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Topic:  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois

Topic:  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 10:08:20 AM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
MonroeClassmate wrote:
Was the victory over BSU a break-out game for Sprague or an aberration, that is the question! Steady improvement game over game or a jagged upward trending line?

Now facing a top opponent, some areas that were exploited last week will be taken away Tuesday; can he adapt and take what the defense offers?

Does Sprague have this type of comfort with the OHIO offense, this type of vision? Taken from USA Today article on 11/17 in a piece about BG's Matt Johnson, titled, "Johnson Isn't Just Flinging It", here is an exert. "Johnson audibles and adjusts. He changed the Falcons blocking package three times on a single play against OHIO on Nov. 4, responding in kind to the Bobcats' defensive shifts--and then threw a touchdown pass." I have the paper but no link, the article gives insight into how in sync the coach, the QB and the receivers happen to be to run what Babers calls, "Speed Chess", his offense.

GO OHIO!



Uh, you can call me repetitive, but this is just more evidence that we are facing a deficit at the coaching level. We're not even in BG's league. It shows in their approach above and it showed in the scores against them the last years. They're playing modern football and we're playing predictable, arch-conservative, 1970's ball.

Thinking it will change next year with the same staff in place is quite wishful.

Think my repetitiveness is a problem? A better view may be how we keep repeating the same lousy ball.



Well, some see that things are changing. 2014 after 11 games Ohio had scored 222 total points, 2015 after 11 games Ohio has 303. Do a roll call of the positions and ask yourself which you expect will be better, the same or worse. When I do it the only drop off I expect will be at corner & safety and these for only a few games until very good athletes gain experience.

Monroe, that the BG QB needed to change his protection three times does mean that Ohio is playing in BG's league. Just that BG's QB is in a league of his own, but, we all knew that.

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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bshot44
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 11:28:01 AM 
Bcat2 wrote:

Monroe, that the BG QB needed to change his protection three times does mean that Ohio is playing in BG's league.


62.

24.

That's not in the same league, area code, zip code, hemisphere.....

62-24
31-13
49-0
26-14
28-29 (Ohio wins on last second FG vs. 4-6 BG team)

Those are the last five games vs. BG

1-4

avg score 39-16

In what world is this "in the same league"

BG has absolutely owned us recently. And considering they are really the only competition Ohio has in the East.....we have an uphill climb to catch them.
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bshot44
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 11:34:43 AM 
Bcat2 wrote:

Well, some see that things are changing. 2014 after 11 games Ohio had scored 222 total points, 2015 after 11 games Ohio has 303.


2014 offense was dreadful.....agreed.

2015 offense is improved....but mostly against inferior competition

24 pts vs. BG (in 62-24 loss)
14 pts vs. WMU
14 pts vs. Akron

48 pts vs. Ball
27 pts vs. Kent
34 pts vs. Miami
45 pts vs. Idaho

We still struggle to score vs. good teams. It's empty to pile up points vs. teams that are 3-8, 3-8, 3-8 and 3-9.

I know blowing out inferior teams is good...and expected. But being able to compete with good competition requires the offense to succeed in those positions too. Haven't really seen that.

Let's see what this offense can do vs. NIU tonight. Can they score 3 TDs?

I'm not holding my breath.

Last Edited: 11/24/2015 11:35:19 AM by bshot44
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 12:08:47 PM 
Weather tonight should be typical Great Plains weather for November, cold and windy, with winds in the 10-18mph range. That will make running the ball, and stopping the run doubly important. Since both NIU and Ohio are set up that way, I think the weather is a push, no really helping one side or the other. I don't expect either team to pass a lot, and I'm looking for a score in the range of 27-24 or so, hopefully with Ohio on top. Note, passing is certainly possible on windy days, just a little less reliable.

Last Edited: 11/24/2015 12:56:09 PM by L.C.

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 12:32:36 PM 
Bcat2 wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
MonroeClassmate wrote:
Was the victory over BSU a break-out game for Sprague or an aberration, that is the question! Steady improvement game over game or a jagged upward trending line?

Now facing a top opponent, some areas that were exploited last week will be taken away Tuesday; can he adapt and take what the defense offers?

Does Sprague have this type of comfort with the OHIO offense, this type of vision? Taken from USA Today article on 11/17 in a piece about BG's Matt Johnson, titled, "Johnson Isn't Just Flinging It", here is an exert. "Johnson audibles and adjusts. He changed the Falcons blocking package three times on a single play against OHIO on Nov. 4, responding in kind to the Bobcats' defensive shifts--and then threw a touchdown pass." I have the paper but no link, the article gives insight into how in sync the coach, the QB and the receivers happen to be to run what Babers calls, "Speed Chess", his offense.

GO OHIO!



Uh, you can call me repetitive, but this is just more evidence that we are facing a deficit at the coaching level. We're not even in BG's league. It shows in their approach above and it showed in the scores against them the last years. They're playing modern football and we're playing predictable, arch-conservative, 1970's ball.

Thinking it will change next year with the same staff in place is quite wishful.

Think my repetitiveness is a problem? A better view may be how we keep repeating the same lousy ball.



Well, some see that things are changing. 2014 after 11 games Ohio had scored 222 total points, 2015 after 11 games Ohio has 303. Do a roll call of the positions and ask yourself which you expect will be better, the same or worse. When I do it the only drop off I expect will be at corner & safety and these for only a few games until very good athletes gain experience.

Monroe, that the BG QB needed to change his protection three times does mean that Ohio is playing in BG's league. Just that BG's QB is in a league of his own, but, we all knew that.



Bcat2, optimism is nice. It's good.

Failure to comprehend reality isn't.



Where's the band?!
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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 12:59:44 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
Bcat2 wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:
MonroeClassmate wrote:
Was the victory over BSU a break-out game for Sprague or an aberration, that is the question! Steady improvement game over game or a jagged upward trending line?

Now facing a top opponent, some areas that were exploited last week will be taken away Tuesday; can he adapt and take what the defense offers?

Does Sprague have this type of comfort with the OHIO offense, this type of vision? Taken from USA Today article on 11/17 in a piece about BG's Matt Johnson, titled, "Johnson Isn't Just Flinging It", here is an exert. "Johnson audibles and adjusts. He changed the Falcons blocking package three times on a single play against OHIO on Nov. 4, responding in kind to the Bobcats' defensive shifts--and then threw a touchdown pass." I have the paper but no link, the article gives insight into how in sync the coach, the QB and the receivers happen to be to run what Babers calls, "Speed Chess", his offense.

GO OHIO!



Uh, you can call me repetitive, but this is just more evidence that we are facing a deficit at the coaching level. We're not even in BG's league. It shows in their approach above and it showed in the scores against them the last years. They're playing modern football and we're playing predictable, arch-conservative, 1970's ball.

Thinking it will change next year with the same staff in place is quite wishful.

Think my repetitiveness is a problem? A better view may be how we keep repeating the same lousy ball.



Well, some see that things are changing. 2014 after 11 games Ohio had scored 222 total points, 2015 after 11 games Ohio has 303. Do a roll call of the positions and ask yourself which you expect will be better, the same or worse. When I do it the only drop off I expect will be at corner & safety and these for only a few games until very good athletes gain experience.

Monroe, that the BG QB needed to change his protection three times does mean that Ohio is playing in BG's league. Just that BG's QB is in a league of his own, but, we all knew that.



Bcat2, optimism is nice. It's good.

Failure to comprehend reality isn't.





Reality is Ohio is better this year than last. Reality is we can expect to be better next year than this. Reality is Monroe is not happy, what else is new?

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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bshot44
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 1:07:04 PM 
Bcat2 wrote:
Reality is we can expect to be better next year than this.


Um. I think this is reality for every single team in every single sport in every single level of sport.

Reality is...when a team isn't as good as expected......don't accept it and make excuses for it. Question it, don't accept it and expect something be done to change it.
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 1:41:26 PM 
Comparing the stats, the teams are remarkably similar in a lot of respects:

Points Scored: NIU #2, 35.8; Ohio #5 27.5
Points Given Up: NIU #4 24.7; Ohio #5 25.2
Total Offense: NIU #4 450.8; Ohio #5 428.6
Total Defense: Ohio #5 377.7; NIU #6 391.3
Rushing Offense: NIU #1 226.0; Ohio #4 183.6
Rushing Defense: NIU #5 152.1; Ohio #6 164.6
Passing Offense: Ohio #7 245.0; NIU #8 224.8
Passing Defense: Ohio #4 213.1; NIU #8 239.2
Pass Efficiency: NIU #4 145.2; Ohio #5 135.8
Pass Efficiency Defense: NIU #1 115.4; Ohio #3 119.7

I could go on down the list of stats, such as 1st downs, 3rd down conversions, etc, and they are always close. The only place they really deviate is in terms of Red Zone scoring and Red Zone Defense:
Red Zone Pct: NIU #1 92.9; Ohio #11 73.8%
Red Zone Defense Pct: NIU #5 82.4; Ohio #11 88.2%

They are hurt in Red Zone defense by 0 stops on downs. On the other hand, the Red Zone Defense Pct is a misleading stat because only one team, Toledo, has allowed teams in the Red Zone less times than Ohio. Also, your percentage changes depending on the accuracy of opposing kickers, something you have no control over (unless you actually block the kick). If you just look at the percentage of the time they give up a TD when the other team gets into the Red Zone, Ohio is #4 at 56% of the time, while NIU is #2 at 41%. To me that's a better stat.

Alternately you could look at how many times the defense allows the other team to get into the Red Zone and score a TD. NIU is #2 in that at 14, while Ohio is #3 with 19. My point here is that even though Ohio is near the bottom in "Red Zone Defense Pct", the stat is misleading, and while it looks like a problem areas, it's really not the problem. Ohio's problem has not been allowing other teams to drive the field, get into the Red Zone, and then score. Ohio's problem has been allowing long TDs. They can't allow NIU to score long TDs if they are going to win this game.

As for the offensive side of Red Zone Pct, it is less misleading. Ohio is hurt in Red Zone scoring by 4 red zone interceptions, compared with only 7 Red Zone passing TDs, a horrible ratio. Ohio has been very effective running the ball into the endzone from short range, but not effective at all passing it in.

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Bcat2
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 2:35:13 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
MonroeClassmate wrote:
Was the victory over BSU a break-out game for Sprague or an aberration, that is the question! Steady improvement game over game or a jagged upward trending line?

Now facing a top opponent, some areas that were exploited last week will be taken away Tuesday; can he adapt and take what the defense offers?

Does Sprague have this type of comfort with the OHIO offense, this type of vision? Taken from USA Today article on 11/17 in a piece about BG's Matt Johnson, titled, "Johnson Isn't Just Flinging It", here is an exert. "Johnson audibles and adjusts. He changed the Falcons blocking package three times on a single play against OHIO on Nov. 4, responding in kind to the Bobcats' defensive shifts--and then threw a touchdown pass." I have the paper but no link, the article gives insight into how in sync the coach, the QB and the receivers happen to be to run what Babers calls, "Speed Chess", his offense.

GO OHIO!



Uh, you can call me repetitive, but this is just more evidence that we are facing a deficit at the coaching level. We're not even in BG's league. It shows in their approach above and it showed in the scores against them the last years. They're playing modern football and we're playing predictable, arch-conservative, 1970's ball.

Thinking it will change next year with the same staff in place is quite wishful.

Think my repetitiveness is a problem? A better view may be how we keep repeating the same lousy ball.



I get it Monroe. You don't respect the Ohio coaches/players. Hence your repeated assessment that they play "lousy" football. However, since the Buffalo game of last season there are 10 games in evidence that Ohio plays respectable football. Three games are losses everyone would like to have back and if you choose to brand the whole program as "lousy" based upon them, we will have to disagree. At this point, being in disagreement with you is a place I feel right at home.

Last Edited: 11/24/2015 2:57:06 PM by Bcat2

"Do not pray for easy lives. Pray to be stronger men." JFK

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 4:17:25 PM 



Bcat2, that's garbage. I've very little addressed the players. Never said that I don't respect them.

I think the coaching is less than MAC average--something that you wouldn't admit if civilization's future depended on it.

Beside the example of BG's qb being coached to run a fast, dynamic, adaptable (play calls at line of scrimmage, etc) offense, read the following for how Coach Webb adapted after three bad losses...with the result being a MAC Conference Tournament Volleyball Championship:

http://www.bobcatattack.com/messageboard/topic.asp?FromPa...


Coaching matters. Good or superior coaching makes a difference.


Side note to DFC: See, I'm only repetitive (though most times with slightly different evidence or argument) on my initiative; it's almost always in response to dim, dismal assertion that there's nothing wrong here, that we're on just the right track. Hassle those guys, too.




Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 4:19:15 PM 


And, by the way Bcat2...and others, when there are 13 teams in a conference and you haven't won the conference title in 11 years, then the math pretty much suggests that you are (or are solidly on track to be) less than average.




Compare: BoldonBall, Coach Webb...what looks to be happening Saul2.....

Where's the band?!
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mid70sbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 5:01:06 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:

I think the coaching is less than MAC average--something that you wouldn't admit if civilization's future depended on it.



I guess Accountants don't ever use statistics or have knowledge of such. So you cherry pick the fact we've not won a MACC in 11 years and thus conclude we're "less than average". You refer elsewhere to us as "mediocre" and "lousy". Of our fellow MAC competition are you implying that more than half have receive more post season bowl invites than us during Frank's tenure? That would be a logical conclusion since you state we're "less than average". I've not checked the numbers but I'd bet you're wrong.

But hey, anyone can support their viewpoint but selecting as narrow a slice of data as they wish to choose. Or slant it in the direction they want. Ever heard of biased Statistics? In your case they're not biased, just wrong. We're NOT less than average. But I'm sure your whining will continue until we're ranked in the Top 15 nationwide. I know I post infrequently but at times your drivel pushes one over the top.
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Ted Thompson
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 6:52:10 PM 

Follow Ohio Football recruiting on the BobcatAttack.com football recruiting database.

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OhioCatFan
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 7:02:06 PM 
These look very much -- in terms of color scheme -- like the uniforms we wore to beat Illinois in one of Frank's early years. Maybe that combination has some magic in the State of Illinois. Go OHIO!

The only BLSS Certified Hypocrite on BA

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

Note: My avatar is the national colors of the 78th Ohio Veteran Volunteer Infantry, which are now preserved in a climate controlled vault at the Ohio History Connection. Learn more about the old 78th at: http://www.78ohio.org

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Monroe Slavin
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 7:31:46 PM 
mid70sbobcat wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:

I think the coaching is less than MAC average--something that you wouldn't admit if civilization's future depended on it.



I guess Accountants don't ever use statistics or have knowledge of such. So you cherry pick the fact we've not won a MACC in 11 years and thus conclude we're "less than average". You refer elsewhere to us as "mediocre" and "lousy". Of our fellow MAC competition are you implying that more than half have receive more post season bowl invites than us during Frank's tenure? That would be a logical conclusion since you state we're "less than average". I've not checked the numbers but I'd bet you're wrong.

But hey, anyone can support their viewpoint but selecting as narrow a slice of data as they wish to choose. Or slant it in the direction they want. Ever heard of biased Statistics? In your case they're not biased, just wrong. We're NOT less than average. But I'm sure your whining will continue until we're ranked in the Top 15 nationwide. I know I post infrequently but at times your drivel pushes one over the top.



I stated a standard--MAC Championship. That is a reasonable standard.

I stand by my analysis.


As far as making bowl games/bowl eligible, its difficult not to in this era. With a sched of 3-4 MAC patsies plus and FCS, it takes a remarkable average-or-less-than-average not to make a bowl.

At some point, this coaching staff needs to be held accountable.

When are you going to hold them accountable?



Where's the band?!
WHERE"S THE BAND?!


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The Pets On The Go Collection of pet gear travel bags
The Holiday Tote Bigg Bagg Collection--over-sized, reversible, extra pockets; now love carrying packages as much as you love shopping!

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colobobcat66
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 7:42:43 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
mid70sbobcat wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:

I think the coaching is less than MAC average--something that you wouldn't admit if civilization's future depended on it.



I guess Accountants don't ever use statistics or have knowledge of such. So you cherry pick the fact we've not won a MACC in 11 years and thus conclude we're "less than average". You refer elsewhere to us as "mediocre" and "lousy". Of our fellow MAC competition are you implying that more than half have receive more post season bowl invites than us during Frank's tenure? That would be a logical conclusion since you state we're "less than average". I've not checked the numbers but I'd bet you're wrong.

But hey, anyone can support their viewpoint but selecting as narrow a slice of data as they wish to choose. Or slant it in the direction they want. Ever heard of biased Statistics? In your case they're not biased, just wrong. We're NOT less than average. But I'm sure your whining will continue until we're ranked in the Top 15 nationwide. I know I post infrequently but at times your drivel pushes one over the top.



I stated a standard--MAC Championship. That is a reasonable standard.

I stand by my analysis.


As far as making bowl games/bowl eligible, its difficult not to in this era. With a sched of 3-4 MAC patsies plus and FCS, it takes a remarkable average-or-less-than-average not to make a bowl.

At some point, this coaching staff needs to be held accountable.

When are you going to hold them accountable?





Miami has won a MACC during the last 10 years, I'll take our record over Miami.
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OhioBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 8:00:41 PM 
NIU looks rattled. Ohio clearly the better team in the early going.
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fsohio09
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 8:05:13 PM 
For the record: definitely not a fumble. Knee clearly down before ball knocked out.
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mid70sbobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 8:11:31 PM 
Monroe Slavin wrote:
mid70sbobcat wrote:
Monroe Slavin wrote:

I think the coaching is less than MAC average--something that you wouldn't admit if civilization's future depended on it.



I guess Accountants don't ever use statistics or have knowledge of such. So you cherry pick the fact we've not won a MACC in 11 years and thus conclude we're "less than average". You refer elsewhere to us as "mediocre" and "lousy". Of our fellow MAC competition are you implying that more than half have receive more post season bowl invites than us during Frank's tenure? That would be a logical conclusion since you state we're "less than average". I've not checked the numbers but I'd bet you're wrong.

But hey, anyone can support their viewpoint but selecting as narrow a slice of data as they wish to choose. Or slant it in the direction they want. Ever heard of biased Statistics? In your case they're not biased, just wrong. We're NOT less than average. But I'm sure your whining will continue until we're ranked in the Top 15 nationwide. I know I post infrequently but at times your drivel pushes one over the top.



I stated a standard--MAC Championship. That is a reasonable standard.

I stand by my analysis.


As far as making bowl games/bowl eligible, its difficult not to in this era. With a sched of 3-4 MAC patsies plus and FCS, it takes a remarkable average-or-less-than-average not to make a bowl.

At some point, this coaching staff needs to be held accountable.

When are you going to hold them accountable?





So by your logic, or lack thereof, it's the coaching staff's fault for the fumble that just happened and the resulting 7 points for NIU. We have the best coaching staff we've had in 40+ years.

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OhioBobcat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:02:19 PM 
Total domination thus far. NIU is shell shocked!
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L.C.
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:02:56 PM 
After the fair catch with 11 seconds left, didn't Ohio have the option of attempting a free kick for a field goal?

“We have two ears and one mouth so that we can listen twice as much as we speak.” ― Epictetus

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Diamond Cat
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:04:07 PM 
Random thoughts....

Came to play No. 1


Fumble on Smith could have went either way

Why did Smith jog short of the 1st down marker?

Do we have no other kickoff returner that can head up the field quickly with some purpose?
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C Money
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:08:10 PM 
L.C. wrote:
After the fair catch with 11 seconds left, didn't Ohio have the option of attempting a free kick for a field goal?


YES! I was screaming "TAKE THE FREE KICK!" at my TV.
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bshot44
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:10:44 PM 
OhioBobcat wrote:
Total domination thus far. NIU is shell shocked!


I am shell-shell-shocked

Unreal first 30 minutes.

Still 30 to go....

But wow!
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allen
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  Message Not Read  RE: Official Game 12 Thread: Northern Illinois
   Posted: 11/24/2015 9:13:28 PM 
The truth is, the coaching needs to get a little better. We need a top 3-5 conference QB and we need to expect more as fans. We got walloped three times in conference. That is not acceptable by the coaches or players standards. We have fans that love Frank so he could go 2-10 and they would find sunshine somewhere. I love Frank as well, he is from Cleveland, he coached in a National Championship game and he is a good guy. He needs to make adjustments. Kevin McHale was a great guy by all accounts, but he got fired for under achieving. I don't suggest that Frank be fired, I suggest that he make changes or else not be extended. The 0-12 versus teams with winning records in the MAC says a lot. We are beating the cream puffs. I know people hate me and Monroe, but these are the facts, Hopefully we win tonight. Go Cats

Nobody despises to lose more than I do. That's got me into trouble over the years, but it also made a man of mediocre ability into a pretty good coach. Woody Hayes
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