but no partic credit given for accomplishing) are really not important. Because almost anyone can do them. Winning--not so easy.

I get it. We're not Alabama or USC. So, our coach isn't going to be burned at the stake for a run of 2 or 3 bad games.

But 11 years of no MAC coupled with the continuing...going on four years...of seasons with a LOT of really bad losses??? I dare say that there are quite few D1 programs where the coach could survive them. And I bet we'd look down our noses at almost all of those programs, even as minor of a program as we are.


Love Solich and staff all you want. Get into it.

But you'll never convince me that he's other than mediocre.

Hey, try this. Discuss the facts of Solich's W-L record with someone from OSU or BG or Tennessee or Penn State or Virginia Tech or Arizona, etc. Ask if he'd be kept on at their school. Or, forgetting age, whether they'd want him hired at their school.



How long am I going to have to keep orienting so many of you to the real world, keep getting you past your personal biases.


Hey, how about Bcat2 responding with some SolichIsGod stuff! After posting the most cringe-worthy post ever on this website a day or so ago, nothing will stop his shilling.





Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Pets On The Go Collection of pet gear travel bags
The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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