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General Ohio University Discussion/Alumni Events
Topic:  RE: Housing-gate continues

Topic:  RE: Housing-gate continues
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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/4/2018 1:05:26 PM 
cc-cat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:

lol I know it doesnít help but If you read Elon Musk and this ladies tweets and then you read the article she writes and canít tell it is an incredibly low standard of journalism. Then idk what else to say then yell fake news.


Simply call it what it is. Bad journalism. As I said yelling fake news is lazy and in most cases an insult to reporters (many of whom are Ohio grads) who do the work to get the story right but are attacked and insulted because their reporting is counter to someoneís view and interest. without question the overwhelming majority of times trump yells fake news it is simply an attempt to discredit a report. Yet lazy ignorant people blindly buy it and he therefore gets away with it. It has simply become a cover for trump to lie. Donít use the term. By doing so you give it credence and demean thousands of OUr graduates.



Whatís the difference between fake news and bad journalism? I made my critism of the news clear. If someone is changing my argument and aligns me with trump how is that my fault. That would be a classic example of fake news. Somebody twisting and reporting on my words instead of thinking about the words and considering what I am trying to say is exactly the sort of thing we need to get rid of. Iím sure many of trumps supporters use it as a way to give him a pass on any sort of criticism, but Iím sure many use it to voice their criticism of the news. Who would I be to label of those people under one category. Maybe we should talk to each person as an individual and hear out what theyíre trying to say. Let people speak freely and give them a chance to explain where they fall. Itís the same way I will treat journalist. If they have good content and arenít biased I wonít yell fake news, but if they have bad content and are biased Iím going to call them out on it. Iím not going to stop them from writing but I will criticize their writing once it is published. Based on comments here, journalist seem to be in favor of free speech. So I donít know what the problem is voicing criticism of the media. If someone yells fake news give them a chance to explain. Maybe they have legitimate complaints or maybe they donít, but you should hear them out. Iím going to criticize people who need to be criticized. I donít care if theyíre Ohio grads or not. Theyíre people. Iím sure some of them are great journalist and Iím sure some of them are bad journalist. Iím going to judge them based on where they fall on that scale, just like we do with every other profession.
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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/4/2018 1:10:55 PM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
Iím leaving today for a Mediterranean cruise to celebrate our 50th wedding anniversary, so I will not be having much BA time for about two weeks; however, I just wanted to make one comment, which I hope all will find interesting. Back in the 1970s, when I was teaching journalism at Marshall University, I taught a class entitlted ďMass Media and Society.Ē One of the scholars we studied in that class was Marshall McLuhan. Based on his media theoreis, which were themselves based on a specific strain of Canadian economic theory, he postulated that electronic media were transforming us from a society that processed information in a linear and sequential manner to one that processed information in a multidemensional and holistic manner. From this he further postulated that we would begin to relate to each other in a tribalistic global village manner. This lead to the concusion that we were headed for a return to the 19th Century norm of media that made no attempt to be objective but simply interacted with their part of the global village in manner not too dissimilar to a story teller sitting around the tribal council circle. I believe we have now essentially arrived at that point.

It might be instructive for some here to read up on the history of the Associated Press, and why the concept of ďobjective journalismĒ was developed in the first place. This is part of journalism history thatís often overlooked and is very interesting. The rationale for ďobjective reportingĒ youíll discover was not what you probably think it was.


Found some different things on the rationale for objective reporting. Iím not sure I understand it completely. Would be nice if you elaborated on it.
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TheBobcatBandit
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/4/2018 1:11:57 PM 
The Optimist wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Canadian economic theory


Fake news



What is your criticism of Canadian economic theory. Would be helpful if you elaborated.
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OhioCatFan
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Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 9,460

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 3:52:43 AM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Iím leaving today for a Mediterranean cruise to celebrate our 50th wedding anniversary, so I will not be having much BA time for about two weeks; however, I just wanted to make one comment, which I hope all will find interesting. Back in the 1970s, when I was teaching journalism at Marshall University, I taught a class entitlted ďMass Media and Society.Ē One of the scholars we studied in that class was Marshall McLuhan. Based on his media theoreis, which were themselves based on a specific strain of Canadian economic theory, he postulated that electronic media were transforming us from a society that processed information in a linear and sequential manner to one that processed information in a multidemensional and holistic manner. From this he further postulated that we would begin to relate to each other in a tribalistic global village manner. This lead to the concusion that we were headed for a return to the 19th Century norm of media that made no attempt to be objective but simply interacted with their part of the global village in manner not too dissimilar to a story teller sitting around the tribal council circle. I believe we have now essentially arrived at that point.

It might be instructive for some here to read up on the history of the Associated Press, and why the concept of ďobjective journalismĒ was developed in the first place. This is part of journalism history thatís often overlooked and is very interesting. The rationale for ďobjective reportingĒ youíll discover was not what you probably think it was.


Found some different things on the rationale for objective reporting. Iím not sure I understand it completely. Would be nice if you elaborated on it.


See: http://www.mheducation.co.uk/openup/chapters/0335210732.pdf

Relevant material on p. 18, starting at the top of the page.


Got Frank . . . Got Dreams!
Got Saul . . . and dreams of basketball glory!

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

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DelBobcat
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Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,093

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 9:30:18 AM 
As we continue to devolved into authoritarianism our president (little p) rescinds the Philadelphia Eagles' invitation to the White House to distract from the fact that his lawyer went on national TV and said that Trump had the right to shoot someone and not be prosecuted.

You can't make this up folks. Welcome to America in 2018.


BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

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OhioCatFan
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Location: Athens, OH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 11:33:36 AM 
Del,

I believe the implication here was that he couldn't be prosecuted criminally until he was impeached and thrown out of office by the Senate. If he shot someone in an act that wasn't self-defense, I believe he'd be thrown out of office very quickly and then he would be subject to criminal prosecution. There is a strong belief by many Constitutional scholars that the president as head of the Executive Branch, a co-equal branch of the Federal government, is not subject to control by the other two branches of government except as provided by the Constitution. There are, to be fair, other Constitutional scholars who argue otherwise, but my point is that this line of thought is nothing new, nothing unique to Trump or his lawyers.


Got Frank . . . Got Dreams!
Got Saul . . . and dreams of basketball glory!

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 861

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 11:53:17 AM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
Del,

I believe the implication here was that he couldn't be prosecuted criminally until he was impeached and thrown out of office by the Senate. If he shot someone in an act that wasn't self-defense, I believe he'd be thrown out of office very quickly and then he would be subject to criminal prosecution. There is a strong belief by many Constitutional scholars that the president as head of the Executive Branch, a co-equal branch of the Federal government, is not subject to control by the other two branches of government except as provided by the Constitution. There are, to be fair, other Constitutional scholars who argue otherwise, but my point is that this line of thought is nothing new, nothing unique to Trump or his lawyers.


Agreed. I think the more telling statement he keeps making is about his ability to pardon himself, which there doesn't seem to be a legal argument supporting.

P.S. You should be floating in the Mediterranean right now, not talking to us idiots.

Last Edited: 6/5/2018 11:54:01 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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OhioCatFan
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Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 9,460

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 12:02:30 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
OhioCatFan wrote:
Del,

I believe the implication here was that he couldn't be prosecuted criminally until he was impeached and thrown out of office by the Senate. If he shot someone in an act that wasn't self-defense, I believe he'd be thrown out of office very quickly and then he would be subject to criminal prosecution. There is a strong belief by many Constitutional scholars that the president as head of the Executive Branch, a co-equal branch of the Federal government, is not subject to control by the other two branches of government except as provided by the Constitution. There are, to be fair, other Constitutional scholars who argue otherwise, but my point is that this line of thought is nothing new, nothing unique to Trump or his lawyers.


Agreed. I think the more telling statement he keeps making is about his ability to pardon himself, which there doesn't seem to be a legal argument supporting.

P.S. You should be floating in the Mediterranean right now, not talking to us idiots.


There are idiots here on the French Riviera, where we are now. Just pulling up anchor and on to Monte Carlo tomorrow. I can talk to idiots in two locations at one time. Who says men can't multitask! ;-). Agree about pardoning oneself. I don't think that would pass Constitutional muster with any legal scholar.


Got Frank . . . Got Dreams!
Got Saul . . . and dreams of basketball glory!

"It is better to be an optimist and be proven a fool than to be a pessimist and be proven right."

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DelBobcat
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Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,093

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 1:39:08 PM 
OhioCatFan wrote:
Del,

I believe the implication here was that he couldn't be prosecuted criminally until he was impeached and thrown out of office by the Senate. If he shot someone in an act that wasn't self-defense, I believe he'd be thrown out of office very quickly and then he would be subject to criminal prosecution. There is a strong belief by many Constitutional scholars that the president as head of the Executive Branch, a co-equal branch of the Federal government, is not subject to control by the other two branches of government except as provided by the Constitution. There are, to be fair, other Constitutional scholars who argue otherwise, but my point is that this line of thought is nothing new, nothing unique to Trump or his lawyers.


OCF, the fact that this has to be said by the president's lawyer is insane. The fact that it is the discussion we are having right now is mind blowing. Could you imagine if, in defense of his client, an Obama attorney had made the same argument? This line of thinking may not be new, but we've never had to actually think about it before except in purely academic terms. Now it's our reality.

And I don't actually agree that he'd be thrown out of office quickly. There is at least a subset of GOP elected officials that would be willing to let him get away with just about anything. I don't know how many would jump off the Trump train if he was demonstrated to be an actual murderer but, sadly, I'm not confident that it's enough to get him impeached and removed from office.


BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

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rpbobcat
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Member Since: 4/28/2006
Location: Rochelle Park, NJ
Post Count: 1,975

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 3:58:57 PM 
As a history buff,I find the whole discussion of Presidential pardons fascinating.

Under the Constitution a President's power to pardon is absolute.
"he shall have the Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for offenses against the United States,except in the Cases of Impeachment".

Personally,I think if there was a criminal issue against any President he would be impeached and removed from office,before he was charged.

With Nixon,the pardon given by President Ford was for crimes he "might" have committed.

So the next question is whether,under the Constitution, can you issue a "preemptive" pardon to someone,including yourself.

In fact,as I recall,Nixon pardoning himself, and then resigning, was one of the options discussed at the time.




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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 9:22:36 PM 
DelBobcat wrote:
As we continue to devolved into authoritarianism our president (little p) rescinds the Philadelphia Eagles' invitation to the White House


Let's call a spade a spade here. Not only did he rescind their invitation, he lied about why they decided to come and tied it directly to kneeling during the national anthem, which no Eagle has actually done. Just more red meat for his base.

Last Edited: 6/5/2018 9:25:11 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 10:02:15 PM 
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.

Last Edited: 6/5/2018 10:04:56 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/5/2018 11:04:07 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.

Maybe if the media provided a better platform for debate we would never have this terrible president or the several terrible ones before him. He is a symptom of a greater problem and if people donít realize that, we will continue to elect bad leaders.

Last Edited: 6/5/2018 11:05:03 PM by TheBobcatBandit

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DelBobcat
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Location: Cincinnati, OH
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 9:32:34 AM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.


BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 9:46:50 AM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.

Maybe if the media provided a better platform for debate we would never have this terrible president or the several terrible ones before him. He is a symptom of a greater problem and if people donít realize that, we will continue to elect bad leaders.


Man is your reading comprehension terrible.

But you've really staked some impressively non-sensical moral high ground here. You've decided that it's the media's fault we elected a terrible President and therefore you're going to use said terrible President's rallying cry of "fake news" to show your displeasure with the media in the exact way the President wants you to. Strong reasoning there.

It should be super clear by now to anybody reading this why the problem is less with the media and more with the populace. You're exhibit A.

Last Edited: 6/6/2018 10:06:00 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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TheBobcatBandit
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 11:43:43 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.

Maybe if the media provided a better platform for debate we would never have this terrible president or the several terrible ones before him. He is a symptom of a greater problem and if people donít realize that, we will continue to elect bad leaders.


Man is your reading comprehension terrible.

But you've really staked some impressively non-sensical moral high ground here. You've decided that it's the media's fault we elected a terrible President and therefore you're going to use said terrible President's rallying cry of "fake news" to show your displeasure with the media in the exact way the President wants you to. Strong reasoning there.

It should be super clear by now to anybody reading this why the problem is less with the media and more with the populace. You're exhibit A.


Ok

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 12:53:31 PM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.

Maybe if the media provided a better platform for debate we would never have this terrible president or the several terrible ones before him. He is a symptom of a greater problem and if people donít realize that, we will continue to elect bad leaders.


Man is your reading comprehension terrible.

But you've really staked some impressively non-sensical moral high ground here. You've decided that it's the media's fault we elected a terrible President and therefore you're going to use said terrible President's rallying cry of "fake news" to show your displeasure with the media in the exact way the President wants you to. Strong reasoning there.

It should be super clear by now to anybody reading this why the problem is less with the media and more with the populace. You're exhibit A.


Ok



Hey man, your new poll just further indicated that you can't read. You don't even understand the conversation that's being had here. As soon as anybody introduces any nuance to the discussion, you immediately revert back to a simplified, black and white bad vs. good, true vs. fake narrative because you get confused. Now we're grading the media, even though the conversation here's been about the extent to which the media's to blame and what solutions there are to offer.

So in sum: your reading comprehension's really bad. I especially liked the time you didn't realize that you copy and pasted a link to another article and yelled "Fake News!!!!!!!!" at the WaPo author for bringing up Colin Kaepernick in an article about tax policy. A+ reading there, man.

Last Edited: 6/6/2018 12:59:16 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
Post Count: 532

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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 4:27:48 PM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.

Maybe if the media provided a better platform for debate we would never have this terrible president or the several terrible ones before him. He is a symptom of a greater problem and if people donít realize that, we will continue to elect bad leaders.


Man is your reading comprehension terrible.

But you've really staked some impressively non-sensical moral high ground here. You've decided that it's the media's fault we elected a terrible President and therefore you're going to use said terrible President's rallying cry of "fake news" to show your displeasure with the media in the exact way the President wants you to. Strong reasoning there.

It should be super clear by now to anybody reading this why the problem is less with the media and more with the populace. You're exhibit A.


Ok



Hey man, your new poll just further indicated that you can't read. You don't even understand the conversation that's being had here. As soon as anybody introduces any nuance to the discussion, you immediately revert back to a simplified, black and white bad vs. good, true vs. fake narrative because you get confused. Now we're grading the media, even though the conversation here's been about the extent to which the media's to blame and what solutions there are to offer.

So in sum: your reading comprehension's really bad. I especially liked the time you didn't realize that you copy and pasted a link to another article and yelled "Fake News!!!!!!!!" at the WaPo author for bringing up Colin Kaepernick in an article about tax policy. A+ reading there, man.


I have no respect for your intelligence. You think that a potential economic collapse in the near future has nothing to do with how well our economy is doing right now. So you should be looking in the mirror when youíre attacking someoneís intelligence.

My point with Kaepernick is that his protest has nothing to do with how we conduct tax policy. That is a completely separate issue and if you donít understand that then your reading comprehension is terrible.

Iím not sure if the poll is still up but it would be interesting to see how the people view the mediaís coverage of politics. You blame the people for trump, I wonder how much the people blame the media for him and our current political climate.

I like how you donít see any correlation between grading the media and the extent to which the media is to blame. Also isnít it important to see how well the media is doing so if people donít think theyíre doing well, we can focus on some solutions to be made towards media.



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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 4:40:17 PM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:

I have no respect for your intelligence. You think that a potential economic collapse in the near future has nothing to do with how well our economy is doing right now. So you should be looking in the mirror when youíre attacking someoneís intelligence.


My point is really simple. You keep avoiding it. That the economy now has structural issues and the potential to collapse does not make it worse than an economy which is collapsed. You said you could argue that the economy in 2008 was better than it is right now. You haven't made that argument. You haven't even tried. You're welcome to. Knock yourself out.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

My point with Kaepernick is that his protest has nothing to do with how we conduct tax policy. That is a completely separate issue and if you donít understand that then your reading comprehension is terrible.


And it was a really good point. I totally agree with it. It's just that the author never mentioned Kaepernick in the article you "destroyed."

You accidentally copy and pasted an unrelated link and mistook it for part of the article you understood super well and destroyed. Always a sign of strong reading comprehension when you can't recognize that an unrelated headline is out of place. And that's been explained to you twice and you still don't understand.

Presumably because your reading comprehension is. . .bad.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

Iím not sure if the poll is still up but it would be interesting to see how the people view the mediaís coverage of politics. You blame the people for trump, I wonder how much the people blame the media for him and our current political climate.


The poll was taken down. There were two votes. An A and a B. I gave them the B.

Also, I provided a few things that I think contributed to Trump. I think there are literally thousands of causes, as I've said. I don't think you can narrow in on any one factor. The media played a role -- you and I just disagree on the extent of it. We also disagree on how much personal responsibility people have to identify strong sources of news to help inform their opinions.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

I like how you donít see any correlation between grading the media and the extent to which the media is to blame. Also isnít it important to see how well the media is doing so if people donít think theyíre doing well, we can focus on some solutions to be made towards media.


This is fair. You're right -- grading the media would be a good way to take the pulse here. But I think the poll accepts as true your assertion that the media's the main culprit and there needs to be a solution specific to the media. I don't think you've done anything to prove that's the case, outside of valid critiques of cable news. But as I demonstrated, cable news is a relatively small medium.

The overarching point I'm making is pretty simple, honestly. If you want the media to improve, you shouldn't align yourself (even unintentionally) with the President who is attacking credible sources and stories specifically to avoid reckoning with proven facts. You are part of the problem. Your actions are working against the solution you're hoping for. It's a super simple, non-controversial point that nobody here but you has disagreed with.

You really want me to be making the point that the media's perfect and deserve no criticism. I haven't made that point. That you think I have is, I think, because you have. . .poor reading comprehension.

Last Edited: 6/6/2018 4:56:10 PM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame

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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
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  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 4:48:22 PM 
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.



This is just one section of the article that is fake.

The article writes ďWith every critism lobbed at a journalist(or scientist), Musk reinforces the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by the Donald Trump wing of the GOP.

Thatís fake news. How does his critism of a science article reinforce that? He is a scientist, isnít he qualified to criticize science. What if he just had issue with the science in the article and disagreed with it? How does doing that equate to enforcing the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by Donald Trump.

It doesnít at all. Itís qualified critism. I guess only journalist now are allowed to criticize people.

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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
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Member Since: 7/30/2010
Post Count: 861

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/6/2018 5:13:26 PM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.



This is just one section of the article that is fake.

The article writes ďWith every critism lobbed at a journalist(or scientist), Musk reinforces the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by the Donald Trump wing of the GOP.

Thatís fake news. How does his critism of a science article reinforce that? He is a scientist, isnít he qualified to criticize science. What if he just had issue with the science in the article and disagreed with it? How does doing that equate to enforcing the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by Donald Trump.

It doesnít at all. Itís qualified critism. I guess only journalist now are allowed to criticize people.



Which science article did he criticize?

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DelBobcat
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Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,093

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/7/2018 3:04:48 PM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.



This is just one section of the article that is fake.

The article writes ďWith every critism lobbed at a journalist(or scientist), Musk reinforces the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by the Donald Trump wing of the GOP.

Thatís fake news. How does his critism of a science article reinforce that? He is a scientist, isnít he qualified to criticize science. What if he just had issue with the science in the article and disagreed with it? How does doing that equate to enforcing the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by Donald Trump.

It doesnít at all. Itís qualified critism. I guess only journalist now are allowed to criticize people.



I'm not sure calling a scientist's work "bs" is good criticism without elaborating on why it is "bs". As far as I know, he never made an argument why. He just attacked her on Twitter.

Also, a minor point, but Musk is not a scientist. He is an entrepreneur, an engineer, an investor, etc. He's many things, but a scientist is not one of them.

That's not to say that I think you need to be a scientist to criticize science. It's just that his criticism amounts to yelling "FAKE NEWS!!!" on Twitter, and that's not really productive, now is it? If he published an article laying out all the thoughtful reasons that he thought a scientist's (or a journalist's) work deserved criticism then maybe I'd take him seriously.

Last Edited: 6/7/2018 3:05:46 PM by DelBobcat


BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
Post Count: 532

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/11/2018 11:25:14 AM 
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.



This is just one section of the article that is fake.

The article writes ďWith every critism lobbed at a journalist(or scientist), Musk reinforces the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by the Donald Trump wing of the GOP.

Thatís fake news. How does his critism of a science article reinforce that? He is a scientist, isnít he qualified to criticize science. What if he just had issue with the science in the article and disagreed with it? How does doing that equate to enforcing the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by Donald Trump.

It doesnít at all. Itís qualified critism. I guess only journalist now are allowed to criticize people.



I'm not sure calling a scientist's work "bs" is good criticism without elaborating on why it is "bs". As far as I know, he never made an argument why. He just attacked her on Twitter.

Also, a minor point, but Musk is not a scientist. He is an entrepreneur, an engineer, an investor, etc. He's many things, but a scientist is not one of them.

That's not to say that I think you need to be a scientist to criticize science. It's just that his criticism amounts to yelling "FAKE NEWS!!!" on Twitter, and that's not really productive, now is it? If he published an article laying out all the thoughtful reasons that he thought a scientist's (or a journalist's) work deserved criticism then maybe I'd take him seriously.



He owns a company that builds rocket ships....
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TheBobcatBandit
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Member Since: 8/25/2013
Post Count: 532

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/11/2018 11:42:11 AM 
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:

I have no respect for your intelligence. You think that a potential economic collapse in the near future has nothing to do with how well our economy is doing right now. So you should be looking in the mirror when youíre attacking someoneís intelligence.


My point is really simple. You keep avoiding it. That the economy now has structural issues and the potential to collapse does not make it worse than an economy which is collapsed. You said you could argue that the economy in 2008 was better than it is right now. You haven't made that argument. You haven't even tried. You're welcome to. Knock yourself out.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

My point with Kaepernick is that his protest has nothing to do with how we conduct tax policy. That is a completely separate issue and if you donít understand that then your reading comprehension is terrible.


And it was a really good point. I totally agree with it. It's just that the author never mentioned Kaepernick in the article you "destroyed."

You accidentally copy and pasted an unrelated link and mistook it for part of the article you understood super well and destroyed. Always a sign of strong reading comprehension when you can't recognize that an unrelated headline is out of place. And that's been explained to you twice and you still don't understand.

Presumably because your reading comprehension is. . .bad.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

Iím not sure if the poll is still up but it would be interesting to see how the people view the mediaís coverage of politics. You blame the people for trump, I wonder how much the people blame the media for him and our current political climate.


The poll was taken down. There were two votes. An A and a B. I gave them the B.

Also, I provided a few things that I think contributed to Trump. I think there are literally thousands of causes, as I've said. I don't think you can narrow in on any one factor. The media played a role -- you and I just disagree on the extent of it. We also disagree on how much personal responsibility people have to identify strong sources of news to help inform their opinions.

TheBobcatBandit wrote:

I like how you donít see any correlation between grading the media and the extent to which the media is to blame. Also isnít it important to see how well the media is doing so if people donít think theyíre doing well, we can focus on some solutions to be made towards media.


This is fair. You're right -- grading the media would be a good way to take the pulse here. But I think the poll accepts as true your assertion that the media's the main culprit and there needs to be a solution specific to the media. I don't think you've done anything to prove that's the case, outside of valid critiques of cable news. But as I demonstrated, cable news is a relatively small medium.

The overarching point I'm making is pretty simple, honestly. If you want the media to improve, you shouldn't align yourself (even unintentionally) with the President who is attacking credible sources and stories specifically to avoid reckoning with proven facts. You are part of the problem. Your actions are working against the solution you're hoping for. It's a super simple, non-controversial point that nobody here but you has disagreed with.

You really want me to be making the point that the media's perfect and deserve no criticism. I haven't made that point. That you think I have is, I think, because you have. . .poor reading comprehension.




Thatís funny I didnít even realize that about kaepernick. My bad lol.

As far as the economy goes it doesnít matter that it isnít collapsed. Thatís not what makes it worse. Just because an economy isnít collapsed doesnít mean it is better. That is because the only reason the economy isnít collapsed is because money is being kept artificially low which is inflating all of these different bubbles in the economy. Now what happens when those bubbles collapse? The economy is going to be in terrible shape. So I would say it is worse than 2008 because there are more bubbles which will lead to a bigger collapse, and we never fixed the problems from 2008. So this idea that the economy is better than it was in 2008 is wrong. Just because a bubble hasnít burst doesnít mean itís not there, and if there are bubbles then the economy isn't all itís cracked up to be.

I see what youíre saying with the media. I guess we just disagree on how much theyíre to blame. I donít blame people who search out information. The intent to find information is good, itís not their fault the entities out there giving the information are flawed.
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DelBobcat
General User



Member Since: 8/26/2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Post Count: 1,093

Status: Offline

  Message Not Read  RE: Housing-gate continues
   Posted: 6/11/2018 11:42:11 AM 
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
DelBobcat wrote:
TheBobcatBandit wrote:
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:
By the way, Donald Trump, the guy critical of fake news, is now peddling another ridiculous FBI conspiracy theory, one that's only been published, and has no sourcing, by Gateway Pundit. They took it from a Reddit thread about conspiracies.

To be clear, our President is now pushing blatant conspiracy theories with no factual basis because it provides political cover for the crimes of the Russia investigation. You know, the way perfectly innocent people do.


Excited for Bobcat Bandit to yell and scream about fake news like he does when a journalist points out that some of Elon Musk's followers are assholes.


Iíll yell fake news when someone falsely points out that Elon Musk is against science and is to blame because some of his followers are assholes.



It's not really worth saying it again, but that's not at all what the author wrote.



This is just one section of the article that is fake.

The article writes ďWith every critism lobbed at a journalist(or scientist), Musk reinforces the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by the Donald Trump wing of the GOP.

Thatís fake news. How does his critism of a science article reinforce that? He is a scientist, isnít he qualified to criticize science. What if he just had issue with the science in the article and disagreed with it? How does doing that equate to enforcing the growing public mistrust of essiential institutions seeded by Donald Trump.

It doesnít at all. Itís qualified critism. I guess only journalist now are allowed to criticize people.



I'm not sure calling a scientist's work "bs" is good criticism without elaborating on why it is "bs". As far as I know, he never made an argument why. He just attacked her on Twitter.

Also, a minor point, but Musk is not a scientist. He is an entrepreneur, an engineer, an investor, etc. He's many things, but a scientist is not one of them.

That's not to say that I think you need to be a scientist to criticize science. It's just that his criticism amounts to yelling "FAKE NEWS!!!" on Twitter, and that's not really productive, now is it? If he published an article laying out all the thoughtful reasons that he thought a scientist's (or a journalist's) work deserved criticism then maybe I'd take him seriously.



He owns a company that builds rocket ships....


Your point? He employs scientists. That doesn't make him a scientist.


BA OHIO 2010, BS OHIO 2010, MA Delaware 2012

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