BobcatAttack.com - For Fans of Ohio University Sports

Welcome Guest!
Create an Account

site search

where to watch

about us

advertise with us

help

BobcatAttack.com Message Board

General Ohio University Discussion/Alumni Events

Topic: RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Topic: RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Author

Message

C Money
General User

Member Since: 8/28/2010
Post Count: 3,420

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 5/30/2017 3:18:23 PM

TIL there is a North Green.

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 5/30/2017 10:09:21 PM

Always enjoy Mike Johnson's historically driven posts. In addition, I can attest to Mike's referencing former President McDavis' comments about slipshod construction. I certainly had two fun years on New South, but the dorms seemed to have all the aestheticism of a Walter Ulbricht inspired East German dorm circa 1971.

Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than I (Rpbobcat, Ohio Cat Fan etc) might be able to pinpoint if this is the era when higher education literally went south (economically with haphazard planning; dorms that were either too small or too large within a few years time span.)

Now we have the opposite with Taj Mahal type buildings. Correct me if I am wrong Rpbobcat, but sometime ago you mentioned that some college dorm projects you were involved with had more amenities than some hotel building ventures. I don't know the university president's or dean's salary 40-50 years ago, but I wonder if that too started to increase faster than previously thought possible.

I read this somewhere about how to tell who lives in what house in a university town. The president lives in a mansion on the hill, the deans live in mini mansions within sight of the president. The tenured faculty live in stately homes across town, while the adjuncts live in a van down by the river.

The tenured faculty who teach classes in unemployable majors certainly won't complain. Meanwhile some of their students will be joining those adjuncts in a van down by the river, because try as they might being a manager at McDonald's and or DSW Shoes still isn't cutting it by trying to get by and pay off student loans. Sorry to go off on a tangent, but all of this started somewhere and the boondoggles of the 60s and early 70s just might be the place to start.

Last Edited: 5/30/2017 10:11:02 PM by cbus cat fan

Ohio69
General User

Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 2,992

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 8:49:12 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

The tenured faculty who teach classes in unemployable majors certainly won't complain.

Well, this part is inaccurate....

:)

Can somebody hit a pull up jumper for me?.....

rpbobcat
General User

Member Since: 4/28/2006
Location: Rochelle Park, NJ
Post Count: 3,503

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 10:57:55 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

Now we have the opposite with Taj Mahal type buildings. Correct me if I am wrong Rpbobcat, but sometime ago you mentioned that some college dorm projects you were involved with had more amenities than some hotel building ventures.

100% correct.
No pools or breakfast buffets (yet).
But,fitness centers,microwaves,fridges and semi private baths.

OUPride
General User

Member Since: 9/21/2010
Post Count: 562

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 11:20:54 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

The tenured faculty who teach classes in unemployable majors certainly won't complain. Meanwhile some of their students will be joining those adjuncts in a van down by the river, because try as they might being a manager at McDonald's and or DSW Shoes still isn't cutting it by trying to get by and pay off student loans. Sorry to go off on a tangent, but all of this started somewhere and the boondoggles of the 60s and early 70s just might be the place to start.

So I guess that you'd prefer that Ohio stop being a university and become a trade school focused on "learnin' fer earnin'" And by the way, I know a lot of history and political science and physics majors who have done far better for themselves than the average business/engineering major.

Last Edited: 6/1/2017 3:09:00 PM by OUPride

.
General User

Member Since: 2/3/2005
Post Count: 2,949

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 12:11:19 PM

OUPride wrote:

cbus cat fan wrote:

So I guess that you'd prefer that Ohio stop being a university and become a trade school focused on "learnin' fer earnin'" And by the way, I know a lot of history and political science and physics majors who have done a far better for themselves than the average business/engineering major.

Not to mention being pretty dismissive of positions managing McDonald's/DSW Shoes/retail as a first step right out of college.

Last Edited: 6/1/2017 12:16:05 PM by .

rpbobcat
General User

Member Since: 4/28/2006
Location: Rochelle Park, NJ
Post Count: 3,503

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 4:08:47 PM

OUPride wrote:

And by the way, I know a lot of history and political science and physics majors who have done far better for themselves than the average business/engineering major.

But,did they do better using those degrees,or through some other means ?

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/1/2017 9:40:39 PM

Well said rpbobcat. I only wish those who attack my words would sit with me as I have interviewed college students including Bobcats who were emotional, and yes even tear filled after they remembered interviewing with me the previous year. They thought their major was a ticket to something special, but all they have now is debt and sometimes other mouths to feed.

Student debt is not a matter easily dismissed, some don't have the blessing of their parents paying their way. Now my major wasn't exactly something that catches the attention of lots of employers. However through a lot of hard work and picking the right spots, I am doing OK. As far as some of my tough jobs, I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy.

The reason I mentioned McDonalds was some years ago a young man got emotional talking about trying to feed a young family on $9.75 as an assistant manager at McDonalds, all the while trying to find a job in his major. The DSW example came from a young woman who cried at a job fair for which I was interviewing prospective students in Columbus. Some of you are living in a fantasy world if you think you can pay back six figure college debt while also paying the bills on a DSW wage. She was very emphatic about that.

The old days of just getting a degree and the jobs will follow are long gone. Our beloved alma mater is better than most, but it is worth noting that the majority of History and Education majors don't get jobs in their field, and many end up in the lower paying service industry.

Yes everyone should be accountable, but universities owe students and their parents the truth about what majors are employable and what is their rate of pay.

Last Edited: 6/1/2017 10:16:18 PM by cbus cat fan

Sean Gallagher
General User

Member Since: 12/6/2012
Post Count: 134

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/4/2017 8:05:50 AM

Just an update. Mratzolff is coming down. View is from where Cady Hall once stood looking SE. O'Blennes and Fenzel (I think) are next. Last year it was Brough, Foster and Cady. Over time they will all come down.

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc134/gallareed/Athens...

On another note, I noticed that the Cats Den (formerly The Little Ritz) at 110 W. Union is closed. There were plans to convert it into a micro brewery, but not sure tf that's still happening. Rumors are its closed permanently. No one knows for sure and if they do, they're not talking.

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc134/gallareed/Athens...

Last Edited: 6/4/2017 8:13:06 AM by Sean Gallagher

DelBobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,135

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 1:51:31 PM

cbus cat fan wrote:

The old days of just getting a degree and the jobs will follow are long gone. Our beloved alma mater is better than most, but it is worth noting that the majority of History and Education majors don't get jobs in their field, and many end up in the lower paying service industry.

Many, many jobs require a college degree but not a specific major. People don't get a degree in history just because they want to be a historian. There are many reasons why it is valuable to study history. Many plan to go to law school or pursue a PhD. My significant other has a degree in military history and she went to law school. Some see the value in understanding things from an historical context. No one majoring in history is under the impression that they will have the same prospects as a chemical engineering major right out of college.

Also, education majors are among the most likely of any college major to land a position in their chosen field. I have no idea where you got the idea that a majority don't end up in education.

Last Edited: 6/6/2017 1:52:13 PM by DelBobcat

BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 9,454

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 2:47:08 PM

DelBobcat wrote:

cbus cat fan wrote:

+1 on the History comment
+1000 on the Education comment. Quite an off base comment to make without any supporting documentation.

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 3:47:23 PM

Education is my line of work, in addition I have a degree in History. For the record, I have always been interested in teaching, childhood development, social studies, architecture, cultural studies, religion, sports and music.

For the record, if you are interested in getting a teaching job; Florida, Texas, California and Las Vegas are the places to be. However, if you are in the Midwest, especially Ohio with it's plethora of colleges and universities, you better have a plan b and c. For example some years ago Olentangy and Dublin school systems in the area north of Columbus were building schools. I knew principals in both school systems so I asked them how many applications they received for the 100 openings each district had that year. One principal told me they stopped counting after 10,000 and the HR folks narrowed it down to 1,000. I was told that these 1,000 could easily get jobs in those other parts of the country I mentioned above, but only 100 would be hired.

I have gone over this before here and I won't again, because I have been to far too many seminars with college and university officials talking about this very subject. I have spent many hours through the years talking to neighbors, people I meet at happy hours, ball games, and church picnics as to why Billy or Suzy with their nearly 4.0 average can't get a teaching job in the area and why did they have to move someplace else or get into another line of work. I could go on and on, but this link might be helpful. Below is an interesting quote from the article.

Mr. Flanagan, the Michigan state superintendent, noted that his daughter, a world-languages teacher, was able to find a job in the state. Not so her colleagues who majored in elementary education. �All of her friends are in either Arizona or Florida,� Mr. Flanagan said. �All of them.�
http://hechingerreport.org/colleges-producing-too-many-el... /

Finally because my family lineage is more in line with Mr. Quint than it is with Mr. Hooper, I thought I would add this funny seen from Jaws. It sort of sums up my feelings about those on this board who look at life the way they want it to be, rather than cold hard reality that we call life. I hope everyone can see the humor in it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am1jE2cOPLw

OUPride
General User

Member Since: 9/21/2010
Post Count: 562

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 7:25:42 PM

BillyTheCat wrote:

DelBobcat wrote:

cbus cat fan wrote:

+1 on the History comment
+1000 on the Education comment. Quite an off base comment to make without any supporting documentation.

Ditto!

OUPride
General User

Member Since: 9/21/2010
Post Count: 562

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 7:30:32 PM

While I disagree in large part with cbus, I will add that liberal arts and social science majors are more likely to have better post-graduation job options and broader swaths of companies recruiting their college the higher one goes up the academic food chain. And of course, this hits its pinnacle with extremely elite colleges. Goldman-Sachs or McKinsey Consulting or that Silicon Valley VC firm none of us has ever heard of will crawl over a thousand business majors from MAC schools to hire that philosophy grad from Princeton or Chicago.

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 8:47:06 PM

OUPride, interesting last post. I might respectfully add that you and anyone else who disagrees with my previous post read my latest one (a couple posts above this one.) Honestly, it has nothing to do with our philosophies on life, political views, etc. It simply comes down to facts about majors and who employs who.

I realized early on that I had a major that was not in demand and never going to make me rich. I accepted that and I was grateful to have a job. I really enjoyed teaching, coaching and working with kids. You know when I realized the truth about money and college degrees? I think it was my third year teaching. Another teacher friend and I went to Chicago to visit and old high school friend who just was hired at a Chicago law firm. He took us out on a night on the town. He bought dinner, but we offered to buy the drinks. He laughed and said, "I kinda know what you guys make, my weekly laundry bill is about what you make. Let me take care of this."

All through the night we met people who had degrees in Education, Political Science and History. They were the cabbies, ID takers, bouncers and bar maids. They thought we were lucky to actually be employed in our fields, though we felt like paupers seeing how the other half lived. That was some 25 years ago.

Now we have law school grads (as I mentioned in this and other threads) who are $250,000 in debt, passed the bar exam and aren't employed in their field. Student debt is ridiculous and college and universities need to be honest about where the jobs are and where they are not.

Last Edited: 6/6/2017 8:51:13 PM by cbus cat fan

BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 9,454

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 10:41:14 PM

cbus cat fan wrote:

You assume that all those people you meet can't find work, instead of maybe they just no longer want that work. If you have an education degree and can't find work, then maybe you need to look outside that dream District or more that 5 blocks from your childhood home.

And yes, college debit is a major issue, but from the sounds of your advice, people should just choose not to get the education and avoid the debt and risk.

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/6/2017 11:18:33 PM

Billy not what I said or meant at all. So let me get this straight, I assume you read the link where the "experts talked" about the glut of education jobs in most of the country, especially the Midwest. What's up with this just move five blocks from where you grew up line? Come on, are you just trying to pull people's chains or what?

DelBobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,135

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/7/2017 10:38:25 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

Now you're saying two different things. You started out saying the majority of education majors don't get jobs in education. That's patently false. Now you're saying that high-demand places like Olentangy and Dublin (two of the best districts in the Columbus area and probably the country) get many more applications than they can hire. Well, of course. Not everyone gets to work for their dream district. That doesn't mean that there aren't lots of places that need teachers. Might graduates need to be willing to move? Yes. Might it be good for universities to consider admitting less elementary education majors? Yes. Are there a glut of teachers in certain areas and in certain fields. Ok, I buy that. But those aren't the arguments you made.

The problem with your posts are that you view everything in black and white--there's no nuance. Then you basically call everyone that critiques your argument an idiot and dismiss them out of hand. That's no way to interact with other people whether you are in person or on an online forum.

BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/7/2017 2:12:54 PM

Well Del Bobcat that was a revealing post. As a matter of fact, it should be studied by first year Psychology students delving into the topic of "Projection." You said I presented no facts, stated I basically called people who disagreed with me idiots, all the while engaging in black and white thinking.

In fact, I linked to an article which covered much of what I presented in great detail, not just about Ohio but many states. As a matter of fact, the Michigan State Superintendent is quoted. I also posted a humorous video from Jaws. How any of this can be deemed name calling or black and white thinking is beyond me.

BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 9,454

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/7/2017 8:04:42 PM

DelBobcat wrote:

cbus cat fan wrote:

+1

His original comment was that education majors cannot get jobs in their fields. Totally false, jobs are there, just have to go find them.

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/7/2017 11:05:46 PM

You could say the same thing about Medieval Tapestry majors, but I don't think I would be waiting on pins and needles for an opening at the Sorbonne in Paris.

Billy and Del Bobcat, it is amazing how you know so much about a field in which you haven't been employed in for years. I refer you back to my previous posts, especially the one in which I posted the Jaws scene between Mr. Hooper and Mr. Quint, where Mr. Quint tells the elitist Mr. Hooper; "Don't tell me About My Business Again." In light of that thought, do me a favor, go over to some hunting and fishing boards and try telling them their business in your usual condescending fashion. I would eagerly await reading their responses. Unlike me, politely reminding you about Projection, they would probably have an entirely different way of communicating their displeasure. Now that I would find entertaining!

DelBobcat
General User

Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,135

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/8/2017 10:13:32 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

You're a real hoot. Are you doubling down on your assertion that a majority of education majors can't get jobs in education? Because my point was that your source you provided didn't say that. If you have one that says that I'd be glad to read it.

BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

cbus cat fan
General User

Member Since: 12/2/2011
Post Count: 1,169

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/8/2017 3:53:34 PM

DelBobcat you just might be the person that would stand in front of a sign that said; "Bridge Out" and you would probably come back with something along the lines of; "How do we that it is this bridge? I need more facts."

Last Edited: 6/8/2017 4:23:20 PM by cbus cat fan

BillyTheCat
General User

Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 9,454

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/9/2017 7:45:51 AM

cbus cat fan wrote:

"Haven't been employed in for years". Really???? I'd say you are 100% dead wrong on that one! And sorry you find the truth to be condescending. Your assumption that people can not find jobs in education is just silly. Sure, some may need to relocate, and may not get their dream job, but that is true with most all professions. But, hey, keep thinking education is a worthless major, and maybe DeVos will get her way and make education obsolete

Alan Swank
General User

Member Since: 12/11/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 7,022

Status: Offline

RE: "New" South (No longer new)

Posted: 6/11/2017 2:32:45 PM

BillyTheCat wrote:

cbus cat fan wrote:

"Politely reminding" might be the most condescending expression of arrogance there is. It's right up there with name dropping and citing shoulder rubbing. But to the topic, college isn't necessarily job specific vocational training. A liberal arts degree with a major and possibly a minor was always intended to prepare one for the changing world. I taught school on two different occasions in two vastly different districts. I haven't taught in a defined classroom in a single school in 34 years but I've taught in many classrooms in many schools these past 34 years. My history degree with a teaching certificate from Muskingum prepared me quite nicely for time working. I would wager that for many graduates the same can be said about OU since 1977.

Showing Replies:	26 - 50 of 50 Posts
Jump to Page:	< Previous 1 \| 2

View Other 'General Ohio University Discussion/Alumni Events' Topics

There are 206 Active Visitors on BobcatAttack.com

205 Guests
1 Registered User:
	JimLurker34

There are no other users looking at this page.