Welcome Guest! Create an Account login email: password: remember me: BASKETBALL Latest News News Archive Schedule/Results Multi-Media Recruiting FOOTBALL Latest News News Archive Schedule/Results Multi-Media Recruiting MESSAGE BOARD Message Home - Ohio Basketball - Ohio Basketball Recruiting - The O Zone - Ohio Football - Ohio Football Recruiting - Ohio Volleyball - Ohio Baseball - Ohio Olympic Sports... - General OU Discussion... - Website Feedback... - Posting Policy Edit My Profile Private Messages Logout CHAT LINKS site searchwhere to watchcontact usabout usadvertise with ushelp Message Board BobcatAttack.com Message Board Ohio Basketball Topic:  Don't look now .... Topic:  Don't look now .... Author Message bshot44 General User Member Since: 2/12/2012 Post Count: 2,211 Status: Offline     Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/13/2020 12:45:22 PM  ... but our old friend John Groce and his Akron team picked up one vote in the AP poll this week. Not agreeing with it ... considering their resume is a nice 13-3 with losses on their best three games (Liberty, Louisville & WVU) and not much else. BUT .... he has Akron back at the top of the MAC for now. We'll see if it lasts this season. Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. I know that'll fire up some on here .... so let the cannons fire! Just found it interesting Back to Top OU_Country General User Member Since: 12/6/2005 Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County Post Count: 8,320 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/13/2020 12:57:15 PM  bshot44 wrote: ... but our old friend John Groce and his Akron team picked up one vote in the AP poll this week. Not agreeing with it ... considering their resume is a nice 13-3 with losses on their best three games (Liberty, Louisville & WVU) and not much else. BUT .... he has Akron back at the top of the MAC for now. We'll see if it lasts this season. Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. I know that'll fire up some on here .... so let the cannons fire! Just found it interesting I watched them crush Ball State on Friday night. The addition of Xeyrius Williams for them is HUGE. The other factor that helps them is the fact that most of the roster recruited by his staff have been JUCO's or transfers - so they're older and more physically mature. Back to Top GoCats105 General User Member Since: 1/31/2006 Location: Seattle, WA Post Count: 6,910 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/13/2020 1:50:13 PM  OU_Country wrote: bshot44 wrote: ... but our old friend John Groce and his Akron team picked up one vote in the AP poll this week. Not agreeing with it ... considering their resume is a nice 13-3 with losses on their best three games (Liberty, Louisville & WVU) and not much else. BUT .... he has Akron back at the top of the MAC for now. We'll see if it lasts this season. Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. I know that'll fire up some on here .... so let the cannons fire! Just found it interesting I watched them crush Ball State on Friday night. The addition of Xeyrius Williams for them is HUGE. The other factor that helps them is the fact that most of the roster recruited by his staff have been JUCO's or transfers - so they're older and more physically mature. The roster turnover is crazy. I don't even recognize some of the names on there or remember them being there last year. But just at a glance, it looks like they got some DUDES (athletically) on that team. Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,490 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/13/2020 2:49:15 PM  I was withholding judgement on them until we got a little ways into the MAC schedule. Their schedule out of conference wasn't all that impressive (their wins, anyway) and Groce historically struggles to win road games. They're off to a great start, for sure. I read on the Zippy board a while back about their win at Marshall as being "the best road win of the Groce era at Akron." That statement is pretty shocking, considering Marshall this year. Back to Top JSF General User Member Since: 1/29/2005 Location: Houston, TX Post Count: 6,335 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/14/2020 2:25:57 PM  bshot44 wrote: Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. Why not? "Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season. My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8 Back to Top Buckeye to Bobcat General User Member Since: 9/10/2013 Post Count: 1,776 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/14/2020 2:31:25 PM  Williams was a kid I liked coming out of high school. The fact that he walked from UD made him a commodity on the transfer market for MAC/Horizon teams. Akron got him and is proving why he will be in the hunt for 1st team all-MAC. Back to Top allen General User Member Since: 1/24/2006 Post Count: 4,630 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/14/2020 3:43:31 PM  Buckeye to Bobcat wrote: Williams was a kid I liked coming out of high school. The fact that he walked from UD made him a commodity on the transfer market for MAC/Horizon teams. Akron got him and is proving why he will be in the hunt for 1st team all-MAC. Akron can be dangerous, they have a glut of guards who have talent, but they are inconsistent. They can keep ANY game close because they are physical and play defense. They just got Mylar Dawson back who should have gotten major offers. If they get him and Reece going, look out. Groce installed the Ohio University recruiting strategy, he brought in heavy talent and added impact transfers and let them compete for playing time. If James Kinney stayed on the straight and narrow, we may have made the elite eight. Nobody despises to lose more than I do. That's got me into trouble over the years, but it also made a man of mediocre ability into a pretty good coach. Woody Hayes Back to Top bshot44 General User Member Since: 2/12/2012 Post Count: 2,211 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/15/2020 4:42:48 PM  JSF wrote: bshot44 wrote: Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. Why not? I guess ... it's your choice. But what he did at Ohio wasn't by accident ... and just because he was ultra-successful at Illinois (than again, who has since Bruce Weber took Bill Self's team to a title game) doesn't mean he forgot how to coach. He's a good coach and, if he chooses to stay in the MAC - which he didn't do in leaving Ohio - he could run this league for a long time, IMHO 23pt road win at NIU isn't too shabby last night. Last Edited: 1/15/2020 4:43:12 PM by bshot44 Back to Top GoCats105 General User Member Since: 1/31/2006 Location: Seattle, WA Post Count: 6,910 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/15/2020 5:12:14 PM  bshot44 wrote: JSF wrote: bshot44 wrote: Either way, you can't be surprised that's he again building a winner in the MAC. Why not? I guess ... it's your choice. But what he did at Ohio wasn't by accident ... and just because he was ultra-successful at Illinois (than again, who has since Bruce Weber took Bill Self's team to a title game) doesn't mean he forgot how to coach. He's a good coach and, if he chooses to stay in the MAC - which he didn't do in leaving Ohio - he could run this league for a long time, IMHO 23pt road win at NIU isn't too shabby last night. You could also argue that his success was built on the back of a solid team that had an all-timer of a PG pulling the strings for 4 years. Back to Top FearLeon General User Member Since: 3/12/2005 Post Count: 4,115 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/15/2020 6:29:21 PM  It was only a matter of time with Groce. Hopefully, Boals can do something similar in his 3rd year at the helm. #BleedGreen #TrentIsGOAT Back to Top JSF General User Member Since: 1/29/2005 Location: Houston, TX Post Count: 6,335 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 3:18:49 AM  Well, before this year, there wasn't any evidence he could succeed without leveraging his contacts from Ohio State. Given how badly the first two seasons went and how little support the school has for the program, it's not inappropriate to be skeptical. "Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season. My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8 Back to Top Andrew Ruck General User Member Since: 12/22/2004 Location: Columbus, OH Post Count: 4,694 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 9:09:16 AM  Congrats to coach Groce...his win this week brought his all-time MAC record to an even 52-52. #WinningRecordHereWeCome Andrew Ruck B.B.A. 2003 Back to Top 100%Cat General User Member Since: 1/17/2013 Post Count: 2,490 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 9:48:47 AM  They're definitely hot right now. I haven't seen Kent play yet but their loss at Miami was surprising. I'm not sure who else in the league right now you'd take over Akron. Back to Top bshot44 General User Member Since: 2/12/2012 Post Count: 2,211 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 11:18:24 AM  I see there are still plenty of skeptics .... and that's their prerogative And yes ... Groce's success was due in large part to DJ Cooper. But did Groce not bring Cooper and the surrounding cast to Athens? According to Rivals ... Cooper was only offered by Kent and Loyola. https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2009/d-j-cooper-42627 Offutt, Smith, Hall, Baltic, Kellogg, Taylor, Keely, Rico Johnson ... all those were Groce recruits. That was one helluva ensemble in 2012. The '10 team did have a lot of O'Shea holdovers ... but to win a game in the NCAA tourney at the MAC level is nothing to scoff at ... regardless. Ask Keith Dambrot ... oh, wait. He's never won one of those games ... 0-3 in 13 years at UA. I'm not sure if it's bitterness that he left Athens or what it is ... And yes, Groce wasn't super successful at Illinois. He took a program that had grown pretty stale under Bruce Weber and immediately took them to the NCAA tourney and won a game in his first year. Granted, they never got back in the four years following ... but what Groce did at Illinois isn't all that unfamiliar for the Illini. They hadn't been nationally or even B1G-relevant since 2005 when they went to the Final Four. Weber only got them out of the first round twice after that '05 run. Brad Underwood is three years and he might squeeze them into the tourney this year for the first time. So let's now act like he ran Illinois basketball into the ground. He didn't win at a level that warranted a contract extension ... but it wasn't like he Bill Callahan'd the program like Callahan did for Nebraska football. My point was simply that Akron is having a strong season ... and earned a Top 25 vote (something that is quite rare for MAC basketball teams) ... and with this being Groce's third year, I'm not surprised the Zips are among the best in the league and looked primed to make a serious run at the league title this year and a return to the NCAAs. I'm not sure just any coach could've walked into that place and done what Groce has done thus far. Dambrot was a good coach and did things at Akron that no coach had ever done there since they joined the MAC. Hell, the program only had 3 winning MAC seasons in their first 12 years in the league. Dambrot had 13 straight winning seasons in his 13 years there. Very impressive. Groce is in year three and appears to have his thumbprint firmly on the program and they're seeing results. I wouldn't be surprised (assuming he's committed) that this is what we can expect for years to come at UA. And I fully believe that in a year or two we'll be seeing similarities in results here in Athens with Jeff Boals. It's a process and I'm on board for the long haul ... hope Boals is as well. If he and Groce remain in the MAC along with Senderhoff at Kent ... I think the MAC East is in good hands for a while. Back to Top El Gato Roberto General User Member Since: 12/20/2004 Location: Illinois Post Count: 1,070 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 11:21:57 AM  bshot44 wrote: I see there are still plenty of skeptics .... and that's their prerogative And yes ... Groce's success was due in large part to DJ Cooper. But did Groce not bring Cooper and the surrounding cast to Athens? According to Rivals ... Cooper was only offered by Kent and Loyola. https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2009/d-j-cooper-42627 Offutt, Smith, Hall, Baltic, Kellogg, Taylor, Keely, Rico Johnson ... all those were Groce recruits. That was one helluva ensemble in 2012. The '10 team did have a lot of O'Shea holdovers ... but to win a game in the NCAA tourney at the MAC level is nothing to scoff at ... regardless. Ask Keith Dambrot ... oh, wait. He's never won one of those games ... 0-3 in 13 years at UA. I'm not sure if it's bitterness that he left Athens or what it is ... And yes, Groce wasn't super successful at Illinois. He took a program that had grown pretty stale under Bruce Weber and immediately took them to the NCAA tourney and won a game in his first year. Granted, they never got back in the four years following ... but what Groce did at Illinois isn't all that unfamiliar for the Illini. They hadn't been nationally or even B1G-relevant since 2005 when they went to the Final Four. Weber only got them out of the first round twice after that '05 run. Brad Underwood is three years and he might squeeze them into the tourney this year for the first time. So let's now act like he ran Illinois basketball into the ground. He didn't win at a level that warranted a contract extension ... but it wasn't like he Bill Callahan'd the program like Callahan did for Nebraska football. My point was simply that Akron is having a strong season ... and earned a Top 25 vote (something that is quite rare for MAC basketball teams) ... and with this being Groce's third year, I'm not surprised the Zips are among the best in the league and looked primed to make a serious run at the league title this year and a return to the NCAAs. I'm not sure just any coach could've walked into that place and done what Groce has done thus far. Dambrot was a good coach and did things at Akron that no coach had ever done there since they joined the MAC. Hell, the program only had 3 winning MAC seasons in their first 12 years in the league. Dambrot had 13 straight winning seasons in his 13 years there. Very impressive. Groce is in year three and appears to have his thumbprint firmly on the program and they're seeing results. I wouldn't be surprised (assuming he's committed) that this is what we can expect for years to come at UA. And I fully believe that in a year or two we'll be seeing similarities in results here in Athens with Jeff Boals. It's a process and I'm on board for the long haul ... hope Boals is as well. If he and Groce remain in the MAC along with Senderhoff at Kent ... I think the MAC East is in good hands for a while. Totally agree. "The name's Ohio University, but everybody calls me Ohio. Any of you guys call me Ohio U, and I'll kill you." Back to Top Mark Lembright '85 General User Member Since: 8/22/2010 Location: Highland Heights, OH Post Count: 2,447 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 12:36:45 PM  I just don't understand the animosity or disdain for a coach that took Ohio to the brink of the Elite 8 against the No.1 ranked team in the country. That being said, if first impressions are anything, I think Boals has the potential to give Groce, Akron, and the rest of the MAC all they can handle and then some! Back to Top OU_Country General User Member Since: 12/6/2005 Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County Post Count: 8,320 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 12:52:28 PM  bshot44 wrote: My point was simply that Akron is having a strong season ... and earned a Top 25 vote (something that is quite rare for MAC basketball teams) ... I wonder whose vote that was? Elton? ;) Because I can't see a way that this Zips team is top-25 caliber. The NET would seem to say Top 40 or 50. http://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2020/schedule/Akron Back to Top OU_Country General User Member Since: 12/6/2005 Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County Post Count: 8,320 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 12:55:17 PM  Mark Lembright '85 wrote: I just don't understand the animosity or disdain for a coach that took Ohio to the brink of the Elite 8 against the No.1 ranked team in the country. I don't have animosity, but I will say that I fully expect that in the next two summers, I expect him to end up elsewhere with a higher paying gig. Back to Top CatsUp General User Member Since: 4/15/2019 Post Count: 730 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 1:31:46 PM  OU_Country wrote: bshot44 wrote: My point was simply that Akron is having a strong season ... and earned a Top 25 vote (something that is quite rare for MAC basketball teams) ... I wonder whose vote that was? Elton? ;) Because I can't see a way that this Zips team is top-25 caliber. The NET would seem to say Top 40 or 50. http://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2020/schedule/Akron Maybe the voter’s thinking was his vote, perhaps the only one for the Zips, would put them about (tied for 47) where you are suggesting. I don’t know if that’s the thought process they are supposed to use but maybe that was what the voter used. Back to Top Andrew Ruck General User Member Since: 12/22/2004 Location: Columbus, OH Post Count: 4,694 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 2:13:17 PM  bshot44 wrote: I'm not sure if it's bitterness that he left Athens or what it is ... I will tell you exactly what it is...It isn't that anyone is bitter, or that anyone dislikes coach Groce...and isn't grateful for the amazing 2010 & 2012 runs. It is that some fans elevate him to God status because of one single 2 week period in March 2012, and at times have done so while shitting on the current coach. So some of us feel some reminders of his resume are needed. As mentioned, he is 52-52 in the MAC regular season. Yes 11-4 in the MAC Tourney. What if Tommy Freeman doesn't bury that 3 in the 1st round in 2010 to force OT? What if Brian Walsh makes the jumpshot in the 2012 championship? Then you have a 52-52 regular season coach and 6-6 MAC tourney coach with no NCAA appearances. He is literally 2 inches from that resume. I'm not saying he isn't a force to be reckoned with in the MAC. He very well may have sustained success. But if he does, it will be for the first time in his coaching career. Andrew Ruck B.B.A. 2003 Back to Top JSF General User Member Since: 1/29/2005 Location: Houston, TX Post Count: 6,335 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 2:36:33 PM  Mark Lembright '85 wrote: I just don't understand the animosity or disdain for a coach that took Ohio to the brink of the Elite 8 against the No.1 ranked team in the country. Citation needed. "Loyalty to a hometown or city is fleeting and interchangeable, but college is a stamp of identity."- Kyle Whelliston, One Beautiful Season. My blog about depression and mental illness: https://bit.ly/3buGXH8 Back to Top Bobcat1996 General User Member Since: 1/2/2017 Post Count: 794 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 3:37:32 PM  JG got it done at Ohio by winning the league tournament. He was a 9 seed one year and a three seed another season. He benefited from getting a second chance in the league tournament. Taking nothing away from John, but his teams got hot for a few games in March. Good for him and the Bobcats, but he was four games above .500 in the MAC regular season at Ohio. Not terrible that is for certain, but not great. His team this season is good and should be one of the favorites to win in Cleveland. Back to Top OU_Country General User Member Since: 12/6/2005 Location: On the road between Athens and Madison County Post Count: 8,320 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 4:16:42 PM  Andrew Ruck wrote: bshot44 wrote: I'm not sure if it's bitterness that he left Athens or what it is ... I will tell you exactly what it is...It isn't that anyone is bitter, or that anyone dislikes coach Groce...and isn't grateful for the amazing 2010 & 2012 runs. It is that some fans elevate him to God status because of one single 2 week period in March 2012, and at times have done so while shitting on the current coach. So some of us feel some reminders of his resume are needed. As mentioned, he is 52-52 in the MAC regular season. Yes 11-4 in the MAC Tourney. What if Tommy Freeman doesn't bury that 3 in the 1st round in 2010 to force OT? What if Brian Walsh makes the jumpshot in the 2012 championship? Then you have a 52-52 regular season coach and 6-6 MAC tourney coach with no NCAA appearances. He is literally 2 inches from that resume. I'm not saying he isn't a force to be reckoned with in the MAC. He very well may have sustained success. But if he does, it will be for the first time in his coaching career. In my mind, this is almost perfectly said. I loved the guy when he was here, and damn was the stretch from November 2011 to March 2013 incredible fun -- BUT, those are facts. 2009-2010 was lightning in a bottle, 2010-2011 was a massive let down, and people were calling for his job, if I recall. Also, if those two things go the way you mention Andrew, it's entirely possible he's still in Athens today. Back to Top ytownbobcat General User Member Since: 8/7/2006 Post Count: 1,253 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 5:42:58 PM  He has PJ Fleck sideline presence. Back to Top BobcatWarrior General User Member Since: 11/4/2010 Post Count: 32 Status: Offline     RE: Don't look now ....    Posted: 1/16/2020 8:07:48 PM  I have no bitterness toward Groce...just regret. I believe that we had caught lightning in a bottle with the NCAA runs and were poised for some sustainability (strong performances OOC, regular season championships, and tournament championships). With Groce's upcoming recruiting class before he left (I believe it was Ibi Watson, Caris Lavert, Evan Bradds, Maverick Morgan, etc.), I thought the chance was there for the beginning of something special. I believe many mid-major coaches jump too early at the "big job". They have a bit of success and/or make a run and then they leave. Why not build on that success/run and use it to bring in a "higher-level" recruit at your current school. Then, with sustained success, you can then decide whether you can build a mid-major "power" at that school or leave for, potentially, a better job than the one you would have turned down after the initial success/run. I guess the regret is I felt Groce and OU had the potential for a great marriage. I pictured a mid-major power: a packed Convo, a rejuvenated student body and OZone, etc. Alas, sometimes I feel like a Cubs fan...wait until next year! 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