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Topic: RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Topic: RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

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Bcat2
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 6/24/2016 9:52:28 AM

L.C.'s work with a few mods.

*** All MAC Level (Not saying the stats will be there for the recognition.)

QB: Sprague, Windham, Maxwell, Krizancic/Duckworth.
RB: Ouellette, Irons/Brown; White will be on the field as well
TE: Mangen, Morgan, C. Brown
WR1: S. Smith ***, Ball,Marhefka
WR2: Reid ***, White ***, A. Meyer, J.Brown
WR3: Cope, Belack/Odom
LT: Lowery ***, Pleasants
LG: Cooper, Anderson
C: Pruehs, Notestine, Langencamp
RG: Wood ***, Gibbons,
RT: Watson, McCray, Murdock

SDE: Basham ***, Berger
WDE: Laseak ***, Smart/Robbins
NG: Aloese ***/Strobel ***,Kuhar
DT: Sayles ***, Porter, McKnight/Arp
MLB: Poling ***, Grillot, Taylor/Stein
WLB: Brown ***, Croutch
SLB: Moore, M. Brunson
CB: L.Miller, Fox
CB: Houchins, Howell
S: Davis, Hagan, Quallen
S: Nelson ***, M.Williams, Hardy
P: Farakas
LS: Hale

Last Edited: 6/24/2016 6:44:19 PM by Bcat2

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

Doc Bobcat
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 6/24/2016 10:10:22 AM

Bcat2 wrote:

L.C.'s work with a few mods.

QB: Sprague, Windham, Maxwell, Krizancic/Duckworth.
RB: Ouellette, Irons/Brown; White will be on the field as well
TE: Mangen, Morgan, C. Brown
WR1: S. Smith, Ball,Marhefka
WR2: Reid, White, A. Meyer, J.Brown
WR3: Cope, Belack/Odom
LT: Lowery, Pleasants
LG: Cooper, Anderson
C: Pruehs, Notestine, Langencamp
RG: Wood, Gibbons,
RT: Watson, McCray, Murdock

SDE: Basham, Berger
WDE: Laseak, Smart/Robbins
NG: Aloese/Strobel,Kuhar
DT: Sayles, Porter, McKnight/Arp
MLB: Poling, Grillot, Taylor/Stein
WLB: Brown, Croutch
SLB: Moore, M. Brunson
CB: L.Miller, Fox
CB: Houchins, Howell
S: Davis, Hagan, Quallen
S: Nelson, M.Williams, Hardy
PK: Zervos
P: Farakas
LS: Hale

Pretty much spot on....look for Williams some at CB and Toledo transfer Tyler Gullett could get some pt at safety.

Bobcat1998
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 6/24/2016 10:23:22 AM

Look at our defensive line! I think Kent Berger is a sleeper and is someone that would start for most teams in the MAC. Look for Strobel to be tough. He played and stayed at Michigan for four years and look what Heitzman did for us in one short year. I also am a bit scared of our specialists. Hale is solid but two new booters? I hope they're the real deals.

The Optimist
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 6/24/2016 8:01:38 PM

Bobcat1998 wrote:

Our front 7 on defense is all the green kool-aid I need to stay happy this summer.

I've seen crazier things happen.

Bcat2
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/7/2016 9:51:15 PM

Depth Chart peppered with 4th & 5th year players. Seems there could be 16 starters who are 4th or 5th year players. Go two deep and there could be 25 4th or 5th year players. Should be a good thing.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 9:15:29 AM

OK, taking my prior effort, and editing it to match the official one:
http://tinyurl.com/zvhlr9o

QB: SPRAGUE, Windham OR Maxwell (then Duckworth?) [Sprague on track, Maxwell OR]
RB: Ouellette/White, Irons/Brown
TE: Mangen OR Morgan, C. Brown or R.Luerhman [added OR and Luerhman]
WR1: S. Smith, Ball, (then Marhefka?)
WR2: Reid, Belack (then J.Brown?)
WR3: Cope, A. Meyer [swapped A.Meyer with Belack]
LT: Lowery, Pleasants (then Dudziak?)
LG: Cooper, Gibbons [swapped Gibbons with Anderson]
C: Pruehs, Notestine [well, now we know the backup center]
RG: Wood, Anderson (then Langencamp?)
RT: Watson, McCray, (then Murdock?)

SDE: Basham, Robbins [Move Berger to DT]
WDE: Laseak, Smart
NG: Strobel or Porter, Aloese, (then Kuhar?) [I was way off here]
DT: Strobel or Sayles, Berger, (then McKnight/Arp?) [Move Berger in]
MLB: Poling, Grillot, (then Taylor/Stein?)
WLB: Brown, M. Brunson [swap Brunson and Croutch]
SLB: Moore, Croutch
CB: Fox OR M.Williams, Howell [Move M. Williams to Corner]
CB: L. Miller, R. Stites [Stites was a WR, delete Houchins]
S: Davis, Hagan or Cunningham [Move Cunningham up, delete Quallen]
S: Nelson, Hardy [Move M. Williams to corner]
PK: Zervos, O'Neill
P: Farakas, O'Neill
LS: Hale, Miller

Really this was pretty close to my guess. In a few places backup players were swapped, such as Gibbons and Anderson or Croutch and Brunson. In other places new names moved up, such as Luehrman and Cunningham, and Stites made the move from WR to CB. The positions where I was off the most were NT and CB.

At NT I projected Aloese to start, with Strobel behind him, but it starts the season with Strobel and Porter, backed up by Aloese. At Corner notably absent is Houchins, the transfer from Louisville, and M. Williams moves over to corner.

Notably absent from the depth chart are Houchins, and Quallen. I wonder if either or both continue to have injury issues?

The Good: Sprague returns. TE looking more solid than in recent years. RB stacked. DL stacked.

The Bad: Cornerback looks scary. One starter is a JUCO backed up by a walkon who played wide receiver last year. The other starter is either a third year player who hasn't played a down, so far as I know, or a safety converted to corner, who also hasn't played. I hope they are all solid, but never having seen any of them play for Ohio is more than a little scary.

Last Edited: 7/25/2016 12:42:49 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

C Money
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 10:01:57 AM

L.C. wrote:

C: Pruehs, Notestine [well, now we know the backup center]

This is the scariest one IMO. We seem to suffer a lot of lower limb injuries on the interior line, we run our offense exclusively out of the pistol, and we have a true freshman as our back-up center. Mr. Notestine may ultimately wind up the greatest lineman in Ohio history, but it's making me nervous right now.

Bcat2
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 10:59:48 AM

L.C. wrote:

QB: SPRAGUE, Windham OR Maxwell

So RS FR Maxwell, the unknown from small town Missouri, has passed *** recruit Joey Duckworth and has caught *** Florida recruit RS SR Greg Windham.

- Congratulations to Maxwell
- Good on who ever recruits rural Missouri
- Stars mean nothing

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 11:53:56 AM

C Money wrote:

L.C. wrote:

C: Pruehs, Notestine [well, now we know the backup center]

It could happen. In 2005 Knabb got hurt, and was replaced by a true Freshman, Tommy Stuck. On the other hand, there have been a lot more years where the Centers remained injury free. Skyler Allen and Lucas Powell both played almost every down every year.

I'm not particularly worried about this position because there are more offensive linemen, and more healthy offensive linemen, on the roster now than there have been for years. Johnson is building the kind of depth you want to see. Thus, if Notestine has found a spot on the depth chart, I take it as a credit to him, rather than as a sign of weakness of the rest of the roster.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 12:31:26 PM

One other important note - this depth chart does not include most of the true Freshmen, only those that arrived for Spring camp. Thus we might see cornerback fortified by the Motley crew in fall camp. It is not unusual at all for a true freshman to play at corner. In fact, about half of the incoming CB recruits have played immediately. In the Solich era, eight cornerbacks have played as true Freshmen:
2005 Mark Parson
2009 Travis Carrie
2011 Lorenzo Fisher, Ian Wells
2012 Blake Scipio
2014 Kylan Nelson, Curtis Brunson
2015 Langston Provitt

Meanwhile ten cornerbacks have redshirted as Freshmen:
2005 Idris Lawrence
2006 Julian Posey, Shannon Ballard
2007 Kenny Jackson
2008 Tyler Futrell
2009 Jamil Shaw
2011 Devin Bass
2013 Jarid Brown
2014 Jalen Fox
2015 Maxwell Howell
Of these 10, two of them later moved to WR, Futrell and J. Brown, leaving 8 that played after redshirting.

Thus, I will not be surprised at all to see either Iilyas and Xavior, or both, on the depth chart, and on the field before the season is half over.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

C Money
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/25/2016 4:17:11 PM

L.C. wrote:

C Money wrote:

L.C. wrote:

C: Pruehs, Notestine [well, now we know the backup center]

I went back and watched Notestine's commitment video. It looks like his HS ran a pistol offense, which makes me feel better, but I didn't see him line up at center often/ever. He was an early enrollee, though, so maybe they've been working on it.

Uggghhh....is it camp yet??????

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/26/2016 3:17:48 AM

Tight end may be okay. Maybe some of those guys can block, as Solich seems to want from that position, and catch a little.

But our lack of speed and impact TE receiving since the very fine Jordan Thompson is marked.

Seen no receiver speed from the TE's at all for several years.

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Ted Thompson
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/26/2016 2:28:30 PM

Monroe Slavin wrote:

The numbers don't back that up. Troy Hill and Keith Heitzman have put up numbers similar to or better than Jordan Thompson. (Aside: 2007 Andrew Mooney was the man).

Year	Name	Games	Receptions	Yards	Average	TDs
2015	Heitzman	13	22	297	13.5	3
2014	Mangen	12	19	147	7.7	0
2013	Hill	13	20	257	12.9	2
2012	Hill	13	14	169	12.1	3
2011	Thompson	14	24	258	10.8	2
2010	Thompson	13	21	204	9.7	3
2009	Thompson	14	7	109	15.6	0
2008	Mooney	9	27	287	10.6	3
2007	Mooney	12	34	498	14.6	9
2006	Sylvan	13	23	208	9.0	2
2005	Cody	11	15	144	9.6	0

Follow Ohio Football recruiting on the BobcatAttack.com football recruiting database.

UpSan Bobcat
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/26/2016 2:32:59 PM

Ted Thompson wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

The numbers don't back that up. Troy Hill and Keith Heitzman have put up numbers similar to or better than Jordan Thompson. (Aside: 2007 Andrew Mooney was the man). Year Name Games Receptions Yards Average TDs 2015 Heitzman 13 22 297 13.5 3 2014 Mangen 12 19 147 7.7 0 2013 Hill 13 20 257 12.9 2 2012 Hill 13 14 169 12.1 3 2011 Thompson 14 24 258 10.8 2 2010 Thompson 13 21 204 9.7 3 2009 Thompson 14 7 109 15.6 0 2008 Mooney 9 27 287 10.6 3 2007 Mooney 12 34 498 14.6 9 2006 Sylvan 13 23 208 9.0 2 2005 Cody 11 15 144 9.6 0

What stood out to be about Thompson was not what a big pass catching threat he was but rather what a great blocker he was. I will say that Thompson did seem to have a knack for making key catches for first downs and things like that.

Ted Thompson
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/26/2016 2:39:26 PM

UpSan Bobcat wrote:

Ted Thompson wrote:

Monroe Slavin wrote:

No doubt Jordan Thompson was an excellent player in many regards. But to say that speed left the position after he left is not true. I think Troy Hill had the best speed of any TE under Solich.

Follow Ohio Football recruiting on the BobcatAttack.com football recruiting database.

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/26/2016 8:37:44 PM

As far as Tight Ends, there are two factors that I think are important, that have affected output from the position, and speed isn't one of them. One factor was the injuries that hit the position hard in 2012-2013, and which resulting in playing a true Freshman at times in 2014. The other factor has been the lack of a solid running game. The running game affects the TE output because when the other team fears the running game, they are vulnerable to play action pass plays, particularly to the TE.

When it comes to tight ends, I want a guy that is a devastating blocker first and foremost. Next I want a guy that can make the clutch catch, even when he's being hit. Thompson was all that. So was Heitzman. Mangen and Morgan are now upperclassmen this fall, both being redshirt Juniors. I believe both are going to have outstanding seasons.

Really the only TE on that list that was an outstanding pure receiver was Mooney. The others were great at the clutch short catches, though, and often got free for easy touchdowns on play-action pass plays.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Monroe Slavin
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 3:12:31 AM

I'll admit I'm surprised that Thompson's numbers don't stand out more.

I do buy that he made catches in big moments.

And I still say that our TE's have exhibited a total lack of receiving speed over the last couple years or so. Haven't runaway from anyone. Well, apart from Heitzman very early last year.

Last Edited: 7/27/2016 3:14:23 AM by Monroe Slavin

71 BOBCAT
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 9:19:42 AM

It appears that this O line could be the biggest ever under Frank, average weight is 309lbs. I can't remember any line averaging this large before.
Does anyone know differently?

GO BOBCATS

cc-cat
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 11:13:34 AM

I think we need to be careful of falling into an elementary discussion of "speed" and translating it into meaning (or requiring) the ability to burn someone down field. The TE position is not one of speed to get open, but the ability to separate. The two premier TE in the NFL (Gronk and Olson) run 4.7 and 4.6 respectively (As a college point of reference, my neighbor starts at Georgia at TE and Jeb runs a 4.6). They are not going to "run away" down field, but they can create separation by getting matched up on a linebacker and use their speed to get separation, or they can out-muscle a safety - neither of which are going to translate into "downfield" weapons. The key is getting the matchups, which, as LC initiates up above, is often a result (in our scheme) of having a strong running game (or in the case of of a more wide open offense, having the reliable speed players to spread the field and cause gaps for the TE).

Last year Heitzman averaged of 13 yards per catch and had a long of 38 - that is solid. Cope and Papi led (as they should) at 17 and 15 yards per catch. I'm less interested in having the TE go from 13.5 to 15.5 per catch than having more plays down field to the wideouts. The key in that scenario, as well, is a strong running game that requires a defense to pull players into the box.

Last Edited: 7/27/2016 11:15:43 AM by cc-cat

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 11:23:19 AM

cc-cat wrote:

+1
Very well said, and thanks for pointing out several other things of importance, including the use of speed from the wide receivers to open space for the TE. It isn't just the running game that does that.

I'll add one more point that I suspect Monroe will agree with, since he's made the point before himself. Another thing that causes the TE to slip out alone and become wide open is the ability of the QB and the running backs to sell the run fake. A little deception helps to confuse the Safeties, and cause them to pay more attention the the run, and less attention to the tight end.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

LuckySparrow
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 12:56:04 PM

Love the way that depth chart has come together. I agree CB and C are two scary areas, but they're both surrounded by strengths, so that's good.

Reading that Strobel will play a lot makes me even more exited about our DL. This defense could be amazing.

What a day at the Convo.....Wow!

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/27/2016 8:44:10 PM

GoCats105 wrote:

...does the QB, secondary, or OL concern you at all? It seems crazy, but I still don't know if I've seen enough of either Windham or Sprague full-time to see what they can do at a high level. And in a pass-happy MAC, a shaky secondary is always a scary proposition.

As I said above, yes, the Secondary does. Safety looks solid enough, but CB looks a little scary to me. It might be fine, or not, but we just don't know as we haven't seen any of these players play a down yet.

As for OL, no, I'm not concerned. The OL made huge strides during last year. I am impressed with the job Johnson did last year. He is building much more depth than Ohio has ever had, and I think that this year will be the year the OL starts to mature, with even better years ahead. I think that by the end of the year this will be Ohio's best offensive line since 2011-2.

QB doesn't concern me at all, though it may be a bit of an adventure at first, as we determine Sprague's status. Sprague looked good at times. He doesn't have the strongest arm, and he looked particularly bad against App State, a game he probably shouldn't eve have been playing in. He had surgery after the season to repair the injury that he suffered early in the season. If his shoulder recovers, Ohio will be in good hands. He nearly set the Ohio record for pass efficiency in a season last year. Windhim also has looked good. As he builds playing time, and confidence, he can have a very good season. I still think Maxwell is the real deal, and will be the starter the next three seasons. He's raw, but as he plays, he will improve. Thus, I think Ohio can win with any of these three.

Last Edited: 7/27/2016 8:45:25 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

LuckySparrow
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/28/2016 10:09:37 AM

I feel unsettled about QB. Sprague isn't reliable due to injuries and inconsistencies. I think we can mark him down to take 60% of the snaps this year. Hopefully he has a good camp and comes into the season clicking. If our defense and running game deliver we won't need a superstar, just a solid above average QB. I am worried about the shoulder injury with him though.

It's great to hear from LC that Maxwell could be the real deal and I hope we get some peeks this season.

Last Edited: 7/28/2016 10:11:00 AM by LuckySparrow

What a day at the Convo.....Wow!

L.C.
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/28/2016 1:33:06 PM

LuckySparrow wrote:

It's great to hear from LC that Maxwell could be the real deal and I hope we get some peeks this season.

I have been arguing that since the day I watched his recruiting video. That and two bits (er, 16 bits) will get you a cup of coffee. It still needs to be proven on the field.

Last Edited: 7/28/2016 2:49:24 PM by L.C.

�We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.� ― Epictetus

Valley Cat
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RE: Way, Way, Way Early Depth Chart

Posted: 7/28/2016 8:10:13 PM

I will be curious to see if they use Maxwell in different packages instead of Windham just to get him some on field experience.

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